Should homosexuals be given the death penalty?

[Lighthouse]

Only God can judge that. So far in the NT, they all get hell if they do not repent.

God has already judged it. And men think themselves better than God, and reject His judgments.

And everyone gets hell if they never turn to Christ.:duh:

Yep.

okay.

I'll take Him at His word where he says to obey the laws of the land...NT.

So, if slavery was still legal, would you obey that law, or fight for abolition? Are you going to just sit back while laws are passed that allow queers to get "married?" Those laws already exist in some states? Should we obey those laws, or fight for what is right?

Did you get your attitude from him also? I have read his posts before.

I got my attitude from God. Righteous anger has made me like this. Before I was a wuss, and a very pathetic excuse for a Christian. I was going to Heaven, but I wasn't leading anyone else there.:nono:

Did I finger stutter, lol? What's wrong with the New Covenant?

You believe that all we've had is a change in covenant, and do not realize the change that took place between Christ's ascension and now. Because Israel [as a whole] rejected Jesus, God chose someone [Paul] to go to the Gentiles, because Israel wasn't doing it, without the law. If Israel had accepted Jesus as Messiah, then they would have been the ones to go to the Gentiles, and they would have converted them to Messianic Judaism, whereas Paul was called to convert them to grace salvation.

That is why then he wants those that God came to save executed eh....just like you? If you can see Jesus on that cross taking all of those homo's sins...waiting for them to repent, you might have a clearer idea of the mercy and grace toward sinners.

The criminal who asked Christ to remember him, what did he say to the man on the other cross?

I didn't say it, God did.

That is a lie!

It says what it says Brandon, and it is pretty plain. Here it is in the Amplified bible...2 Pet 2:20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through [the full, personal] knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they again become entangled in them and are overcome, their last condition is worse [for them] than the first.2 Pet 2:21 For never to have obtained a [full, personal] knowledge of the way of righteousness would have been better for them than, having obtained [such knowledge], to turn back from the holy commandment which was [verbally] delivered to them.
2 Pet 2:22 There has befallen them the thing spoken of in the true proverb, The dog turns back to his own vomit, and, The sow is washed only to wallow again in the mire.



Look at the words that I bolded....Full personal knowledge. They knew the Lord and were saved.

That is not the verse I was referring to.:nono:

"4For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, 5and have tasted the good Word of God and the powers of the world to come, 6if they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance, seeing that they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh and put Him to open shame."

That is what I was referring to. 2 Peter 2 has nothing to do with people losing their salvation.:nono:

And this verse seems to, but if that is what it says, it also say they can not be saved again. And that is a lie.

Because you haven't learned yet to bridle your tongue, that's why. He had a reason for putting that in His word.

James 3, huh? So, was Jesus not bridling His tongue when He called people dogs, or when he called the vipers? How about when He said they were lite whitewashed sepulchres?

Partly.

Not unless you open your mouth..1st John 2:1-3 ~ My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
Rev 3:3 ~ Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and REPENT. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.
You just can't keep sinning even though you have accepted Christ. You have to repent so He can cleanse you of all unrighteousness.

:doh:
Christ is the propitation for our sins. Do you know what that means? And if you're going to quote 1 John, what do you think about chapter 3?

More then you will ever know!!! God can and does say NO if it is not for our good.

Even if it is not God's will, He won't stop me from going. And He can turn it around and use it for my good. But I believe it may be His will, because it is the only place I can find a church that I believe holds to most of the Biblical truths I hold dear. The only other thing I can think of is to start my own church.

Asking them why they are acting and talking like a child of Satan, lol.

You wouldn't know a child of Satan if you looked in the mirror.

Now you are talking like a child!!! Grow up Brandon. I know that from what I am seeing in you, you sure don't appear to be born again. I see none of the qualities of Christ....just your big mouth sounding off.

"I am crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me. And the life which I now live in the flesh, I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me."

It may be hard to revoke something that was never there to begin with.

"
16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together."

That's evident.

Do you not know what sarcasm is?

It has never been my belief that it I have free reign to do whatever I want. Grace is freedom from sin, not license to live in sin. Ever read Romans 5 & 6?

