The Scriptures teach Trinity. You just don't see it.
Jesus is God
- Thread starter Bright Raven
- Start date
The Scriptures teach Trinity. You just don't see it.
keypurr
Well-known member
My opinion, the father wanted to create the universe and put life on it. He knew that there would be problems before he started. He needed the son's help, so he created the son, Christ, and he was pleased that his son contained his fullness. I wonder why he told us that. The son was used by the father to make everything in heaven and earth. The son was later needed to destroy the works of Satan. To me, the Holy Spirit is the power the Father uses to do his work. I question if it is another person in a trinity God. It is a force that has limitless power to fulfill the Father's bidding. It is an agent of the most high God, which is the Father.
Posted from the TOL App!
genuineoriginal
New member
Why would God look for a man to stand in the gap?
Ezekiel 22:30 30 And I sought for a man among them, that should make up the hedge, and stand in the gap before me for the land, that I should not destroy it: but I found none. |
Why would God ask who He should send?
Isaiah 6:8 8 Also I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, Here am I; send me. |
Why would God send His Son?
Luke 20:9-13 9 Then began he to speak to the people this parable; A certain man planted a vineyard, and let it forth to husbandmen, and went into a far country for a long time. 10 And at the season he sent a servant to the husbandmen, that they should give him of the fruit of the vineyard: but the husbandmen beat him, and sent him away empty. 11 And again he sent another servant: and they beat him also, and entreated him shamefully, and sent him away empty. 12 And again he sent a third: and they wounded him also, and cast him out. 13 Then said the lord of the vineyard, What shall I do? I will send my beloved son: it may be they will reverence him when they see him. |
For you.
genuineoriginal
New member
How does this verse teach the Trinity?
John 12:49 49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. |
genuineoriginal
New member
God did not know me when He sent His Son, so your answer is an evasion tactic.
How this not speak of it?
1 John 1:1-2King James Version (KJV)
1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;
2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us
genuineoriginal
New member
How this not speak of it?
1 John 1:1-2King James Version (KJV)
1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;
2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us
Please point out the trinity in those verses, all three members, and the relationships of the three members mentioned in them.
keypurr
Well-known member
I see a trinity of purpose but only one most high God.
Everything and everyone belong to the most high for whatever his pleasure may be. Power and authority was given to Christ by his God.
Posted from the TOL App!
Answer your own question. Who does the verse speak of. God does not always speak as a Trinity but separately as Father, Son or Holy Spirit.
As here. Peter recognizes the Spirit as God
Acts 5:3-4 King James Version (KJV)
3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
genuineoriginal
New member
My claim is that the Bible does not teach the trinity.
You claim the Bible does teach the trinity.
Your verses seem to back up my claim much more than they do your claim.
That is why I asked you to point out how, specifically, the verses you posted show that there is a Father, a Son, and a Holy Spirit that are all the same being while still being separate persons.
You will find it impossible to do that with the verses you posted.
The word of life and the father.
By my count that is two and the verses do not join them together into one being.
It appears you have misread the verses.
Here are some that clear up the confusion:
Romans 8:26-27 26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. 27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God. |
The Spirit makes intercession between man and God (he that searches the hearts).
If the Spirit was God, he would not need to make intercession.
Romans 8:34 34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. |
If Christ was God, He could not sit at the right hand of God, nor would He need to make intercession with God for us.
Romans 8:11 11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. |
This last verse has all three members of what is known as the trinity, but according to the verse, only the Spirit and God are actually part of anything like a trinity, since Jesus is dead and has to be raised up from the dead by God through His Spirit.
No, the Bible does not teach the trinity and , using the same techniques that are used to explain the verses in a manner that can be used to support the trinity, for every verse used to support the trinity a hundred verses can be found to show there is no trinity.
So, whether the Trinity is a true doctrine or not, it is not taught by the Bible.
JosephR
New member
Is the Spirit of God any different then the Holy Spirit? For example in Ezekiel God said He would put HIS SPIRIT in them and cause them to obey His laws and keep them.To me that is the Spirit of God, no different then God , just His will acting apon the people.
The Holy Sirit is a different person from the Father.
JosephR
New member
I dont agree with the opening statements of this org. They say that not accepting a doctrine will exclude you from the Gospel. The Gospel is very simple and clearly says that Jesus was raised by the Father.It says to have faith in that and you will be saved, nothing about and this or that too about Jesus divinity.
What say you?
It is not a doctrine, it is a teaching. People may choose as they wish.
JosephR
New member
OK so it is specifically the comforter that Jesus promised the Father would send when He left.
And in your heart none of this seems odd when you think of the first commandment?
No, not at all. Look at the relationship between the Father and the Son and that is the relationship He wants us to have with Him
No one bathes anyone with positive reps... and I rarely give out any rep much less neg! I just don't have the time nor really care about rep!
You should seek the truth and not rep for yourself!
KNOW THIS>>> Human guilt is worthless in God's plan!!
Paul
Plenty reps (including any thing more than a few spaced out followers or supporters) on earth generally means none (no reps and followers or supporters) in heaven.
Fact is those who seek and store their treasures on earth have none or very little, in heaven.
The only guide one has to being correct and/or glorified by God in heaven, at this time, is to earn very few reps on earth from among one's fellow humans.
If more that a few people discern wisdom in your posts (and therefore rep you and/or follow you) then rest assured that your ideas are the erroneous garden variety rendition that cannot be the Truth which saves and delivers. Remember many are called but only a few have and know Truth and therefore not err and are saved and delivered.
At this time, the bigger the church, which promote their teachings as Christianity, the bigger the curse they are for aspiring Christians, on earth.
Only a few will have and/or know truth and the Truth. And truth and the Truth will definitely and seriously offend the sensibilities of the billion strong traditional Christians. Truth and the Truth will definitely be totally foreign to these billion strong 'Christians' . . . a billion strong cannot be the chosen few.
This is the best guide to determine if your ideas are in fact truth and the Truth which saves and delivers.
Rest assured that it (i.e. knowledge of the Truth) is no popularity contest among rep-giving humans.
Salvation and deliverance is the reality of the chosen few because only they (the few) know and have the path to Truth and the Truth.
You will find no one can be or is saved and delivered in any of those small, medium or big time supposed Christian institution or church.
It is far better to be called 'coo-coo', 'blasphemer' and other such negative things by the great majority.
Last edited:
genuineoriginal
New member
Well, it was a short read.
However, it started with a false premise and failed to prove its point.
The Bible states that a person must believe that Jesus is the Son of God in order to be saved.
Nowhere does the Bible even hint that a person must assume that Jesus is God in order to be saved.
On the contrary, the Bible states that Jesus intercedes with the Father and that Jesus was given authority by the Father.
No, the mark of a cult is not believing the words written in the Bible about the relationship between Jesus and His Father.