Is marital rape scripturally defensible?

[Crucible]

Control in marriage does not mean that the husband is a dictator and the wife is required ti immediately summit to her husbands every whim. Your model for marriage has more in common with Islam than Christ.

Men have no control in their marriage. You never experienced actual control to know that you really don't have any. Women have all the power and if you try and take it she'll divorce you and take all your things.

That statement may not apply to every marriage, but as a general statement, I can't say it's inaccurate. In fact, it's the very reason why we are even sitting here talking about 'marital rape' and not the thousands, more frequent injustices done to husbands all the time in this country- you've lost the ability of control.


And
My model for marriage is very Abrahamic. Christianity convicts people with a more graceful way of going about marriage than that of Islam, but they otherwise a lot alike.

Why do you think Christian marriages were the way the were for 1900 years? Feminism comes along and changes your perception.

 

[ok doser]

Who decides what reasons are legitimate?

good question

my answer - the Church

 

[Quetzal]

Men have no control in their marriage. You never experienced actual control to know that you really don't have any. Women have all the power and if you try and take it she'll divorce you and take all your things.

Someone is bitter, sounds like things didn't go according to plan for you. :chuckle:

 

[Crucible]

Someone is bitter, sounds like things didn't go according to plan for you. :chuckle:

Why do I have to be bitter? Why can't it be that I'm just speaking reality?
Ohhhh,
because you deny that reality..

And so it goes. The hostage calling another bitter.

 

[HisServant]

Why do you think Christian marriages were the way the were for 1900 years? Feminism comes along and changes your perception.

They were that way because women were property and had no where to go should they leave their husband.

If you understand, Jesus' teachings about marriage, you would know he started to undo that... he started to reverse the trend of women being property.

But the male dominated western Europe refused to listen to Jesus' teachings and continued to force women into marriage (slavery).

Once women had viable alternatives to living as cows, they started talking those alternatives.

Now, feminism is a mess, it doesn't want equality, it wants superiority.

In the end, pick your mate wisely, and cherish them and encourage them to grow.

 

[Quetzal]

Why do I have to be bitter? Why can't it be that I'm just speaking reality?
Ohhhh,
because you deny that reality..

And so it goes. The hostage calling another bitter.

Men have no control in their marriage. You never experienced actual control to know that you really don't have any. Women have all the power and if you try and take it she'll divorce you and take all your things.

That statement may not apply to every marriage, but as a general statement, I can't say it's inaccurate.

Is this based on personal experience or on a study?

 

[WizardofOz]

good question

my answer - the Church

And what reasosn are legitimate according to the Church?

 

[CabinetMaker]

Men have no control in their marriage. You never experienced actual control to know that you really don't have any. Women have all the power and if you try and take it she'll divorce you and take all your things.

That statement may not apply to every marriage, but as a general statement, I can't say it's inaccurate. In fact, it's the very reason why we are even sitting here talking about 'marital rape' and not the thousands, more frequent injustices done to husbands all the time in this country- you've lost the ability of control.


And
My model for marriage is very Abrahamic. Christianity convicts people with a more graceful way of going about marriage than that of Islam, but they otherwise a lot alike.

Why do you think Christian marriages were the way the were for 1900 years? Feminism comes along and changes your perception.

Please define for us very specifically exactly what control men have lost in terms of marriage.

 

[ok doser]

And what reasosn are legitimate according to the Church?

that gets a little harder to answer, unless you're talking about the RCC (in which case i'll defer to RCCers like trad)

marital issues used to be addressed within the religious community, instead of using secular resources

and immodest behavior was severely addressed


imperfect? of course

but the feminist push to move control from religious structures to secular structures that they could better influence (read warp, pervert, etc) has been a disaster


for one thing, it's created a generation of youth who have been raised to believe perversion is normal, who would seek to have sex in a coatroom at a wedding

 

[Crucible]

Is this based on personal experience or on a study?

It's based on observation, testimonies, and having a good intuition and gauging of women individually. I prefer not labor under the delusion that men can't figure a woman out, while women portend to know everything of a man.

 

[Crucible]

Please define for us very specifically exactly what control men have lost in terms of marriage.

~everything~

Don't know how more specific I can be.

Just give me one good example of otherwise. Wives are now the heads of the husbands, if she wishes for that to be the case. And guess what you are going to do about it? Nothing, except make a sad little attempt at putting your foot down which won't make nary a mouse tremble.