No, I see them Brandon. God has given me the gift of discernment in the body of Christ. I don't expect you to understand that...since you don't see and understand a lot of things.

How do you presume to know me? And how dare you judge me?! You are a hypocrite! Telling me that it is wrong to judge, and then turning around and judging my salvation! God despises hypocrites, ya know?

 

[Just Tom]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Lighthouse again.

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

So, if slavery was still legal, would you obey that law, or fight for abolition? Are you going to just sit back while laws are passed that allow queers to get "married?" Those laws already exist in some states? Should we obey those laws, or fight for what is right?

Of course I would fight it.....but it isn't a law anymore. Ya think that God might have had something to do with that maybe????? If the homo's getting married law is ever voted on in my state, you bet your sweet mask I would vote NO!!!

I got my attitude from God. Righteous anger has made me like this. Before I was a wuss, and a very pathetic excuse for a Christian. I was going to Heaven, but I wasn't leading anyone else there.:nono:

God's righteous indignation does not give us free reign to be rude to those in the body of Christ...or anyone for that matter. I am even working on mine daily because I do have a temper that I constantly try to keep under control With God's help, I pray it get's better.

You believe that all we've had is a change in covenant, and do not realize the change that took place between Christ's ascension and now. Because Israel [as a whole] rejected Jesus, God chose someone [Paul] to go to the Gentiles, because Israel wasn't doing it, without the law. If Israel had accepted Jesus as Messiah, then they would have been the ones to go to the Gentiles, and they would have converted them to Messianic Judaism, whereas Paul was called to convert them to grace salvation.

Yes Brandon, I know all of this already. The laws weren't abolished, but fulfilled in Christ. Now instead of having to go through all of those rituals and going before the Priest to be forgiven and cleansed, we have Jesus who cleanses us from all unrighteousness. He is now our High Priest who is a mediator between us and God when we sin and repent.

The criminal who asked Christ to remember him, what did he say to the man on the other cross?

Today you shall be with me in paradise. He said that because he recognized that Jesus was who He said that He was. It had to be revealed by the Holy Ghost.

And this verse seems to, but if that is what it says, it also say they can not be saved again. And that is a lie.

Ooookay, believe what you want to. That is one of the reasons that I do not believe in once saved always saved.

James 3, huh? So, was Jesus not bridling His tongue when He called people dogs, or when he called the vipers? How about when He said they were lite whitewashed sepulchres?

This was God for goodness sakes!!! He could call anyone anything that He wanted to!! He was judging them, so do you think that He had every right to point out just what they were? There are ways to get your point across without getting into the fleshly side of you. Actually, posts with a bunch of vulgar language and name calling repulse me. They do not show the attributes of the Spirit of the Lord, but carnality.

Christ is the propitation for our sins. Do you know what that means? And if you're going to quote 1 John, what do you think about chapter 3?

I think that it says just what it says. What do you think about this verse? 1 John 2:1 My little children, I write you these things so that you may not violate God's law {and} sin. But if anyone should sin, we have an Advocate (One Who will intercede for us) with the Father--[it is] Jesus Christ [the all] righteous [upright, just, Who conforms to the Father's will in every purpose, thought, and action]. Or this one...1 John 1:8 If we say we have no sin [refusing to admit that we are sinners], we delude {and} lead ourselves astray, and the Truth [which the Gospel presents] is not in us [does not dwell in our hearts].
1 John 1:9 If we [freely] admit that we have sinned {and} confess our sins, He is faithful and just (true to His own nature and promises) and will forgive our sins [dismiss our lawlessness] and [continuously] cleanse us from all unrighteousness [everything not in conformity to His will in purpose, thought, and action].

Even if it is not God's will, He won't stop me from going.

Now this sounds like a spoiled wilful child Brandon!!! Oh, He may let you go, but if it isn't His will for your life, it won't work out.

And He can turn it around and use it for my good.

Ya think with that attitude. If my child had that attitude, he sure wouldn't get any blessings from me!!!

But I believe it may be His will, because it is the only place I can find a church that I believe holds to most of the Biblical truths I hold dear.

Only if they are the biblical truths that HE holds dear.

The only other thing I can think of is to start my own church.

