In Other News Today.....

aCultureWarrior

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Answered in the article that you didn't read...
.

I've read all of the lies Aaron. Your kind is for the decriminalization of all drugs, you don't care about the people it destroys.


1.2 Personal Privacy

Libertarians support the rights recognized by the Fourth Amendment to be secure in our persons, homes, and property. Protection from unreasonable search and seizure should include records held by third parties, such as email, medical, and library records. Only actions that infringe on the rights of others can properly be termed crimes. We favor the repeal of all laws creating “crimes” without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes.
http://www.lp.org/platform

You're just using Portugal as an excuse to push decriminalization here in the US.
 

aCultureWarrior

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francis

time's man of the year

And Frank had such stiff competition.

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WizardofOz

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:rotfl: You are hilarious! I knew these pages looked familiar. You are absolutely incapable of learning from your past mistakes....

Scientific Proof that Drug Decriminalization in Portugal Saved Lives and Killed People
http://www.samefacts.com/2010/10/dr...on-in-portugal-saved-lives-and-killed-people/

You have already presented this link and were thoroughly debunked by flipper and myself here

Oh man, this is hi-larious!

I was wondering what sort of institution would be so blatantly dishonest in how they portray statistics, so I followed the link ACultureWarrior gave for his Portugal chart.

Turns out, the chart he posted was from a site showing how different groups with different agendas could deliberately fudge statistics to tell the story they wanted to tell.

The chart he chose was an example from what the author called "The Draconian Foundation" whose deliberate agenda was to use statistics to lie to make drug decriminalization look worse than it is.

Just for reference, the opposite side of the fudging story was told by the Glibertarian Institute, who want to cherrypick a story that makes decriminalization look like the best thing that ever happened.

ACultureWarrior, you're the sort of person who links to examples of how not to handle statistics as examples that support his position. This means one or more of the following is true:

1. You can't read properly
2. You're a liar
3. You are one of those epic morons who think The Onion is a factual newspaper
4. You are some sort of post-modern comedian.

I'm thinking it's 1 and 3., but I'd like to hear what you think it might be. So which is it?

So aCW, which is it? :think:

As I said when you first passed this link as helping your case: the author is mocking people who use the chart you provided as evidence and you're too thick to realize it. "No intellectual integrity" and "misrepresentation", that is what Humphreys is saying about you.


More hilarity! :rotfl:

From this link:

The European Coalition for Just and Effective Drug Policies (ENCOD) brings together European citizens who believe that drug prohibition is an immoral and insane* policy. We call for legal regulation as the only sensible and effective way to diminish drug-related problems, reduce organised crime and free up tax money for health, education and social programmes.



Become a member and help encod end the war on drug

Nice links! :hammer:

In all fairness, the encod.org article linked to a Wall Street Journal article from 2010. Here is a more recent one...from this year:

source


Have We Lost the War on Drugs?
After more than four decades of a failed experiment, the human cost has become too high. It is time to consider the decriminalization of drug use and the drug market.



:chuckle: Just another aCW fail.
 

WizardofOz

New member
I've read all of the lies Aaron. Your kind is for the decriminalization of all drugs, you don't care about the people it destroys.

1.2 Personal Privacy

Libertarians support the rights recognized by the Fourth Amendment to be secure in our persons, homes, and property. Protection from unreasonable search and seizure should include records held by third parties, such as email, medical, and library records. Only actions that infringe on the rights of others can properly be termed crimes. We favor the repeal of all laws creating “crimes” without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes.
http://www.lp.org/platform

You're just using Portugal as an excuse to push decriminalization here in the US.

"My kind"? Quote the Libertarian platform all you'd like. It just shows how dishonest you are. I have told you countless times :sozo: I am not a Libertarian.

Never have been, never will be. Don't let it stop you from lying though. Lying is just a part of your (lack of) character.
 

aCultureWarrior

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I have told you countless times :sozo: I am not a Libertarian.

Here's two questions for you:

What do you call someone who voted for Gary Johnson for President, who by the way, ran on the Libertarian Party Platform?

What do you call someone who uses a quote from Ron Paul, who is a "lifetime member of the Libertarian Party" on his TOL signature?

Why are you so ashamed of Libertarianism Aaron, it fits your anti-God/pagan agenda perfectly.
 
