Spiritual Israel or Isrealites.

[jamie]

Satan confuses many, just like he confused Peter in the Garden of Gethsemane. Hes doin work.

When Peter was in the Garden of Gethsemane with Jesus he did not have God's Spirit.

Paul explained,"For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God." (1 Corinthians 2:11-12)

We cannot expect Simon Peter to know the things of God without God's Spirit.

 

[meshak]

I have been a Christian for over 30 years and a Preacher for 24 of those years.

It is like Mystery Babylon, 100 people profess to have the "Word of the Lord" but only God truly gives the understanding via the Holy Spirit. EXAMPLE: Mystery = Muterion or Secret by Gods Silence. In Rev. 17:7 The Angel asks John, Why did you Marvel/Wonder, I WILL SHOW YOU THE MYSTERY of the Woman that rides the Beast. So in verse 8-18 the Angels shows us the Mystery, yet we have Hundreds of theories and everyone still calls it a MYSTERY, even though God explained it to those of us who are paying attention.

Satan confuses many, just like he confused Peter in the Garden of Gethsemane. Hes doin work.

So you just dismiss Jesus' clear message?

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

So you just dismiss Jesus' clear message?

Like how you are confused on this matter?

Then why do you use the scripture to go against Jesus' word?

If you believed that Jesus is God, you would see this as Christ's judgment. You would see that He is honoring His promises and liberating Israel, despite the final condemnation and false witness the Sanhedrin brought to Him, according to His Will.

There would be much insight for you in paralleling Jesus' words in Matthew 23:37 with Deuteronomy 32:11-12

#John 10:30 cross referenced with Deuteronomy 6:4

Lastly..

#Isaiah 43:11 and

Romans 10:

8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart,” that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming:

9 that if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

Who's name sister?

10 For with your heart you believe and are justified, and with your mouth you confess and are saved.

11 It is just as the Scripture says: “Everyone who believes in Him will not be put to shame.” Jeremiah 17:7 (That's JHVH in Jeremiah)

12 For there is no difference between Jew and Greek: The same Lord is Lord of all, and is rich to all who call on Him,

13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Who's Name Saves Sister?

Sister, read this until you fully understand it, then look in verse 13 of Romans 10 in a New World Translation.

 

[meshak]

The dog in my avatar had both eyes removed because of an eye infection and he is deaf in both ears.

poor doggy, can he walk outside?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

No one sees hell. When the brain flatlines it no longer processes sensory inputs.

You have no idea what's in store after one leaves this world behind. The Spiritual realm is different than the physical. You're assuming that no on can have any of the senses after death. Yet, Hell is a place of eternal suffering. If one cannot feel the suffering then, there would not be any suffering. Therefore, the person who is cast into the Lake of Fire will, no doubt, feel the torment of their existence throughout eternity. Our human spirit lives within our physical body. Once the spirit leaves the body it will be perfectly aware of its environment, whether it is in Hades (A place where the unsaved are confined until The Judgement) or in Heaven with the Lord. In conclusion, it's our "spirit" that is kept within the shell of our body. When the body (shell) dies, the spirit lives on.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

You are absolutely correct. The physical nation of Israel was replaced by the Christian congregation because Israel failed to accept the Messiah---Jesus of Nazareth. How could they continue to be His special people when they refused to accept Jesus (the Son of God; the Messiah)? Jesus himself spoke about this reality:

"The kingdom of God will be taken away from you [the chief priests and elders] and given to a people producing the fruit of it." (Matthew 21:43, NASB)

"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!" (Matthew 23:37,38, NASB)


Then his disciples reiterated what Jesus had said.

"Simeon has related how God first concerned Himself about taking from among the Gentiles a people for His name." (Acts 15:14, NASB)

"There is neither Jew nor Greek...for you are ALL one person in union with Christ Jesus. Moreover, if you belong to Christ, you are really Abraham's seed, heirs with reference to a promise." (Galatians 3:28,29)

"Neither is circumcision anything nor is uncircumcision, but a new creation is something. All those who will walk orderly by this rule of conduct, upon them be peace and mercy, even upon the Israel of God." (Galatians 6:15,16) You will notice that Paul was referring to those who accepted the 'cross' of Christ (verses 12-14).

"YOU [the Christian congregation] are a 'chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for special possession, that you should declare abroad the excellencies' of the one that called you out of darkness into his wonderful light. For you were once not a people, but are now God's people." (I Peter 2:9,10)


Some people object to "replacement theology," but it is scripturally true and sound.