Better have a call on your life first!! I know people who thought this was what they were supposed to do also and fell flat on their faces.

You wouldn't know a child of Satan if you looked in the mirror.

If you start a church and talk to your congregation like you do on here, you will be preaching to the walls.

Do you not know what sarcasm is?

Yes I do, I read it in all of your posts

It has never been my belief that it I have free reign to do whatever I want. Grace is freedom from sin, not license to live in sin. Ever read Romans 5 & 6?

I've read the whole bible, and read every day.

How do you presume to know me? And how dare you judge me?! You are a hypocrite! Telling me that it is wrong to judge, and then turning around and judging my salvation! God despises hypocrites, ya know?

I know you through the Spirit of God. It doesn't take a whole lot for me or anyone else to see where you are at.Yes He does, and he also hates all sin.

 

[Lighthouse]

Of course I would fight it.....but it isn't a law anymore. Ya think that God might have had something to do with that maybe????? If the homo's getting married law is ever voted on in my state, you bet your sweet mask I would vote NO!!!

And if it gets passed, what then? You say you would fight against laws that were unjust, but what about fighting for laws that are just?

God's righteous indignation does not give us free reign to be rude to those in the body of Christ...or anyone for that matter. I am even working on mine daily because I do have a temper that I constantly try to keep under control With God's help, I pray it get's better.

So, you don't consider the things Jesus said, or did, to be rude? What about Peter, or Paul? John the Baptist?

Yes Brandon, I know all of this already. The laws weren't abolished, but fulfilled in Christ. Now instead of having to go through all of those rituals and going before the Priest to be forgiven and cleansed, we have Jesus who cleanses us from all unrighteousness. He is now our High Priest who is a mediator between us and God when we sin and repent.

Right. But that doesn't mean that crimes should no longer be punished, does it?

Today you shall be with me in paradise. He said that because he recognized that Jesus was who He said that He was. It had to be revealed by the Holy Ghost.

No! I did not ask you what Jesus said to him. I asked you what he [the criminal] said to the other criminal.

Ooookay, believe what you want to. That is one of the reasons that I do not believe in once saved always saved.

Ever heard of the dispensation of the grace of God?

This was God for goodness sakes!!! He could call anyone anything that He wanted to!! He was judging them, so do you think that He had every right to point out just what they were? There are ways to get your point across without getting into the fleshly side of you. Actually, posts with a bunch of vulgar language and name calling repulse me. They do not show the attributes of the Spirit of the Lord, but carnality.

Did Jesus not tell us to judge righteously?

I think that it says just what it says. What do you think about this verse? 1 John 2:1 My little children, I write you these things so that you may not violate God's law {and} sin. But if anyone should sin, we have an Advocate (One Who will intercede for us) with the Father--[it is] Jesus Christ [the all] righteous [upright, just, Who conforms to the Father's will in every purpose, thought, and action]. Or this one...1 John 1:8 If we say we have no sin [refusing to admit that we are sinners], we delude {and} lead ourselves astray, and the Truth [which the Gospel presents] is not in us [does not dwell in our hearts].
1 John 1:9 If we [freely] admit that we have sinned {and} confess our sins, He is faithful and just (true to His own nature and promises) and will forgive our sins [dismiss our lawlessness] and [continuously] cleanse us from all unrighteousness [everything not in conformity to His will in purpose, thought, and action].

What does 1 John 3 say? Huh? It's the chapter right after the one you're quoting.

And as for what chapters 1 and 2 say, you have to consider who they're written to, and what the context is. 1 John 1:9 is the only verse in the entire Bible that says that we need to confess. And from what I gather, we only need to confess once, per salvation. After that, living as a Christian is a confession that we need Jesus, is it not? And I have never said that I never sinned. I no longer sin, because the one who sins is not who I am anymore. I am a new creation.

Now this sounds like a spoiled wilful child Brandon!!! Oh, He may let you go, but if it isn't His will for your life, it won't work out. Ya think with that attitude. If my child had that attitude, he sure wouldn't get any blessings from me!!! Only if they are the biblical truths that HE holds dear. Better have a call on your life first!! I know people who thought this was what they were supposed to do also and fell flat on their faces.

