Political Pope

[Crucible]

Given how many American Catholics support abortion even if the Pope commanded, the American Catholics wouldn't be listening anyway.

American Catholic is almost like an oxymoron, isn't it :think:

Even Kennedy had to sort of shift his position in being President even though he was Catholic, stating essentially that his office must come first.

I've been trying to reveal something of the sort to Rexlunae above.

 

[Town Heretic]

Given how many American Catholics support abortion even if the Pope commanded, the American Catholics wouldn't be listening anyway.

Pew did research a couple of years ago and found a number of divides.

77% of American Catholics favored birth control.
About the same percent found divorce acceptable.

 

[chrysostom]

Pew did research a couple of years ago and found a number of divides.

77% of American Catholics favored birth control.
About the same percent found divorce acceptable.

this is why you need a pope

 

[User Name]

Pew did research a couple of years ago and found a number of divides.

77% of American Catholics favored birth control.
About the same percent found divorce acceptable.

The Univision poll found that 54 percent of U.S. Catholics supported same-sex marriage. Fifty-nine percent supported admitting women to the priesthood. Sixty percent thought Catholics who had divorced and remarried outside the church should be eligible to receive communion. Sixty-one percent thought priests should be allowed to marry. Seventy-six percent thought abortion should be permitted at least in some circumstances. Seventy-nine percent supported contraception.​

-- http://www.slate.com/blogs/saletan/...arriage_and_birth_control_europe_and_the.html

 

[rocketman]

Should the Pope interject his opinions into the American election? Although not Catholic, I think he is justified in trying to influence who people vote for. (And..... I think I disagree with the Pope about "walls". Didn't God help Nehemiah with a wall? Does the Vatican have walls to keep outsiders out?)

The pope is a hypocrite with his nonsense about walls when he himself lives behind the walls of vatican city, with his own guards protecting it to yes, keep out invaders, and he seeks to point his finger at this nation for wanting to have borders? What a clown...he has no business injecting his opinion into the election process of any nation furthermore, who is he...a man...just a man...to attempt to say who is or is not a Christian? Donald Trump may not be a Christian but, that is between him & Christ not another fallible man...the pope, he needs to shut up, butt out, and concern himself with his own salvation.

 

[Crucible]

Pew did research a couple of years ago and found a number of divides.

77% of American Catholics favored birth control.
About the same percent found divorce acceptable.

See, that's the hangup with Roman Catholics, because what's really the point if one doesn't hold to what is 'infallible teaching'... abortion has been considered such a mortal thing that, up until recently, it was straight up ex-communication. Francis as of late sent missionaries out to absolve women of aborted children.

 

[chrysostom]

thank you francis
now
maybe some of our bishops will grow a spine

 

[6days]

The pope is a hypocrite with his nonsense about walls when he himself lives behind the walls of vatican city, with his own guards protecting it to yes, keep out invaders, and he seeks to point his finger at this nation for wanting to have borders? What a clown...he has no business injecting his opinion into the election process of any nation furthermore, who is he...a man...just a man...to attempt to say who is or is not a Christian? Donald Trump may not be a Christian but, that is between him & Christ not another fallible man...the pope, he needs to shut up, butt out, and concern himself with his own salvation.

Hmmmmm...... I'm not so sure about all of that. Although I am not Catholic, I think he almost has a duty to express his opinions about walls and other topics. Shouldn't the head of any organization be making comments that try to influence others? For example we think our leaders should speak out against human abuses when in China. Or, if someone such as Franklin Graham (who unofficially represents many christians) was in Iran, we might want him to encourage that country to allow greater religious freedom.

 

[PureX]

Should the Pope interject his opinions into the American election? Although not Catholic, I think he is justified in trying to influence who people vote for. (And..... I think I disagree with the Pope about "walls". Didn't God help Nehemiah with a wall? Does the Vatican have walls to keep outsiders out?)

I think he should speak out against social statements and political platforms that he believes will do humanity harm. I do not believe, however, that he should be making spiritual pronouncements about specific people; in politics or otherwise.

 

[The Horn]

The Pope has the right to state his opinions , and you can take them or leave them .
Actually, I think Pope Francis is right on target . Trump is a fear and hate monger, and deserves to be blasted for this . He's shamelessly pandering to paranoid fear of Hispanics and Muslims in America to win support and votes . This is contemptible .

 

[Cruciform]

(...Does the Vatican have walls to keep outsiders out?)

If so, it doesn't seem to be working very well...

 

[Crucible]

Should the Pope interject his opinions into the American election? Although not Catholic, I think he is justified in trying to influence who people vote for. (And..... I think I disagree with the Pope about "walls". Didn't God help Nehemiah with a wall? Does the Vatican have walls to keep outsiders out?)

The Pope doesn't want America to build a wall because everything south of the border is Catholic. He's just not going to come out and admit it is all. There's no other reason the Pope would be so concerned about it specifically above all other walls.

