Should voting be mandatory?

[rocketman]

Perhaps if people were obliged to vote they would pay more attention to the process. Perhaps if people were obliged to vote the politicians would pay more attention to them. After all, there's nothing a politician likes more than a citizen he can ignore.

Or perhaps not... do you have some information that you want to share that would prove that people would some how take an interest or is this just your opinion. It really is speculation on your part but, regardless people in the U.S. possess the freedom to stay uniformed, ignorant, and uninvolved in the political process, if that is their choice, than it is better that they do not vote anyway.

 

[chrysostom]

Did you imagine me to be a "whiny liberal" Chrys?

Wash your imagination out with soap!!

what you said is an insult to the many citizens who volunteer their time to make our voting system work

we are indebted to them

 

[PureX]

Or perhaps not... do you have some information that you want to share that would prove that people would some how take an interest or is this just your opinion. It really is speculation on your part but, regardless people in the U.S. possess the freedom to stay uniformed, ignorant, and uninvolved in the political process, if that is their choice than it is better that they do not vote anyway.

People will always be imperfect. Yet the Australians are mandated to vote, and they seem to be quite happy with that mandate. They also seem to be relatively well informed about their own government. So, although this is anecdotal evidence. It is some evidence. As opposed to just blindly assuming that changing the voting system will result in absolutely no change in the voting public involved in that system.

Doing nothing is still doing nothing, and will generally result in nothing being done. While doing something is doing something and will likely result in some sort of a change. And since the model we have appears viable … maybe it'd be worth a try. Because what we're doing now is slowly and inevitably dragging us toward a political disaster (and probably to an economic one, as well).

 

[Lighthouse]

If you are willing to sacrifice your freedom you don't deserve it. If you are willing to sacrifice for it then no one should ever have the strength to take it away.

 

[rocketman]

This is not about freedom, it's about the democratic process, which at this point is quickly becoming non-existent. If we do not mind that process, our "freedom" will quickly become an irrelevant concern.

Wrong! it is absolutely about freedom, the democratic process exists whether people choose to take part in it or not. Those that choose not to vote don't care what happens to begin with, do not care to have their voice in it.

If we want to protect what little freedom we have left, and perhaps gain some of it back before it's too late, we damn well better start minding our own political processes.

By force? that is not freedom...

And people who don't vote are undermining that. So in fact, not voting is not an expression of freedom, it's an expression of stupidity and irresponsibility, that hurts all of us.

So you assert that forcing people to vote will somehow translate into freedom, engagement, & non-stupidity? I think this is a mighty big stretch...

Also, if we're so worried about ignorant voters, why are we, ourselves, so ignorant? And why don't we find out what's going on and spread the word to those who don't know? And by finding out, I don't mean swallowing whatever propaganda suits us, I mean actively seek out information on important issues and events.

Good luck with that, if people don't get engaged/interested in the months prior to an election to get educated, what makes you think they will all the sudden make informed choices on election day? It just won't happen...

 

[1PeaceMaker]

what you said is an insult to the many citizens who volunteer their time to make our voting system work

we are indebted to them

Oh, are you claiming that our voting system works and is honest?

I don't insult those who keep them accountable, see my promotion of blackboxvoting.org !

 

[rocketman]

People will always be imperfect. Yet the Australians are mandated to vote, and they seem to be quite happy with that mandate. They also seem to be relatively well informed about their own government. So, although this is anecdotal evidence. It is some evidence. As opposed to just blindly assuming that changing the voting system will result in absolutely no change in the voting public involved in that system.

Doing nothing is still doing nothing, and will generally result in nothing being done. While doing something is doing something and will likely result in some sort of a change. And since the model we have appears viable … maybe it'd be worth a try. Because what we're doing now is slowly and inevitably dragging us toward a political disaster (and probably to an economic one, as well).

You have as much chance of changing the voting system to make it mandatory as you do changing the electoral college or any other part of the constitution as it relates to the vote. Personally, I don't see it to be any benefit adding the ignorant & uniformed to the process....no value added.

 

[Buzzword]

A fool is also someone who does nothing, and then imagines that he has done something.

I would respect not voting if those who do not vote would go to the polls and encourage others not to vote, in protest. But just sitting on your butt and doing nothing, and then claiming that you're doing something positive, is just plain lying to yourselves, and lying to the rest of us.

I do not have have never stated or implied that abstaining is "positive," and neither has anyone else who advocates it on this thread.