Actually, I haven't decided whether or not I'm going to CO yet. But I know the calling that is on my life, and so do a lot of other people. And CO is the only place I know of where I can find a church that believes the majority of what I believe, and hold dear.

If you start a church and talk to your congregation like you do on here, you will be preaching to the walls.

Really? Well, let me ask those around here who go to Enyart's church a question: does Enyart preach to the walls?

Yes I do, I read it in all of your posts

Then don't get so uptight.

I've read the whole bible, and read every day.

Then you know that it says grace is freedom from sin, and not license to sin, right?

I know you through the Spirit of God. It doesn't take a whole lot for me or anyone else to see where you are at.Yes He does, and he also hates all sin.

You know absolutely nothing. And if God hates all sin, why don't you?

 

[Lighthouse]

Oh, I almost forgot. Do you always neg rep people for persoanl attacks? Seems kind of petty, if you ask me.

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

And if it gets passed, what then? You say you would fight against laws that were unjust, but what about fighting for laws that are just?

Well, I am really not one for standing in front of Planned Parenthood etc carrying a sign.."Abortion Is A Sin, or have a bumper sticker that reads, Homosexuals repent!!!! I do vote though.

So, you don't consider the things Jesus said, or did, to be rude? What about Peter, or Paul? John the Baptist?

No, I don't call them rude. The thing is Brandon, in these times people are more sensitive to "wordage". Picture this scenario....You walk up to a group of homosexuals and say, hey you friggen queers, you are going to hell if you don't repent. They may be homo's, but you might get yourself stabbed on the spot. Same thing with any human that is lost. You don't make them angry right off with abusive talk or a judgmental attitude. We are to win them by love, and tell them the truth in love....which in itself is judging their sin. The Holy Spirit does the rest. When Jesus was teaching the crowds who followed Him, He taught with authority and love. He held their attention. We are to do the same...not anger the snot out of them.

Right. But that doesn't mean that crimes should no longer be punished, does it?

Heck no. If the laws are on our books (law of the land) for a certain punishment for a certain crime, then it better be followed through.

No! I did not ask you what Jesus said to him. I asked you what he [the criminal] said to the other criminal.

Oh, sorry. He said, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us. What was the point of this question again? I can't find it.

Ever heard of the dispensation of the grace of God?

Absolutely. That is what we are under right now...and so are the lost. They are in a grace period to make the right decision for Christ. Grace means unmerited favor. We didn't deserve it.

Did Jesus not tell us to judge righteously?

Yes He did....John 7:24 ~Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. Do you judge according to appearance? If you saw a man that looked and talked like a homo, you would think that he was a homo right? Not necessarily so. He may just be "frail" and a deacon in a church. You won't know that he is a homo unless you talk to him and see where his heart is, then you make righteous judgment about what is in his heart.
Jesus was talking about circumcision and healing on the Sabbath in that verse. They didn't make a righteous judgment. Circumcision was fine, but not healing a person on the Sabbath...DUH!!! They were looking at the appearance of the situation and didn't comprehend the enormity of what they had witnessed. Never judge appearances without the facts.

What does 1 John 3 say? Huh? It's the chapter right after the one you're quoting.

Yeah Brandon, so what is your point? Are you saying that just because you have accepted Jesus, He died for you, the works of the devil have been destroyed, and your heart doesn't feel "condemned" that you don't need to repent of your sins??? Wrongo!!! We all have to repent. That is why Jesus is our Mediator to God the Father. ALSO... My little children (saved folks), these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 1st John 2:1. There is repentance unto salvation, and repentance for the sins that we commit daily. We sin every day

And as for what chapters 1 and 2 say, you have to consider who they're written to, and what the context is.

The whole NT was written for NT believers...which we are. New Testament means New Covenant. Are you under the New Covenant???

1 John 1:9 is the only verse in the entire Bible that says that we need to confess.

Wrong!!! 1st John 1:6-10 ~ If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. The context of these verses are talking about people who are already saved.

And from what I gather, we only need to confess once, per salvation. After that, living as a Christian is a confession that we need Jesus, is it not? And I have never said that I never sinned. I no longer sin, because the one who sins is not who I am anymore. I am a new creation.