 

[ok doser]

If so, it doesn't seem to be working very well...

all those people live in vatican city?

cool!

 

[rocketman]

Hmmmmm...... I'm not so sure about all of that. Although I am not Catholic, I think he almost has a duty to express his opinions about walls and other topics. Shouldn't the head of any organization be making comments that try to influence others? For example we think our leaders should speak out against human abuses when in China. Or, if someone such as Franklin Graham (who unofficially represents many christians) was in Iran, we might want him to encourage that country to allow greater religious freedom.

We are not talking about Franklin Graham or the pope encouraging religious freedom now are we? We are talking about a powerful religious leader attempting to skew an election of a nation. The pope has injected his opinion where it does not belong, where did you see Jesus injecting himself in the political process? Never! I am not so lathered up about his opinion on the political front as I am in his declaration that this person, or that, is not a christian, he needs to concern himself with his own salvation and leave the judgement of such where it belongs...to God.

 

[chrysostom]

The Pope doesn't want America to build a wall because everything south of the border is Catholic.

the pope cares about everyone -
and -
they don't have to be catholic -

 

[Crucible]

the pope cares about everyone -
and -
they don't have to be catholic -

Oh, yea right :chuckle:

That might be the 'official' idea, but that doesn't make it altogether true either. He dislikes Protestants more than liberal Catholics and Muslims, and there's a self-evident reason why.

 

[Town Heretic]

Oh, yea right :chuckle:
That might be the 'official' idea, but that doesn't make it altogether true either. He dislikes Protestants more than liberal Catholics and Muslims, and there's a self-evident reason why.

Citation to literally anything that supports the notion the current Pope dislikes Protestants. Just noting a continuing trend with some.

I have this from Reuters: "[FONT=playfair_displayregular]Speaking at an annual vespers service in St. Paul's Basilica in Rome attended by representatives of other religions, he asked "forgiveness for the un-gospel like behaviour by Catholics towards Christians of other Churches". He also asked Catholics to forgive those who had persecuted them."

And, [/FONT]“our shared baptism is more important than our differences.”

 

[Crucible]

Citation to literally anything that supports the notion the current Pope dislikes Protestants. Just noting a continuing trend with some.

He reserves criticisms for Protestants and America while extending his arm to Muslims and Jews. It's cut and dry, I don't need to post any kind of citation.

The only thing he has done is ask forgiveness for the persecutions against Protestants, which is pretty much a follow up from Benedict's apology for the Inquisitions.
Which is noble, but also nonetheless moot.

There's only one reason why the Pope is against a southern border, and it's because everything south is Catholic.
And he's from there.

Saying it's about charity is just plain bogus- America is not some dumping ground for everyone's problems, especially when she has her own to solve- if you can't take care of that homeless man under the bridge around the way, why act so concerned for people elsewhere..

 

[Town Heretic]

He reserves criticisms for Protestants and America while extending his arm to Muslims and Jews. It's cut and dry, I don't need to post any kind of citation.

Not in the quotes I've noted. And you just saying a thing is so isn't enough. Heck, you aren't always consistent even inside of that approach.

Spoiler

Originally Posted by Crucible
Black people aren't really offended by the word.

Originally Posted by Crucible
Black people only find the word offensive because they, themselves, have internal animosity toward whites. This is why they say it so freely among themselves but go crazy if a white person does.

There's only one reason why the Pope is against a southern border, and it's because everything south is Catholic.
And he's from there.

From "there"? You do realize how many countries are "south" of our border, I hope. And they don't all even speak the same language...and most of them aren't trying to enter the U.S., legally or otherwise. But the Pope is the head of the Catholic church, so I'd imagine he would be concerned with his flock and with larger issues. He thinks that for some Christians to consider a wall and rejection of people in need isn't particularly Christian. Given support for those isn't an orthodox "Protestant" position, it isn't really fair to frame it that way.

Saying it's about charity is just plain bogus- America is not some dumping ground for everyone's problems, especially when she has her own to solve- if you can't take care of that homeless man under the bridge around the way, why act so concerned for people elsewhere..

It just isn't an either/or either.

 

[Crucible]

Not in the quotes I've noted. And you just saying a thing is so isn't enough. Heck, you aren't always consistent even inside of that approach.

Here you go, I fixed it for you to show what I meant. You just like to whack straw men:

Black people only go about the word as offensive because they, themselves, have internal animosity toward whites. This is why they say it so freely among themselves but go crazy if a white person does.

From "there"?

Argentina and Peru.

He thinks that for some Christians to consider a wall and rejection of people in need isn't particularly Christian. Given support for those isn't an orthodox "Protestant" position, it isn't really fair to frame it that way.

If America cannot take care of it's own who are in poverty, what business does the government have aiding others who are not even citizens?
Again, that is not a country- that is called a dumping ground for the world.

It's easy for Vatican City, it's own small country, to try and dictate how other countries should operate. They would do great pontificating orthodoxy and religious laws if they still had the power- not so much anything else.