Reconciled to God while enemies !
- Thread starter beloved57
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God's Truth
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Who do you think the enemies of God are?
The Bible says the Gentiles were because they did not obey and get circumcised. Circumcision is the seal of the purification/ceremonial laws.
beloved57
Well-known member
I said you dont love Rom 5:10 ! It says nothing about getting circumcised lol
beloved57
Well-known member
Amen Sis !
God's Truth
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You like to keep using that scripture and think it means something that it does not.
Since you like using that scripture, let's study the scriptures surrounding it.
Let's start here:
1 Therefore, since we have been justified through faith,
Do you understand that Jews had to be justified before God and that they did that by cleaning themselves?
They cleaned themselves by getting circumcised, eating a special diet, doing various external washings, and sacrificing animals.
Since Jesus shed his blood on the cross, we all now only have to have FAITH that HIS BLOOD justifies us.
Nothing about the Holy Spirit making us have faith without our knowing and wanting.
we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2 through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand.
Did you read that? We have gained access by our faith into this grace...what grace? Grace is that we are made clean just by believing Jesus' blood cleans us and we do not have to work at cleaning ourselves.
And we boast in the hope of the glory of God. 3 Not only so, but we also glory in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; 4 perseverance, character; and character, hope. 5 And hope does not put us to shame, because God’s love has been poured out into our hearts through the Holy Spirit, who has been given to us. 6 You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly.
The Gentiles were the ungodly. They were without Christ and God in this world. They didn't even obey the old way to clean themselves so that they could be near God. See, the Jews used to have to clean themselves to be near God.
7 Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous person, though for a good person someone might possibly dare to die. 8 But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Since we have now been justified by his blood,
You see, just as I have been saying, we are justified by his blood...that means just our faith that his blood cleans us is what cleans and justifies us. The Jews for over a thousand years had to do many acts every day to be justified to be near God, but all the Gentiles sinners did none of that and just got to be saved by Jesus' blood.
how much more shall we be saved from God’s wrath through him! 10 For if, while we were God’s enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! 11 Not only is this so, but we also boast in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
See, the UNcircumcised Gentile enemies now are able to be reconciled to God after being separated from God for so long. The Jews had the ceremonial/purification laws to boast in so that they could work at being close to God by cleaning themselves, but now the boast can only be that Jesus cleans us all just by believing he does.
beloved57
Well-known member
Those Christ died for, by His death, they were reconciled to God, while they themselves were still enemies hating God Rom 5:10. Now you dont Love that portion of Gods word !
God's Truth
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Read what I wrote and reply to what I said.
beloved57
Well-known member
You are evading what the scripture said !
Those Christ died for are reconciled to God while they are enemies, that is while hating God Rom 5:10. Doesnt that scripture say that ?
God's Truth
New member
There must be something very wrong with you. You are given much thought and time from me on things you post and say, but you want even more while you give nothing but untruthful insults and a scripture you do not understand.
beloved57
Well-known member
According to Rom 5:10
For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
Ok, lets discuss this verse as to what it exactly says ? According to this verse, when were these believers reconciled to God ?
God's Truth
New member
When they were uncircumcised in the flesh.
God's Truth
New member
Paul repeatedly through out Romans speaks about CIRCUMCISION and those circumcised and those not.
Romans 2:25 Circumcision has value if you observe the law, but if you break the law, you have become as though you had not been circumcised.
Romans 2:26 So then, if those who are not circumcised keep the law’s requirements, will they not be regarded as though they were circumcised?
Romans 2:27 The one who is not circumcised physically and yet obeys the law will condemn you who, even though you have the written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.
Romans 3:30 since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.
Romans 4:9 Is this blessedness only for the circumcised, or also for the uncircumcised? We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
Romans 4:10 Under what circumstances was it credited? Was it after he was circumcised, or before? It was not after, but before!
Romans 4:11 And he received circumcision as a sign, a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. So then, he is the father of all who believe but have not been circumcised, in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
Romans 4:12 And he is then also the father of the circumcised who not only are circumcised but who also follow in the footsteps of the faith that our father Abraham had before he was circumcised.
So you see, Paul is speaking about the enemy sinner UNcircumcised Gentiles being saved and not having to be circumcised before Jesus would save them.
Romans 2:25 Circumcision has value if you observe the law, but if you break the law, you have become as though you had not been circumcised.
Romans 2:26 So then, if those who are not circumcised keep the law’s requirements, will they not be regarded as though they were circumcised?
Romans 2:27 The one who is not circumcised physically and yet obeys the law will condemn you who, even though you have the written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.
Romans 3:30 since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith.
Romans 4:9 Is this blessedness only for the circumcised, or also for the uncircumcised? We have been saying that Abraham’s faith was credited to him as righteousness.
Romans 4:10 Under what circumstances was it credited? Was it after he was circumcised, or before? It was not after, but before!
Romans 4:11 And he received circumcision as a sign, a seal of the righteousness that he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. So then, he is the father of all who believe but have not been circumcised, in order that righteousness might be credited to them.
Romans 4:12 And he is then also the father of the circumcised who not only are circumcised but who also follow in the footsteps of the faith that our father Abraham had before he was circumcised.
So you see, Paul is speaking about the enemy sinner UNcircumcised Gentiles being saved and not having to be circumcised before Jesus would save them.
beloved57
Well-known member
Try again, thats not what it says. According to Rom 5:10 when were these believers reconciled to God. Read it Rom 5:10
For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
God's Truth
New member
They were saved while Gentile enemies is about being an enemy and saved while not circumcised.
God's Truth
New member
Beloved,
Read these scriptures:
Ephesians 2:11 Therefore remember that formerly you who are Gentiles in the flesh and called uncircumcised by the so-called circumcision (that done in the body by human hands)— 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.
Did you read that?
They were ENEMIES because they did not obey and come into the covenant with God by getting circumcised in the flesh.
Read these scriptures:
Ephesians 2:11 Therefore remember that formerly you who are Gentiles in the flesh and called uncircumcised by the so-called circumcision (that done in the body by human hands)— 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.
Did you read that?
They were ENEMIES because they did not obey and come into the covenant with God by getting circumcised in the flesh.
Nanja
Well-known member
They were reconciled to God when they were being unbelievers and enemies.
God's Truth
New member
God does not save unbelievers.
Nanja
Well-known member
God's Truth
New member
Nowhere anywhere do the scriptures say God saves unbelievers.
I am trying to help untrap you from the devil's hold.
The Bible says repeatedly to believe.
...but you say God saves unbelievers.
You are ensnared and humbling yourself for God's Truth is the only way to be saved.
Nanja
Well-known member
Did Christ die for the very first sin of unbelief committed in the garden?