Same verses above apply.

Actually, I haven't decided whether or not I'm going to CO yet. But I know the calling that is on my life, and so do a lot of other people. And CO is the only place I know of where I can find a church that believes the majority of what I believe, and hold dear.

I don't know where you live, but I hope you love snow, lol. It will either happen, or it won't. If it doesn't, will you take that as a NO form God for a reason?

Really? Well, let me ask those around here who go to Enyart's church a question: does Enyart preach to the walls?

I had never heard of this Enyart person until I came to this site, and I have been on a lot of sites, but I just looked him up. I posted it below. Shame on you people who follow this hate mongering cult leader!!! You are no better then the white pride group!!!

Then don't get so uptight.

I wasn't until I looked up Bob Enyart!!

Then you know that it says grace is freedom from sin, and not license to sin, right?

Yes, if you confess them and not hold on to them

You know absolutely nothing. (bolding mine) And if God hates all sin, why don't you?

I hate ALL sin.

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

Oh, I almost forgot. Do you always neg rep people for persoanl attacks? Seems kind of petty, if you ask me.

Yes I do, and there has been a lot of it going on in the past few days. Personal attacks need to be stopped!!! I was guilty of it myself because I was being attacked.

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

Now I know where you, Clete and others get your "doctrine" from. This man is a cult leader with evidently a good following. How sad for you people following this kind of garbage and calling it Christian!!! I looked up Bob Enyart, and this is what I found:
Outspoken Denver, Colorado broadcaster, known as much for his ultraconservative fundamentalism as for his bluntness and rudeness (as well as some rather ill-advised actions) that reflect poorly on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He prefers using the New King James Version, and refers to other versions disparagingly (e.g. "Reversed Standard Version" and "HIV version").

Enyart is a theonomist - someone who believes that Old Testament Law is as valid and applicable today as it was in Old Testament times. He is, therefore, a vocal death penalty proponent (who, like so many, uses long-refuted "arguments"). A portion of his novel, "The First Five Days -- The Rebirth of America" is available online It is a sickening fantasy of how "Christians" of Enyart's persuasion would govern America given the chance. Incidentally, though Enyart's book "The Plot" contains some 10,000 Scripture references, it appears he bases his views on his interpretation of 1 Timothy 1:8-10.

Enyart was, justifiably, listed on the late Hatewatch.org site for his outspoken hatred of homosexuals.
Enyart believes the best form of government is a "constitutional monarchy," and that democracy is the worst form of government. He is the lead spokesperson for ShadowGov.com.

Not surprisingly, Enyart's home church is Derby Bible Church in Colorado. Its pastors teach that God changes his mind, and does not know the future (Moral Government Theology).

See also: An Examination of Kingdom-Now, Dominion, and Latter-Rain Theology

In the opinion of the publisher of Apologetics Index, people like Mr. Enyart live like enemies of the cross and Gospel of Jesus Christ. Fortunately, Mr. Enyart's perverse version of Christianity is the exception, and not the norm.
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/e23.html

 

[Evee]

Thanks Nana I was wondering who he was.
Sounds like pretty obnoxious guy!!
Why would anyone want to follow him instead of Jesus.
He is not following Jesus teachings at all.
Hope not another Jim Jones.

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

Thanks Nana I was wondering who he was.
Sounds like pretty obnoxious guy!!
Why would anyone want to follow him instead of Jesus.
He is not following Jesus teachings at all.
Hope not another Jim Jones.

I just clicked onto the GOD/KGOV radio icon on the home page. Guess what comes up? Bob Enyarts donation page. This site is a cult.

 

[Evee]

I just clicked onto the GOD/KGOV radio icon on the home page. Guess what comes up? Bob Enyarts donation page. This site is a cult.

Yeah I don't believe nothing like most of these people.
I believe LOVE IS what we are supposed to be doing not hating.
These people could never convince me of their belief.

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

Yeah I don't believe nothing like most of these people.
I believe LOVE IS what we are supposed to be doing not hating.
These people could never convince me of their belief.

