No, not only religion. What communism did to the people under its sway, in the hands of Stalin and Mao, made the Inquisition look like a frat hazing.
Islamic Terrorists France: 12 dead, police gunned down
- Thread starter Nazaroo
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Levolor
New member
This. ^
Fanatically inclined individuals will find an outlet for their impulses.
shagster01
New member
Then let's send our boys to war with six shooters.
Morpheus
New member
The Blaze? Glenn Beck is never slanted, right? His photo is in the Oxford English Dictionary next to "wing nut".
Jose Fly
New member
:sigh:
Again, just because I identify religion as a source of violence, that doesn't mean I am saying it's the only source.
Look, I understand why religious people don't like having the history of religious violence and oppression pointed out. But from my POV (as a completely non-religious person), that's to be expected and is a necessary step on the path to a more rational, and less superstitious, society.
If you have read the Bible you'll notice that in some or most cases our God passes it as a test on his servants to punish the criminals and transgressors themselves on this earth. Nations are judged on earth - the nations of Noah, Lut etc were totally destroyed for their refusal to submit to our God. Judgements and execution is passed on by our Lord himself but when God's laws are to establish he tests his servants - they have to maintain justice on earth and rule by God's laws. Individuals are to be judged on the Day of Judgement. This is the basics of the way of the Lord. For example the Air Asia disaster might have been as a punishment to some on board - the innocents would be judged on the Day of Reckoning.
All the nations who refused to submit to God was destroyed totally. Except the nation of Israel and the nation of Muhammad (pbuh). They are only punished portion by portion and by means of the hands of men. This is the fundamental way of God if you only did read the OT with understanding. The way of our God never changes.
Edward Snowden is considered a traitor and traitors are punishable by death even in the US. The same in the lands ruled by God's law. Traitors are those who do what they do against God.
The burka was banned. This cannot be tolerated in a civilized democratic society.
Levolor
New member
If it is true as atheists say that people need something to believe in and that is why there is a
And so the rotation continues... (watching the wheels go round and round).
Something has to change a person from within to have what you desire, and only Christ accomplishes this (no matter what religion a person might be in... if they are seeking for God, they will find Christ).
Quincy
New member
Is it really religion that creates evil or superstitious people.... or is it the other way around?
I would bet big on the problem you're perceiving being a human flaw, period. Religion or not, they'd still be horrible people. On the contrary, if some people didn't have a fear of their deity, things would be far worse.
What about the people before Christ? What about those who have not heard about Christ?
This is wrong. Anyone who seeks the Lord of Creation, anyone who seeks to worship Him and to ask for Help from Him alone would find Islam. We Muslims are the ONLY people in the world to declare almost atleast 17 times a day that we desire to worship the Lord of Creation alone and to seek help from Him alone, after we have declared that all praise and gratitude is for Him alone. Tell me do Christians call their object of worship Lord of all Creation? They usually don't. Very rarely. They say Saviour, King, Master - but even the devil can pretend to be these.
Why do you need 16 more times a day to declare this? Didn't you mean it the first time?
At least 17 times a day.
This Charming Manc
Well-known member
If you had read the teaching of Jesus, you would understand the vengeance is to be left in the hands of God.
Noah and Abraham didn't hand out gods judgement to anyone.
Don't you justify murder for people who drew a picture you didn't like then demand rights in a free and democratic society.
If you dont get murder of people for drawing cartoons is wrong, you have no place to determine anything about a free and democratic society is, you obviously dont understand the concept.
What do you want sharia law or democray? you cant have both!
I'm fine with that, though the "again" is odd because you hadn't made a qualification between the point where Levolor noted fanaticism was at the root, you responded with a singular notation of religious fanaticism and I objected.
Doesn't bother me. I tend to point out that the problem is rarely with religion (excepting Aztecs and Thuggees, etc.) but with some men using any idea as a means to empower themselves at the expense of others, that atheistic ideas have led to a great deal of death and human suffering, Stalin and Mao between them killing millions upon millions of their own and others, by way of.
There's nothing irrational about the belief in God as a contextual choice. In fact, I'd argue it's a more rational choice. But in any event I'm happy Lev's broader understanding is shared after all.
Only the wicked ones. Islam is of the devil, and so you are you.
Actions are of 2 types. The good and the evil. The good are those done for the sake of our Lord God the Creator. The bad are the ones done against His Order. These are called sins.