You're a "Jehovah Witness" and therefore lack Spiritual discernment.

 

[Epoisses]

You're a "Jehovah Witness" and therefore lack Spiritual discernment.

You just lack discernment and probably smell bad too!

 

[jamie]

poor doggy, can he walk outside?

The family has other dogs that guide him and protect him.

 

[jamie]

You have no idea what's in store after one leaves this world behind. The Spiritual realm is different than the physical. You're assuming that no on can have any of the senses after death. Yet, Hell is a place of eternal suffering. If one cannot feel the suffering then, there would not be any suffering. Therefore, the person who is cast into the Lake of Fire will, no doubt, feel the torment of their existence throughout eternity. Our human spirit lives within our physical body. Once the spirit leaves the body it will be perfectly aware of its environment, whether it is in Hades (A place where the unsaved are confined until The Judgement) or in Heaven with the Lord. In conclusion, it's our "spirit" that is kept within the shell of our body. When the body (shell) dies, the spirit lives on.

Did Jesus die spiritually or superficially?

 

[Rondonmonson]

Are your referring to these:

1) Seventh Day of Rest
2) Feast of Passover
3) Pentecost
4) Trumpets
5) Atonement
6) Feast of Tabernacles
7) Last Day

The wave sheaf presentation is not a holy day, it's a work day, the beginning of the grain harvest.

Jesus presented himself to the Father as the first of the firstfruits of the grain harvest. The wheat and tares will grow together until the feast of the firstfruits.

Not exactly, you will find the Seven Feasts in Leviticus 23, I will just paste the header of each from the NKJV and see if this was your reference.

Feasts of the Lord
23 And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 2 “Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: ‘The feasts of the Lord, which you shall proclaim to be holy convocations, these are My feasts.

The Sabbath
3 ‘Six days shall work be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest, a holy convocation. You shall do no work on it; it is the Sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.

The Passover and Unleavened Bread

The Feast of Firstfruits

The Feast of Weeks

The Feast of Trumpets

The Day of Atonement

The Feast of Tabernacles

44 So Moses declared to the children of Israel the feasts of the Lord.

So that is where my source comes from Leviticus 23.

God’s plan of salvation for mankind is summed up in these feasts, which were related to Israel's agricultural seasons, and therefore fall into three clusters. The Spring and Summer Feasts typify the inauguration of redemption, while the Fall Feasts its consummation.

“The first three feasts Passover, Unleavened Bread, and First Fruits occur in rapid succession in the spring of the year over a period of eight days. They came to be referred to collectively as "Passover."

The fourth feast, Harvest, occurs fifty days later, at the beginning of the summer. By New Testament times this feast had come to be known by its Greek name, Pentecost, a word meaning fifty.

The last three feasts Trumpets, Atonement, and Tabernacles extend over a period of twenty-one days in the fall of the year. They came to be known collectively as Tabernacles." (David Reagan)

The first four feasts have already been fulfilled, the first two by Jesus Christ on the actual feast days according to the Hebrew calendar... He was sacrificed on Passover, and resurrected on the Feast of First Fruits. The third Feast of Unleavened Bread carried great significance in light of His sacrifice, while the Fourth Feast Shavuot, or the Festival of Weeks was again fulfilled on the exact day on what we now call Pentecost.

While we certainly do not know exactly how the other three feasts will be fulfilled, it is perhaps reasonable to surmise that they will be fulfilled in the same manner… on the actual feast day.

So if that answers your question, I don't want to go into deep detail here in this thread, its about Spiritual Israel.

 

[Rondonmonson]

When Peter was in the Garden of Gethsemane with Jesus he did not have God's Spirit.

Paul explained,"For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God." (1 Corinthians 2:11-12)

We cannot expect Simon Peter to know the things of God without God's Spirit.

True, but not entirely true. Men did have the Holy Spirit before God came at times (See the Prophets) and if you were being groomed by the Master I assume the Holy Spirit was guiding the Disciples somewhat. Jesus was trying to teach them how to hear the voice of the Spirit and ignore the voice of Satan, REMEMBER, Jesus was God and Jesus himself told them, I will be taken, and crucified and rise again. Peter did not hear Jesus, he only heard Satan's voice. Jesus was with them daily.

 

[meshak]

True, but not entirely true. Men did have the Holy Spirit before God came at times (See the Prophets) and if you were being groomed by the Master I assume the Holy Spirit was guiding the Disciples somewhat. Jesus was trying to teach them how to hear the voice of the Spirit and ignore the voice of God, REMEMBER, Jesus was God and Jesus himself told them, I will be taken, and crucified and rise again. Peter did not hear Jesus, he only heard Satan's voice. Jesus was with them daily.