It goes totally against the teaching of Jesus where He said to love your enemies. Homosexuals are enemies of the cross of Christ because of their sin, but He said to love them. He died for them also and took their sins, they just need to repent and accept Jesus. Hell is going to be so full!!!

 

[Just Tom]

It goes totally against the teaching of Jesus where He said to love your enemies. Homosexuals are enemies of the cross of Christ because of their sin, but He said to love them. He died for them also and took their sins, they just need to repent and accept Jesus. Hell is going to be so full!!!

BMN,
How many homosexuals have you prayed with to become Christians? Because of your love for them...?

 

[Big Mouth Nana]

BMN,
How many homosexuals have you prayed with to become Christians? Because of your love for them...?

I haven't prayed with them, but I have talked to them about Christ in a lot of places that I have worked. The Word is a seed, and it was planted. I pray for them all to be saved every night, as we all should.

 

[Army of One]

BMN and Evee,

I would suggest that you actually look for yourself what Enyart has said or written, before so rashly condemning him as a cultic leader. He is nothing of the sort. At KGOV.com you can find some his writings and a pretty extensive archive of his daily radio show. Plus, he occasionly visits TOL, and you're free to challenge him on any of his beliefs.

Slander is never a good thing.:nono:

I just clicked onto the GOD/KGOV radio icon on the home page. Guess what comes up? Bob Enyarts donation page. This site is a cult.

Did you happen to notice why his donation page came up? Could it have anything to do with the fact that each February he has a fund drive to help pay for his air time on the radio? :think: You need to work on this whole "judging" thing. You're terrible at it.

The Bob Enyart Live annual February broadcast telethon is two-thirds over, and we've reached 57% of our goal of $10,000 in one-time donations! Thank You!

This was from the very top of the page! Is he not allowed to thank those who donated to his ministry?

 

[Army of One]

Now I know where you, Clete and others get your "doctrine" from. This man is a cult leader with evidently a good following. How sad for you people following this kind of garbage and calling it Christian!!! I looked up Bob Enyart, and this is what I found:

First of all, I seriously doubt that you even know what "cult" actually means, but what exactly does Enyart teach that is cultic?

Outspoken Denver, Colorado broadcaster, known as much for his ultraconservative fundamentalism as for his bluntness and rudeness (as well as some rather ill-advised actions) that reflect poorly on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He prefers using the New King James Version, and refers to other versions disparagingly (e.g. "Reversed Standard Version" and "HIV version").

OK, so he's (at times) rude and blunt? And this is cultic, how?

Enyart is a theonomist - someone who believes that Old Testament Law is as valid and applicable today as it was in Old Testament times. He is, therefore, a vocal death penalty proponent (who, like so many, uses long-refuted "arguments").

Would you be able to elaborate on what these "long refuted 'arguments'" are?

A portion of his novel, "The First Five Days -- The Rebirth of America" is available online It is a sickening fantasy of how "Christians" of Enyart's persuasion would govern America given the chance.

Wow, imaging that. Someone has actually thought through how God's criminal code could be applied today. For shame, Bob Enyart.

Incidentally, though Enyart's book "The Plot" contains some 10,000 Scripture references, it appears he bases his views on his interpretation of 1 Timothy 1:8-10.

How someone could read "The Plot" and come to this conclusion is astounding. I believe the first 1 or 2 chapters of "The Plot" are available to read on KGOV.com. Why not actually inspect it for yourself, before making a judgment?

Enyart was, justifiably, listed on the late Hatewatch.org site for his outspoken hatred of homosexuals.
Enyart believes the best form of government is a "constitutional monarchy," and that democracy is the worst form of government. He is the lead spokesperson for ShadowGov.com.

Again, which part of this is cultic?

Not surprisingly, Enyart's home church is Derby Bible Church in Colorado. Its pastors teach that God changes his mind, and does not know the future (Moral Government Theology).

So Enyart is an Open Theist. Does that make him a cult leader, BMN?

