beloved57
Well-known member
Yall both alike, teaching Salvation by works, by what a person does !
Salvation is not cheap it is FREE
- Thread starter Totton Linnet
- Start date
Yall both alike, teaching Salvation by works, by what a person does !
That is not the scripture
First it is Foreknowledge then Predestiny then Election then the call
Salvation is effected when we receive the call, the call comes when we hear the gospel. you can argue until you are blue in the face [and you will] but everyone who is called answers that call.
Paul is the example, when he was floored he cried "who art Thou Lord?" and the Lord directed him to Damascas "and it shall be shown you what you must do"
You would immediately denounce the Lord for preaching works wouldn't you. Just like you say faith is not necessary but er ah well God says we are saved by grace through faith.
Believing is not work, calling upon the Lord is not work. Both believing and calling are the work of the Holy Spirit in us...."God has sent His Spirit into our hearts crying "Abba Father"
Pay attention we our saved by what the Holy Ghost does IN US, that includes our believing and calling.
Christ does not say obey and be saved He says BELIEVE and be saved...so you start off from a position of disobedience.
Nobody receives the Holy Spirit until they are saved....you have testified that you are not saved.
beloved57
Well-known member
Those Christ died for are reconciled saved by what Christ did for them, His Death alone made them Righteous, Rom 5:10,19! You teach salvation by works, a false gospel!
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach salvation by works, by what a person does, that is a false gospel!
so you were still spiritually dead when the HS did the believing and calling for you?
Did YOU see the Holy Ghost when you first heard the gospel? neither did I, He is like the wind who blows where He listeth...but you hear the sound of Him.
You don't hear the Holy Spirit you hear the noise He makes IN PEOPLE.
Paul said sent the spirit of His Son into our hearts crying Abba Father, and no [pay attention] I was not spiritually dead I was brought ALIVE, that is the first thing God does. Then we believe on Him, then we cry to Him
So did John for he said "as many as received Him to them gave He the the power to become the sons of God"
Get over it.
beloved57
Well-known member
You not John, you teach Salvation by works, not John !
Ben Masada
New member
Thank you Grosnick but, we are not discussing the Jewish People but the words of Meshak.
Ben Masada
New member
I must not and I would not because we belong in the same category of Faith and owe our duty to the same God. We can't believe by faith but by sight aka understanding. (II Cor. 5:7)
Ben Masada
New member
Eternal life cannot be earned, bought, or worked for. Neither given as a free gift from God. The Lord forbade eternal life from the very beginning in the Garden of Eden if you read Genesis 3:22. To believe that Jesus died we need no faith. That he experienced resurrection yes, Christians need a lot of faith. As the Jews are concerned, even faith is not necessary because we don't believe by faith but by sight aka understanding.
beloved57
Well-known member
You don't believe the scripture, how could you since you don't believe Paul's Epistles to be the scripture of truth.
Ben Masada
New member
Were not for the Law, we would all be in big troubles. No one can be justified on the excuse that he or she did not know. Especially under the New Covenant, no one will be let go scot-free under the excuse that he did not know.
beloved57
Well-known member
What people worshipped a golden calf as god?
Ben Masada
New member
What is the difference between the worship of a golden calf and a man that Christians worship as if he were a god? That's the same kind of idolatry if you read Deut. 4:15,16.
KingdomRose
New member
But the point has been completely missed by you!
I don't think anyone is saying that a person can be saved by his own works and nothing else. What is being said is: A person must have BOTH---faith in the saving power of Jesus' sacrifice AND deeds to go hand-in-hand WITH our faith.
There are many scriptures that call on us to do good works. But this is AFTER we have accepted Jesus as our Savior.
"Faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself." (James 2:17, NASB)
"Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven." (Matt.5:16, NASB)
"...that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance." (Acts 26:20, NASB)
"[God] will render to each person according to his deeds." (Romans 2:6)
"Instruct them to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share." (I Timothy 6:18)
"[Christ] gave himself for us to redeem us from every lawless deed, and to purify for himself a people for his own possession, zealous for good deeds." (Titus 2:14)
"This is a trustworthy statement; and concerning these things I want you to speak confidently, so that those who have believed God will be careful to engage in good deeds." (Titus 3:8)
There are so many more I can't post them all here. Some others: Titus 3:14; Hebrews 10:24; James 2:18; I Peter 2:12.
oly:Ben Masada
New member
Because they are not according to the Word of God in the Tanach. Paul's
scriptures are scriptures of idolatry.