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aCultureWarrior

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Have We Lost the War on Drugs?
After more than four decades of a failed experiment, the human cost has become too high. It is time to consider the decriminalization of drug use and the drug market.

Do you agree with the above Aaron? How about you Doc?
 

aCultureWarrior

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Nice links!

Gosh Aaron, you missed one, in fact it was my favorite.

Decriminalization of drugs in Portugal – The real facts!

Tuesday, 02 February 2010

The national press, and especially the foreign, has referred with outlandish insistence, on the eve of two important elections in Portugal, the "resounding success" of the decriminalization of drugs launched in 2001 by the Socialist Government, neglecting all other European countries and in prejudice of the guidelines of the UN Conventions of which Portugal is a signatory.

Respect for the truth of the matter requires the Association for a Drug Free Portugal (APLD) to clarify to the Portuguese, and others, the real consequences of the implementation of this current policy, independent of particular party affiliation. Portugal adopted a unique and unmistakably questionable 'solution' to manage the nightmare of drugs.

Recent articles in the weekly British magazine, The Economist and The Cato Institute of Washington promote government options as a legitimate right. The problem is the rest; the manipulation of the facts and numbers is unacceptable!

In 2006, the total number of deaths as a consequence of overdose did not diminish radically compared to 2000, nor did the percentage of drug addicts with AIDS decrease significantly (from 57% to 43%). The opposite occurred.

Portugal faces a worrying deterioration of the drug situation. The facts prove "With 219 deaths from 'overdose' per year, Portugal has one of the worst results, with one death every two days. Along with Greece, Austria and Finland, Portugal registered an increase of deaths by more than 30% in 2005 " and " Portugal remains the country with the highest increase of AIDS as a result of injecting drugs (85 new cases per million residents in 2005, when the majority of countries do not surpass 5 cases per million). Portugal is the only country that recorded a recent increase, with 36 new cases estimated per million in 2005 when in 2004 only 30 were registered" (European Observatory for Drugs and Drug Addiction 2007). The European report also confirmed that in 2006, Portugal had registered 703 new cases of SIDA, which corresponds to a rate eight times higher than the European average!

The decriminalization of drugs in Portugal did not in any way decrease levels of consumption. On the contrary, "the consumption of drugs in Portugal increased by 4.2% - the percentage of people who have experimented with drugs at least once in their lifetime increased from 7.8% in 2001 to 12% in 2007 (IDT-Institute for Drugs and Drug Addiction Portuguese, 2008).

With regard to the consumption of cocaine "the latest data (surveys from 2005-2007) confirms the increasing trend during the last year in France, Ireland, Spain, The United Kingdom, Italy, Denmark and Portugal" (EMCDDA 2008). While rates of use of cocaine and amphetamine doubled in Portugal, seizures of cocaine have increased sevenfold between 2001 and 2006, the sixth highest in the world (WDR-World Drug Report, 2009).

With regard to hashish, it is difficult to assess the trends and intensive use of hashish in Europe, but among the countries that participated in field trials, between 2004 and 2007 (France, Spain, Ireland, Greece, Italy, Greece, Italy, The Netherlands and Portugal) there was an average increase of approximately 20% " (EMCDDA, 2008).



In Portugal, since decriminalization has been implemented, the number of homicides related to drugs has increased 40%. "It was the only European country with a significant increase in (drug-related) murders between 2001 and 2006" (WDR, 2009).



A recent report commissioned by IDT, the Center for Studies and Opinion Polls (CESOP) of the Portuguese Catholic University, based on direct interviews regarding the attitudes of the Portuguese towards drug addiction (which has strangely never been released), revealed the following: 83.7% of respondents indicated that the number of drug users in Portugal has increased in the last four years. 66.8% believe that the accessibility of drugs in their neighborhoods was easy or very easy and 77.3% stated that crime related to drugs has also increased (“Toxicodependências” No. 3, 2007).



This is the painful reality in Portugal- the attitude towards drugs and drug addiction. For the Portuguese government, drug addicts are essentially regarded as 'sick'. This is not only a suicidal attitude, but a public expense. Pretend you are sick and the government pretends to treat you! The decriminalization of consumption, possession and acquisition for consumption has added to the illicit consumption of drugs. Legalizing a crime committed by "drug addicts" (or "the sick") does not seem the most effective way to combat the problem, as shown by greatly increased rate of drug-related homicides recorded in Portugal compared to other countries with reduced dependence and related crime.