In the opinion of the publisher of Apologetics Index, people like Mr. Enyart live like enemies of the cross and Gospel of Jesus Christ. Fortunately, Mr. Enyart's perverse version of Christianity is the exception, and not the norm.
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/e23.html

Wow, thank goodness apologeticsindex.org was there. If not, you might have actually had to look at the evidence yourself before you beared false witness against another Christian.:thumb:

 

[Just Tom]

I haven't prayed with them, but I have talked to them about Christ in a lot of places that I have worked. The Word is a seed, and it was planted. I pray for them all to be saved every night, as we all should.

So then you don't know squat..

Bob has converted more homos into Christians with his call them what they are approach, Perverts.

Yeah the word is the seed... Where is the fruit?????

You love them to hell..

Will they all be saved? All of those that you pray for? No..

LOVE'n them To hell in Jesus' name..

Now that would been a good motto.

Theologyonline.com: We won't love you to hell in Jesus's name..

 

[Lighthouse]

Well, I am really not one for standing in front of Planned Parenthood etc carrying a sign.."Abortion Is A Sin, or have a bumper sticker that reads, Homosexuals repent!!!! I do vote though.

What about a sign that says, "Abortion is murder," or one that reads, "Abortion kills?" Do you know anyone who's had an abortion? Do you know any queers?

No, I don't call them rude. The thing is Brandon, in these times people are more sensitive to "wordage". Picture this scenario....You walk up to a group of homosexuals and say, hey you friggen queers, you are going to hell if you don't repent. They may be homo's, but you might get yourself stabbed on the spot. Same thing with any human that is lost. You don't make them angry right off with abusive talk or a judgmental attitude. We are to win them by love, and tell them the truth in love....which in itself is judging their sin. The Holy Spirit does the rest. When Jesus was teaching the crowds who followed Him, He taught with authority and love. He held their attention. We are to do the same...not anger the snot out of them.

You do reralize that people tried to kill Jesus a few times, and they succeeded once.:idea: The truth offends some people. That's just how it is. Take a look around here, and see how many people are angry about the fact we believe they're going to hell. We don't even have to tell them they are, and they're mad about the fact that we believe it.

Heck no. If the laws are on our books (law of the land) for a certain punishment for a certain crime, then it better be followed through.

And what if they're not on the books? Should they be?

Oh, sorry. He said, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us. What was the point of this question again? I can't find it.

Wrong!

I did not ask you what either of the criminals said to Jesus! Or what Jesus said to one of them! I asked you what the criminal whom Jesus accepted said to the other one. Pick up your Bible and read it. Then we can discuss this.

Absolutely. That is what we are under right now...and so are the lost. They are in a grace period to make the right decision for Christ. Grace means unmerited favor. We didn't deserve it.

Wrong again!

Yes, Christians are under the dispensation of the grace of God, which is seperate from the New Covenant God wanted to make with Israel. However, the lost are not under grace. They are still under the law. And they can only be under grace if the accept Christ.

Yes He did....John 7:24 ~Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. Do you judge according to appearance? If you saw a man that looked and talked like a homo, you would think that he was a homo right? Not necessarily so. He may just be "frail" and a deacon in a church. You won't know that he is a homo unless you talk to him and see where his heart is, then you make righteous judgment about what is in his heart.

I do not assume he's a queer, just because he's feminine.

Jesus was talking about circumcision and healing on the Sabbath in that verse. They didn't make a righteous judgment. Circumcision was fine, but not healing a person on the Sabbath...DUH!!! They were looking at the appearance of the situation and didn't comprehend the enormity of what they had witnessed. Never judge appearances without the facts.

Healing someone was okay. That is what you are saying, right?

Yeah Brandon, so what is your point? Are you saying that just because you have accepted Jesus, He died for you, the works of the devil have been destroyed, and your heart doesn't feel "condemned" that you don't need to repent of your sins??? Wrongo!!!

I never saiod I don't need to repent if I do wrong. But as a Christian, with Christ living in me, I live in repentance.:duh:

We all have to repent. That is why Jesus is our Mediator to God the Father. ALSO... My little children (saved folks), these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 1st John 2:1. There is repentance unto salvation, and repentance for the sins that we commit daily. We sin every day

According to 1 John 3, as a Christian, I no longer sin. Why? Because Jesus is my advocate, and those things that were sin are not counted against me. And God sees me as righteous, because He has made me righteous. 1 John 1:9 says I have been cleansed from all unrighteousness, once and for all.