You have to go so far to deny Jesus' simple and clear word.

 

[meshak]

It is your desire to make our day bad

what's this have to do with OP?

what do you have to say about OP?

 

[Rondonmonson]

So you just dismiss Jesus' clear message?

I just think you misunderstand the passages there. I have been a Christian a long time and God shows me things yet to this day, where I have to put my pride in check, and say WOW, I had that all wrong. You see there is Holy Spirit revelation, and there is mans own logical conclusions that seem right at times, but then God might come along and poke us, HEY.......You know that idea you have had for 10 years ? Well you were wrong, here is the REAL DEAL. People with overt pride can't seem to ever be wrong.

EXAMPLE: About a year ago I wrote a blog, PUBLISHED it on the net, I laid it out perfectly why Rev. 17:18 was ROME, it had to be Rome !!! Had to be............Two months after I published this blog, God showed me/told me that it WAS NOT ROME. Hes like Ron, you were WRONG !! Then I saw how it was the VISION that the Angel was referring to, and the vision had what imprinted on the Woman's head ? BABYLON THE GREAT.

So it was Babylon after all, God put me back in my place....BUT...God did that for a reason, he wanted to show me something, but I had to be receptive to being wrong before He could show me this powerful new information. So I obeyed and started reading, rereading and researching. And BOOM I see it plain as day.

It hit me, God showed me as clear as day what Babylon was.

I was reading Rev. 16, and the 6th Vial is the False Prophet, Anti-Christ and Satan enticing/gathering the Kings of the East unto battle against Israel. They gather them to Meggido (Armageddon) and thus the Anti-Christ, 10 Kings (Europe) and the Kings of the East (Arab Nations imho) come against Israel. THEN I SEE WHAT GOD WAS TRYING SHOW ME IN THE 7TH VIAL..............

Rev. 17:19 And the great city was divided into three parts,(Jerusalem) and the cities of the nations fell: {Babylon} and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

So God sees these Nations that come against Israel AS BABYLON. It is not a City, it is not Jerusalem, Rome, the USA or NYC. It represents the nations that come against Israel. And there is a meaning behind this, but that's another thread.........The point is, you have to be willing to BE WRONG. We are just men/women, we are fallible, we must understand this and that way we can hear Gods voice. Its OK to be wrong about things from time to time.

 

[meshak]

Jesus' word of spiritual Israelites is not so complicated. you don't need so much explanation. It is self-explanatory.

It is a grave sin to change what clearly says in the Bible.

 

[meshak]

Rondonmonson,

I would like to add more of verses about Israelites I got from poster Northwhy:

He said in Romans 2: 28-29, "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29. But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

"Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?.........Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. 17. And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect..........But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29. And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. Galatians 3: 3, 16-17, 26-29

"For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
7. Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
8. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." Romans 9: 6-8

"For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:" Romans 11: 25-26

Christian Zionists, dispensationalists, separation theologians, make up their theology and then go looking through the New Testament trying to find texts which they think support that theology. This is their "Hermeneutic."

But the way the Bible itself says to interpret scripture is in Isaiah 28: 9-10: "Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
10. For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:"

We are to interpret scripture by putting relevant scripture together. Who Israel is in Romans 11: 26 depends on the scriptures quoted above.

Paul says in Romans 9: 6-8 that the children of the promise are the seed and are Israel, implying also that the elect of God are Israel. We add Galatians 3: 28 and Romans 10: 12 to Romans 9: 6-8 to understand that all the elect of God are one, in unity, not divided by one group from the bloodline and the other in the Church. We have here the answer of who Israel is in Romans 11: 26. There Paul tells us that all who are saved are Israel.

 

[meshak]

You see, above verses emphasize Jesus' word of OP.

 

[Eagles Wings]

You just lack discernment and probably smell bad too!

Oh boy, this gave me a chuckle. One of my baby grands said this to the other, and I could not keep back the laughter. Silly!

Of course, I had to correct the one for bad manners, per Grandparent's rule book.

 

[meshak]

Oh boy, this gave me a chuckle. One of my baby grands said this to the other, and I could not keep back the laughter. Silly!

Of course, I had to correct the one for bad manners, per Grandparent's rule book.

do you have anything to say about OP?

thanks.

 

[Eagles Wings]

do you have anything to say about OP?

thanks.

Nope, and I see others who don't always as well. Can't be perfect, Meshak, you're dealing with fallible humans.