What is happening in Portugal is very peculiar; drug addicts, with the support of the government, rely on their status as 'sick'. But these addicts often forget that they are 'sick' and are assumed as free and responsible people, who are able to decide whether they want treatment or not! As a result of decriminalization the addict is considered a patient and not a delinquent. The state can not choose, through a political policy, a solution that gives priority to feed the "disease" rather than a cure! Resounding success? Glance at the results!

Manuel Pinto Coelho

President of the Association for a Drug Free Portugal
http://www.wfad.se/latest-news/1-articles/123-decriminalization-of-drugs-in-portugal--the-real-facts

Best Portugal Advice to the World: Don’t Follow Us

http://w3.u0742231.fsdata.se/latest...t-portugal-advice-to-the-world-dont-follow-us

Tell me again what's so good about the decriminalization of drugs Aaron?
 
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WizardofOz

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Here's two questions for you:

What do you call someone who voted for Gary Johnson for President, who by the way, ran on the Libertarian Party Platform?

:doh: Do you not know how party membership works? You voted for homosexualist Mitt Romney. Does that make you a Republican?

Are you a Republican aCW?

What do you call someone who uses a quote from Ron Paul, who is a "lifetime member of the Libertarian Party" on his TOL signature?

So everyone who quotes Ron Paul is a Libertarian? :AMR:

Do you agree with the above Aaron? How about you Doc?

I would like to see some states decriminalize not legalize, yes. Addicts need medical and mental assistance not prison.

If there were undeniable proof that decriminalization lowered recreational drug use, would you support it?

Gosh Aaron, you missed one, in fact it was my favorite.

Coincidentally, it was the only one you offered that didn't counter your own position. So there's that. :chuckle:
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Here's two questions for you:

What do you call someone who voted for Gary Johnson for President, who by the way, ran on the Libertarian Party Platform?

Do you not know how party membership works?

Have I ever said anything about you being a paying card carrying member of the Libertarian Party Aaron? You can (and do) embrace Libertarian ideology without being a Party member.


You voted for homosexualist Mitt Romney. Does that make you a Republican?

Yes.

Are you a Republican aCW?

Yes, and take note that I didn't go into a hissy fit admitting it.


Quote:
What do you call someone who uses a quote from Ron Paul, who is a "lifetime member of the Libertarian Party" on his TOL signature?

So everyone who quotes Ron Paul is a Libertarian?

If quoted in a positive light, yes, that would make them sympathetic to Ron Paul and his Libertarian cause.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Do you agree with the above Aaron? How about you Doc?

I would like to see some states decriminalize not legalize, yes.

According to dictionary.com decriminalization is legalization:

to eliminate criminal penalties for or remove legal restrictions against: to decriminalize marijuana.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/decriminalization

Addicts need medical and mental assistance not prison.

Yet the Presidential candidate that you voted for wants legalization.
http://www.ontheissues.org/2012/Gary_Johnson_Drugs.htm

If there were undeniable proof that decriminalization lowered recreational drug use, would you support it?

No, you NEVER raise the white flag of surrender on moral issues, drug use is one of them. Besides, I've seen in person what drug legalization/decriminalization does: it does anything BUT lower recreational drug use.


Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior View Post
Gosh Aaron, you missed one, in fact it was my favorite.

Coincidentally, it was the only one you offered that didn't counter your own position. So there's that.

Here's another one that I ran across that'll give you nightmares:

Consequences of Illegal Drug Use

Illegal drugs -- such as heroin, marijuana, cocaine and methamphetamine -- inflict serious damage upon America and its citizens every year. Accidents, crime, domestic violence, illness, lost opportunity, and reduced productivity are the direct consequences of substance abuse. Drug and alcohol use by children often is associated with other forms of unhealthy, unproductive behavior, including delinquency and high-risk sexual activity.

Illegal drugs cost our society approximately $110 billion each year.8 The greatest cost of drug abuse is paid in human lives, either lost directly to overdose, or through drug abuse-related diseases such as tuberculosis, sexually transmitted diseases (STDs), hepatitis, and acquired immunodeficiency syndrome (AIDS). Traffic accidents caused by alcohol- and drug-impaired drivers; street crime committed by addicts to support their addiction; and resources expended to apprehend, sentence, treat, and incarcerate drug abusers are the burdens borne by taxpayers year after year.