The whole NT was written for NT believers...which we are. New Testament means New Covenant. Are you under the New Covenant???

No. I am under the dispensation of the grace of God.

Wrong!!! 1st John 1:6-10 ~ If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. 8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. The context of these verses are talking about people who are already saved.

I never said that I have not sinned. And I fully believe that He has cleansed me from all sin and unrighteousness.

And he's telling people how to become saved. Have you ever read verse 2?

Same verses above apply.

See above.

I don't know where you live, but I hope you love snow, lol. It will either happen, or it won't. If it doesn't, will you take that as a NO form God for a reason?

If it doesn't happen that doesn't necessarily mean that God said no. Maybe it means that I just didn't go.

And it snows more in NY than it does in CO. Especially Denver. I'm not planning on living in the mountains.

I had never heard of this Enyart person until I came to this site, and I have been on a lot of sites, but I just looked him up. I posted it below. Shame on you people who follow this hate mongering cult leader!!! You are no better then the white pride group!!!

Oh, whatever! Bob is not Fred Phelps.:nono:

I wasn't until I looked up Bob Enyart!!

Yes, if you confess them and not hold on to them

We need a smilie that's actually rolling its eyes.

I hate ALL sin.

No you don't.:nono:

 

[Lighthouse]

Yes I do, and there has been a lot of it going on in the past few days. Personal attacks need to be stopped!!! I was guilty of it myself because I was being attacked.

:baby:

If you neg rep people for personal attacks you're going to be neg repping people constantly.

Shake it off and get over it. I do.

 

[Lighthouse]

Now I know where you, Clete and others get your "doctrine" from. This man is a cult leader with evidently a good following. How sad for you people following this kind of garbage and calling it Christian!!! I looked up Bob Enyart, and this is what I found:
Outspoken Denver, Colorado broadcaster, known as much for his ultraconservative fundamentalism as for his bluntness and rudeness (as well as some rather ill-advised actions) that reflect poorly on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He prefers using the New King James Version, and refers to other versions disparagingly (e.g. "Reversed Standard Version" and "HIV version").

You might want to look into the reasons he has for using those terms. The NIV has a misinterpreted verse that says rape victims have to marry their rapists. And the same book also says that rapists should be put to death when caught. You know that isn't what God said, right?

Enyart is a theonomist - someone who believes that Old Testament Law is as valid and applicable today as it was in Old Testament times. He is, therefore, a vocal death penalty proponent (who, like so many, uses long-refuted "arguments"). A portion of his novel, "The First Five Days -- The Rebirth of America" is available online It is a sickening fantasy of how "Christians" of Enyart's persuasion would govern America given the chance. Incidentally, though Enyart's book "The Plot" contains some 10,000 Scripture references, it appears he bases his views on his interpretation of 1 Timothy 1:8-10.

You're reading what other people say, and judging him based on it, without actually doing your own research. What does that make you?

Like Army said, talk to Enyart yourself, and listen to some of his radio shows, to see what he actually says and believes.

Enyart was, justifiably, listed on the late Hatewatch.org site for his outspoken hatred of homosexuals.
Enyart believes the best form of government is a "constitutional monarchy," and that democracy is the worst form of government. He is the lead spokesperson for ShadowGov.com.

Majority rule is a bad form of government, because the majority is unrighteous. That's why homosexuality is legal in America.:duh:

Not surprisingly, Enyart's home church is Derby Bible Church in Colorado. Its pastors teach that God changes his mind, and does not know the future (Moral Government Theology).

Actually he was ordained at that church, and now pastors Denver Bible Church.

See also: An Examination of Kingdom-Now, Dominion, and Latter-Rain Theology

I don't even know what that is.

In the opinion of the publisher of Apologetics Index, people like Mr. Enyart live like enemies of the cross and Gospel of Jesus Christ. Fortunately, Mr. Enyart's perverse version of Christianity is the exception, and not the norm.
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/e23.html

That's his opinion. Ever tried forming your own?

I used to think the same things about Enyart before I came to TOL. I still thought it when I came to TOL. But after listening to him, for myself, I realized that what I believed about him was not true.