Abstaining as a result of laziness is foolish.
Abstaining because no available candidate represents me or mine, because the system is inherently flawed to a ludicrous degree, because the system is manipulated by people whose names are never reported and whose faces never pass in front of a camera, is simply acting as conscience demands.

I grew up being told to "vote as your conscience demands," and so I do not vote.

 

[rocketman]

so I do not vote.

Then you also waive the right to complain about who is running things and how they are running it.

 

[Buzzword]

Then you also waive the right to complain about who is running things and how they are running it.

Did you not read the rest of my post, or anything else I've posted on this thread?

In no way do I waive the right to complain about a broken system which does not present any candidates who actually represent me or my priorities, and which continues to delude the masses into thinking they actually have a choice in the matter.

Do you not act as your conscience demands?
Do you not encourage others to do so?

Do you not look to your own experiences when making decisions?
If your experience with voting was a straight line of disappointment, disillusionment, and generally being screwed over no matter who won, would you continue spinning your wheels expecting to get somewhere?

 

[elohiym]

I would respect not voting if those who do not vote would go to the polls and encourage others not to vote, in protest. But just sitting on your butt and doing nothing ...

What he is doing on this thread is akin to what you would respect him for doing at the polls.

 

[Rusha]

I will not dignify the voting process because it is not only fundamentally broken, it is run by thieves who stole our government and now want to force us to pretend we run it

While I don't believe anyone should be required to vote, those who shrug their shoulders and don't wish to voice their concerns and preferences by voting, get exactly the system they deserve.

 

[elohiym]

While I don't believe anyone should be required to vote, those who shrug their shoulders and don't wish to voice their concerns and preferences by voting, get exactly the system they deserve.

Do you get a system you don't deserve by voting?

I'm looking to get the system I deserve.

 

[Rusha]

Do you get a system you don't deserve by voting?

:chuckle: I see what you are *trying* to do there. The difference with voters as compared to those who stick their heads in the sand and pull it out long enough to complain is that voters have actually earned the right to complain.

 

[elohiym]

:chuckle: I see what you are *trying* to do there. The difference with voters as compared to those who stick their heads in the sand and pull it out long enough to complain is that voters have actually earned the right to complain.

This idea that we earn rights through voting is new to me. Perhaps you can elaborate.

 

[Rusha]

Perhaps you can elaborate.

Simple ... voting is an activity for responsible grown ups who are concerned about society as a whole rather than just what is going on in their own little world.

Of course those irresponsible non-voters have a legal right to complain. It's called free speech. Just as it's free speech when when others say "Who cares about the whinings of non-voters?"

There are two camps: Part of the problem ... and Part of the solution

Non-voters are always part of the problem.

As pointed out before, I don't want mandatory voting because quality is always superior to quantity.

 

[PureX]

What he is doing on this thread is akin to what you would respect him for doing at the polls.

Yeah, but this thread has almost zero 'reach', politically. And we are all still just sitting on our butts, here, aren't we. Whereas if people started showing up at the polls and encouraging others not to vote, in protest; that would likely get some real local attention. And that attention would cause others to think a bit, about the value of their own votes, and about how to send the messages that they want to send to their political representatives.

 

[PureX]

Abstaining as a result of laziness is foolish.
Abstaining because no available candidate represents me or mine, because the system is inherently flawed to a ludicrous degree, because the system is manipulated by people whose names are never reported and whose faces never pass in front of a camera, is simply acting as conscience demands.

Unless you make this difference known to the people who matter (other voters and the politicians), there is no effective difference. That's what you seem to be working at not recognizing. Doing nothing is just doing nothing. It's not doing something (being conscientious) until you actually do something.

 

[chrysostom]

I don't insult those who keep them accountable, see my promotion of blackboxvoting.org !

I say you did

I will not dignify the voting process because it is not only fundamentally broken, it is run by thieves who stole our government and now want to force us to pretend we run it.

 

[rocketman]

Do you not look to your own experiences when making decisions?
If your experience with voting was a straight line of disappointment, disillusionment, and generally being screwed over no matter who won, would you continue spinning your wheels expecting to get somewhere?

Yes, and I do...vote that is, even though the system may be all the above mentioned but, not voting at all also means you have no right to complain about what you get, given you have shirked your duty out of apathy. Your vote in essence is that you get exactly what you put into it ...nothing, ergo you have waived your right to complain over a process that you freely choose to not take part in. If you have given up that means you concede which also means you should refrain from complaining about it.