yourpoint?
Member
Not one of these verses say that the atonement is limited.
Your lenses need washed so you can see Jesus.
Limited atonement !
- Thread starter beloved57
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Your lenses need washed so you can see Jesus.
beloved57
Well-known member
Yes they do, just not in your preconceived notion on how its to be stated.
When Jesus died on the cross to take away the sin [not "sins" of the world (John 1:29)] He tore the veil of the temple from top to bottom, allowing sinners to approach God in the Holies of Holies.
beloved57
Well-known member
They that are Called !
The Lord Jesus Christ didn't come nor die to save all mankind, but only for them which are called Heb 9:15
And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
There is a called people that Christ came specifically to taste death for, and bring them into their eternal inheritance. In the original its they which are " the called" with the definite article.
These are the same ones called here Rom 8:30
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified
Rom 9:24
Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
1 Cor 1:9
God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord.
1 Pet 2:9
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Remember those in 1 Peter had been redeemed by the blood of Christ 1 Pet 1:18-19 and they were going to obtain an inheritance 1 Pet 1:3-5
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by
the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
This is the same inheritance written of in Heb 9:15 coming to them by means of His death.
The Lord Jesus Christ didn't come nor die to save all mankind, but only for them which are called Heb 9:15
And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
There is a called people that Christ came specifically to taste death for, and bring them into their eternal inheritance. In the original its they which are " the called" with the definite article.
These are the same ones called here Rom 8:30
Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified
Rom 9:24
Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
1 Cor 1:9
God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord.
1 Pet 2:9
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Remember those in 1 Peter had been redeemed by the blood of Christ 1 Pet 1:18-19 and they were going to obtain an inheritance 1 Pet 1:3-5
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by
the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
This is the same inheritance written of in Heb 9:15 coming to them by means of His death.
Jesus died on the cross for the sins of the world, not to save the whole world but to make it possible for sinners to come to Jesus so that they might be saved.
John 3:17
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Right Divider
Body part
Here’s a great verse for that.
1 Timothy 4:10 (KJV) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
beloved57
Well-known member
Christ death wasnt for all mankind, but for those whom He perfected forever who were the sanctified. Heb 10:14
14 For by one offering[His death] he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
These are the ones God the Father chose in Christ before the foundation and so they were sanctified in Him Eph 1:4
4 according as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Jude 1:1
Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called
Furthermore Christs death/offering of Himself for them, sanctified them Heb 10:10
10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
Because His death took away our sins ! Now can this be said of all mankind ? Can this be said of the world of the reprobate which is condemned ? 1 Cor 11:32
32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.
Were they ever sanctified by God the Father or by the death of Christ ? I say God forbid, No
14 For by one offering[His death] he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
These are the ones God the Father chose in Christ before the foundation and so they were sanctified in Him Eph 1:4
4 according as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Jude 1:1
Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called
Furthermore Christs death/offering of Himself for them, sanctified them Heb 10:10
10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
Because His death took away our sins ! Now can this be said of all mankind ? Can this be said of the world of the reprobate which is condemned ? 1 Cor 11:32
32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.
Were they ever sanctified by God the Father or by the death of Christ ? I say God forbid, No
Yes it was.
The ones who are sanctified are those who believe. Those who believe were not determined before the foundation of the world.
Funny how you have to quote letters written to Jews in order to even attempt to make a case for your position.
The good thing is that you don't speak for God. You should refrain from blaspheming God when stating your opinion.
God did not forbid anyone from being saved, sanctified, or otherwise.
Rather, He states quite clearly:
“Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.Or what man is there among you who, if his son asks for bread, will give him a stone?Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent?If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask Him!Therefore, whatever you want men to do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets. - Matthew 7:7-12 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew7:7-12&version=NKJV
7djengo7
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What about Calvinism's inconvenient class of people who are eternally elect yet still unregenerate/unbelieving? Were they sanctified when Christ died? Or, if not then, when? I ask because you say "sanctified them" (past tense), and are seeming thereby to point back to the time of "Christ's death/offering of Himself for them". Were they sanctified before they were even born?
Those people who think God cannot make salvation available to all sinners without saving all sinners seriously and erroneously limit the power of God.
beloved57
Well-known member
People who believe Christ death was for people who never were perfected forever as Per Heb 10:14 which means His death saved them, they limit and deny the efficacious nature and success of His Death, which boils down to unbelief. No such thing as making salvation available !
False.
Derf
Well-known member
Why does His death save anybody in your view? Aren't they saved by God changing them, regenerating them, before they even believe on His death? If they are already regenerated before belief, then belief is of no account.
Rebel for truth
Member
Christ said if I be lifted up I will draw all men unto me.
One thing some have a tendency to overlook, not consider, is God our Father already knows the future. He already knows who will and who won't accept the salvation offered and to us - it may look like predestination or limited atonement _ actually it's not. God already knew who to give to our Lord as his - he saw and knew our choices knew the life we would live new the decisions we would make new whether we would choose hls way or the way of the devil.
Yeshua came down to Earth and limited himself, his teachings to his chosen people that through them the rest of the world can hear of and decide whether they want to accept his salvation. Prophecy must be fulfilled and it already been prophesied several times in the Old Testament that Abraham said would be scattered into all nations and be a blessing to them. Look at one of the scriptures Genesis 26:3-5 where God tells Abraham his seed will be a blessing to the world.
Romans 10:13-15 whosoever called upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. How can you all upon him if you are not saved, and how can you be saved, if you haven't heard.
Matthew 24:14 and this Gospel of the Kingdom must be preached to All Nations and then the end will come.
Every human has a chance at salvation, it is up to that individual to decide whether they accepted or rejected. Salvation only comes through our Lord which is offered to all.
No, He doesn't.
Because that's what it is.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
No, He didn't.
His? His disciples, you mean? Yeah, the ones Jesus Himself picked at the start of His ministry... Of course God know to give Jesus them.
No, He didn't.
His Elect refers to Israel. "The Elect Lady." They are His chosen people.
He avoided the Gentiles. According to the Mosaic law, they were unclean, and no one under the law was to associate with them.
That being the promised Kingdom of Israel on Earth, not eternal life in Heaven.
Many, MANY prophecies in the Bible went unfulfilled.
Cite please.
Being a blessing to all nations is not "being scattered into all nations" and the nation as a whole extinguished...
God also said that if He promises to build up, to establish a nation, and they do evil, and rebel against Him, then He will no longer do that which He promised to do.
Israel rebelled against Him, and Acts 8 was the straw that broke the camel's back, the final nail in the coffin, where God cut off Israel, and grafted in the Body of Christ, the mystery kept secret since the foundation of the world.
Why did you switch out the words "have not believed" with "are not saved"? They mean very different things!
Here's what it actually says:
How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, Who bring glad tidings of good things!” - Romans 10:14-15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans10:14-15&version=NKJV
Again, Christ is talking about the Kingdom of Israel, which has very little to do, if anything, with the Body of Christ.
And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come. - Matthew 24:14 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew24:14&version=NKJV
AMEN!
Amazing how you can contradict everything you just said in one sentence!
Jesus died for the sins of the world so that whosoever called on Him might be saved.
Romans 10:1
Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.
Rebel for truth
Member
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beloved57
Well-known member
No its true.
Wrong.