They aren't nearly as concerned about you leaving them as you are them leaving you, and they know it. And in a divorce guess who's going to get the most out of it?
So before you go and try to deny reality.. well don't. Don't deny reality. Make an account at what is always joked about of marriages is what actually hinders and destroys most of them.

 

[bybee]

~everything~

Don't know how more specific I can be.

Just give me one good example of otherwise. Wives are now the heads of the husbands, if she wishes for that to be the case. And guess what you are going to do about it? Nothing, except make a sad little attempt at putting your foot down which won't make nary a mouse tremble.

They aren't nearly as concerned about you leaving them as you are them leaving you, and they know it.

What a pathetic cry baby! A woman wants a man! Not a crybaby!

 

[CabinetMaker]

~everything~

Don't know how more specific I can be.

Just give me one good example of otherwise. Wives are now the heads of the husbands, if she wishes for that to be the case. And guess what you are going to do about it? Nothing, except make a sad little attempt at putting your foot down which won't make nary a mouse tremble.

They aren't nearly as concerned about you leaving them as you are them leaving you, and they know it.

So all you have is an empty platitude. If you cannot say what control a man should have then how can you say men have lost control?

 

[ClimateSanity]

that gets a little harder to answer, unless you're talking about the RCC (in which case i'll defer to RCCers like trad)

marital issues used to be addressed within the religious community, instead of using secular resources

and immodest behavior was severely addressed


imperfect? of course

but the feminist push to move control from religious structures to secular structures that they could better influence (read warp, pervert, etc) has been a disaster


for one thing, it's created a generation of youth who have been raised to believe perversion is normal, who would seek to have sex in a coatroom at a wedding

You nailed it.

 

[Rusha]

Please define for us very specifically exactly what control men have lost in terms of marriage.

It's rather telling that anyone would see marriage as an issue of control rather than a relationship between the marital partners.

 

[ClimateSanity]

So the wife can say 'no' to sex under certain circumstances?

Like being in a public place? Or if she is sick or too tired? Or if she is menstrating? Or if she just isn't in the mood for no reason at all?

Who decides what reasons are legitimate?

You named a few. Just not in the mood is no reason. If a woman will not even subject herself to letting him seduce and undress her and touch her in a normal home setting barring grave illness, she has violated the marriage contract.

 

[Crucible]

So all you have is an empty platitude. If you cannot say what control a man should have then how can you say men have lost control?

A wife can put her foot down and you are basically her hostage. That's just the fact of modern marriage. You can have an illusion that you have control, she can make you feel like you do, but when it comes down to it, you are being taken captive and if you escape it's going to cost you a hell of a lot financially because the judge is going to rule in her favor.

I don't have an empty platitude, I have reality. You can take that feminizing, myth making, denial dumping machine somewhere it'll work. The patriarchs took control of the women because, collectively, emancipated women are intrinsically immoral. Their face, feminism, is an ugly smear on 1st world society and makes patriarchy look like gold. Patriarchy took men out of huts into civilization, feminism put man in the kennels they built.
Good job.

 

[Quetzal]

It's based on observation, testimonies, and having a good intuition and gauging of women individually. I prefer not labor under the delusion that men can't figure a woman out, while women portend to know everything of a man.

So it's personal? Just say that.

 

[Quetzal]

You named a few. Just not in the mood is no reason. If a woman will not even subject herself to letting him seduce and undress her and touch her in a normal home setting barring grave illness, she has violated the marriage contract.

:rotfl: Wow, are you married? Have you ever been married?

 

[ClimateSanity]

~everything~

Don't know how more specific I can be.

Just give me one good example of otherwise. Wives are now the heads of the husbands, if she wishes for that to be the case. And guess what you are going to do about it? Nothing, except make a sad little attempt at putting your foot down which won't make nary a mouse tremble.

They aren't nearly as concerned about you leaving them as you are them leaving you, and they know it. And in a divorce guess who's going to get the most out of it?
So before you go and try to deny reality.. well don't. Don't deny reality. Make an account at what is always joked about of marriages is what actually hinders and destroys most of them.

They may call you bitter but this is a clear blast of reality. Deny it at your peril. I suppose its better to deny for Sanities sake. Live in happy delusion and God forbid you ever really get your wife ticked off.