Sins are of two types. Forgivable without repentance and unforgivable without repentance. The latter only encompasses Shirk - the greatest sin and the antitheiss of the fundamental message given by the Messengers of God - Tawhid - Unity of God. Shirk is the belief that we are in need of intercession with God (that God changes his decision based on the wishes of his followers), and the belief that God has partners or sons or daughters or anything that negates the Unity in Lordship and Worship.
Every sin carries a magnitude of shirk. The purpose of salaah is to negate these effects. To declare continuously that all praise and gratitude and worship and calls for help is to the Lord of Creation and to Him alone and to no other ilah but Allah - The God. That is the purpose and that is Islam.
Cite?
Vengeance is to be left in the hands of God unless God specifically commands us to maintain justice. You forget the kings of Israel. They established sharia on their lands. God's laws.
Nations are to be judged on earth. All other nations except Israel and the Ummah of Muhammad (pbuh) was judged and executed by God himself. The nation of Israel and our modern world is left to the leaders to maintain justice and to punish people for crimes. God is great
I bow down to the values set forth by your God and my God - the God of Abraham and Moses. Did He ever order democracy? You cannot worship God and at the same time spit at the values He considers sacred.
Glen beck didnt write that article, are you unable to respond to whats stated in it?
Alate_One
Well-known member
No, Allah isn't the God of the Bible, it's not the God of Christianity. The Allah of Islam is a syncretic deity which includes the ancient Arabic moon god, hence your crescent and Kaaba's black stone. Muhammad took from the religions he was exposed to and created his own.
The God of the bible is one of mercy, not only judgement. See Ninevah and Jonah in the OT, see Christ in the new. Where is the mercy of Islam?
When the prophet Elisha was mocked in scripture, God sent bears, no human beings were commanded to take revenge, it wasn't necessary.
And that's due to protection of the state. Freedom of expression isn't 100% of anything you say, but something that's merely offensive? No reason to kill anyone, state or no. Did Jesus order anyone killed when he was said to have a demon? No.
That doesn't mean you kill people.
Not even the reputed hardcore anti-Islam scholars deny that Allah has nothing with the moon God. The Allah of the Quran himself says "Do not worship the sun and the moon but worship the one who created them both".
Come on say that Allah is not the God of the Bible in front of a Coptic Christian. Hundreds of years before English was even established as a language (no "God") Arabic Bibles used the word "Allah" for the God of Abraham. The polytheists considered Allah as the Creator but associated daughters and what not to Him. Allah is above all what they and you say of Him.
The black stone is nothing but a stone from heaven and we do not worship it. In fact its broken currently into pieces. I have touched it and the only reason I have done so was to imitate the prophet who used to touch it during tawaf as a mark of beginning the tawaf.
If you are unsure of Allah then do not speak of Him. Allah is Jehovah is Yahweh is the One who Is.
All the Prophets of the Bible including Jesus are prophets of Islam. All of them were sent as a mercy to the worlds. God is Merciful. 113 out of 114 chapters of the Quran begins by declaring God as the Eternally Merciful and the Exceptionally Merciful. The last Prophet (pbuh) also showed exceptional mercy. He was tortured in Taif but he refused to allow the angels to destroy its population. Instead he made a dua (a supplication/prayer) that their offspring would be Muslims. Taif is now 100% Muslim. This is just one example, but it is significant because it shows that mercy is for the good and not for the evil where it clashes with Justice.
(On a side note notice that the descendants of the family of Christ in Palestine are all Muslim, the Middle East and the Kingdom of God was taken from Israel and given to the Ishmaelites making them a great nation but not the only nation in the kingdom of God)
Alate_One
Well-known member
And that explains why you pray toward the Kaaba which houses a rock . . .
I am aware of this, but the Allah Muslims worship is not the God of the Bible. You may claim it to be, but it is different. And that's clear from the characteristics you assign to your God. Impersonal, lacking in mercy, "beyond" good and evil.
You want to be a part of the Abrahamic family, but Islam is not like Christianity and Judaism.
And then we have Sharia law which is without mercy. Mandate of the death penalty for a wide variety of offenses, no mercy, no refuge.
Right, your last prophet compared to Christ is a joke by any objective measure. Christ didn't just pray for those that harmed Him, He died for them.
Uhh pretty sure the descendants of the family of Christ were are all Jewish. If any converted, I'm sure it was at swordpoint.