Aimiel
Well-known member
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't see anyone saying: "Keep MY commandments," do you? Jesus is capable of giving commandments because He is God, in The Flesh. If you don't recognize that, you're none of His.
Jesus CANNOT be Jehovah/YHVH God
- Thread starter Dartman
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You are trying to artificially narrow the evidence, and have carefully selected an extremely specific critera. The fact remains, Jesus and Moses were BOTH capable of giving commandments .... since Jehovah gave BOTH prophets Jehovah's own words.
Again, they are also suggestions; I never said don't obey them. But it is to think laws are not based on suggestions, and that suggestions can't be owned by law enforcement.
And besides the law of moses, Jesus was given other commandments by his father. They were all his suggestions, because he obeyed them.
Don't claim your statement proves your point, and keep my suggestion that it doesn't.
Jesus said only God is good.
SABATH, was Jesus good?
If you say He was not good, then He was not a worthy sacrifice for all mankind's sin, which makes Him a liar.
If you say He was good, then you acknowledge He is God.
Aimiel
Well-known member
I don't claim anything, other than to believe Scripture. I only see ONE Person in Scripture saying, "Keep My commandments," and He is God.
Aimiel
Well-known member
The difference being that Moses heard God speak and handed over commandments that God wrote with His Own Finger. Jesus is The Living Word of God. He ALWAYS did The Will of His Father, because they're One. All the fullness of The Godhead lives Bodily in Him.
This is an appeal to ignorance and/or conjecture. You have no evidence that David could call God's commandments his.
And, Jesus spoke what his God commanded him to speak, and did the works his God showed him.
No he is the fulfillment of his God's words.A said:
True, but it's because Jesus subjected his own will to his God's will.A said:
True, "even as" the believers are ALSO One with Jesus, and his God.A said:
Jesus' God ordained Jesus, exalted Jesus, GAVE Jesus all power, and all authority, Jesus obeyed his God perfectly, and transformed his spirit to match his God's spirit. That's the fulness of Godliness all right!A said:
Not one of those verses has anyone, including Moses, claiming the law as his own.
The commandments Moses gave came from God. Do you deny this?
Again, you are attempting to artificially limit the evidence. Jesus himself use the phrase "what did Moses command you"?
Jehovah Himself stated;
Deut 18:17-19 And Jehovah said unto me, They have well said that which they have spoken. 18 I will raise them up a prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee; and I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.
John 5:21 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
John 5:19-20 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. 20 For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel.
John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
So, let's cut the word games.... DO you believe Jehovah and Jesus, or not?
Of course they came from God.
The commandments Jesus gave came from God. Do you deny this?
Just because Moses commanded them doesn't make them his commands.
Jesus said:
“If you love Me, keep My commandments. - John 14:15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John14:15&version=NKJV
And
He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him.” - John 14:21 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John14:21&version=NKJV
And
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love. - John 15:10 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John15:10&version=NKJV
And
This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. - John 15:12 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John15:12&version=NKJV
"My words" = God's words
:think:
"all that [God] shall command him"
:think:
"My words" = God's words
:think:
"in My name" = by [God's] authority
:think:
I believe Him, and not you.
:think:
“If you love Me, keep My commandments. - John 14:15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John14:15&version=NKJV
And
He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him.” - John 14:21 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John14:21&version=NKJV
And
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love. - John 15:10 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John15:10&version=NKJV
And
This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. - John 15:12 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John15:12&version=NKJV
"My words" = God's words
:think:
"all that [God] shall command him"
:think:
"My words" = God's words
:think:
"in My name" = by [God's] authority
:think:
Sounds like Jesus is claiming God's commands as His own.
Which would be blasphemy, of course, if Jesus were not God.
But since Jesus IS God, there is no issue.
Jesus is God, so no, I don't deny that the commandments Jesus claims are His commandments came from God, be ause they are God's commandments. Thanks for proving my point.
Just like Jesus.
Jesus clarified EXACTLY what he meant;JR said:
John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
John 12:49-50 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.
DO YOU BELIEVE HIM, OR NOT??
Your ploys are dishonest. So, like trying to pin down a greased piglet,
Jesus says his commandments came from his Father. .... and Jesus says specifically they were NOT from himself.
Do you deny this??
Are you oneness, and believe Jesus was his own Father??
7djengo7
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You didn't answer the questions I asked you.
Again, here're the questions I asked you:
- Do you call more than one person "Jesus"?
- How many persons, besides Jesus, Himself, do you call "Jesus"?
Here's another, a third question for you to stonewall against:
- Would you say that Paul was calling another person--besides Jesus, Himself--"Jesus", when he used the phrase "another Jesus"?
Apple7
New member
Jesus' God ordained Jesus, exalted Jesus, GAVE Jesus all power, and all authority, Jesus obeyed his God perfectly, and transformed his spirit to match his God's spirit. That's the fulness of Godliness all right!
And now Father, glorify Me with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the existence of the world. John 17.5
Since scripture maintains that the Second Person of The Trinity has always existed, please tell us what exactly Jesus gained that He didn't always have to begin with...
:blabla:
No, He does not.
If He had, then why did He call them His commandments?
Why not just say, "My Father's commandments"?
Jesus called them HIS commandments because they are, in fact, Jesus' commandments.
Jesus was the one who gave the commandments to Moses.
No, He did not.
He called the commandments "My commandments."
Why do you deny what is plainly written?
Was Jesus lying or being deceptive when He called the commandments "My commandments", in that they weren't really His commandments, but the Father's?
Are you now calling Jesus a liar?
:blabla:
7djengo7
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Where does Jesus say his commandmentS came from his Father?
Where does Jesus say specifically his commandmentS were NOT from himself?
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