Drug use erodes human potential. It is associated with a broad array of antisocial behavior that limits children from the outset of their lives...
https://www.ncjrs.gov/ondcppubs/publications/policy/99ndcs/ii-b.html
 

RevMAA

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I think Ron Paul is a hell of a lot better than all the other fake choices we are given. I proudly voted for him in the primary. He is a Christian by the way, and more of a conservative than bush or romney. I'm looking for Rand 2016.

Posted from the TOL App!
 

aCultureWarrior

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I think Ron Paul is a hell of a lot better than all the other fake choices we are given. I proudly voted for him in the primary. He is a Christian by the way, and more of a conservative than bush or romney. I'm looking for Rand 2016.

What part of Daddy Paul's "Christianity" did you like Rev?

Not being certain if homosexuality is a sin?

Voting to allow homosexuals to openly serve in the military?

Stating that abortion is a "States Rights" issue?

Being for legalizing ALL recreational drugs?

The list goes on and on.
 

RevMAA

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What part of Daddy Paul's "Christianity" did you like Rev?

Not being certain if homosexuality is a sin?

Voting to allow homosexuals to openly serve in the military?

Stating that abortion is a "States Rights" issue?

Being for legalizing ALL recreational drugs?

The list goes on and on.

Well he is a constitutionalist so he stands by the constitution. That Is way better than bush, who got most of the Christian vote. If abortion was at the state level it would be much easier to fight, rather than trying to fight a monolithic law like we have now. If it was RPs way it would be illegal in many states and hundreds thousands if babies would be saved.

It doesn't go on and on. You covered it all. Which shows he is a lot better than other "choices"

Posted from the TOL App!
 

WizardofOz

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Have I ever said anything about you being a paying card carrying member of the Libertarian Party Aaron?

If I'm not a member of the Libertarian Party, then I'm not a Libertarian. :duh:

There is libertarian ideology and there is the Libertarian Party. You seems confused about the difference between the two.

You can (and do) embrace Libertarian ideology without being a Party member.

And that still wouldn't make me a Libertarian any more than you voting for Romney would make you a Republican.

I am amazed (well, not really) that you even need this to be explained to you.

You voted for homosexualist Mitt Romney. Does that make you a Republican?

:doh: Voting for a Republican does not make you a Republican. Becoming a member of the Republican Party makes you a Republican. You can identify with their values and even vote for them but that does not make you a Republican by default.

Yes, and take note that I didn't go into a hissy fit admitting it.

Are you a "card carrying member" of the Republican Party or do you really believe that voting for Romney, watching Fox News and listening to Rush makes you a Republican?

If quoted in a positive light, yes, that would make them sympathetic to Ron Paul and his Libertarian cause.

It is a pro-life cause. My quoting him in a positive light makes me sympathetic to his pro-life cause as described in the quote. Ron Paul is also a Republican by the way. My support of Ron Paul in no way makes me Libertarian nor does it make me Republican.

By all means, what about his quote do you disagree with? I'd love to hear it.

According to dictionary.com decriminalization is legalization:

to eliminate criminal penalties for or remove legal restrictions against: to decriminalize marijuana.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/decriminalization

There is a huge difference between decriminalization and legalization. Perhaps your perpetual confusion is what has you up in arms about Portugal's drug policy. Drug use and possession is still against the law. It is simply not criminal (in limited amounts). They treat drug use as a health care matter and their approach seems to be netting rather positive results.

Decriminalization =/= legalization

Your lack of knowledge of the legal system is telling, *ahem* officer.

Yet the Presidential candidate that you voted for wants legalization.
http://www.ontheissues.org/2012/Gary_Johnson_Drugs.htm

So? I do not necessarily want all drugs legalized. I can only repeat what I just said. "I would like to see some states decriminalize".

If there were undeniable proof that decriminalization lowered recreational drug use, would you support it?
No, you NEVER raise the white flag of surrender on moral issues, drug use is one of them.

It's not "raising the white flag" it is a shift in policy. Users are not simply allowed to use they are simply processed and treated differently. They can still be detained and put in front of a judge (or panel) that determines what treatment is needed. This is all compulsory.

Besides, I've seen in person what drug legalization/decriminalization does: it does anything BUT lower recreational drug use.

Thanks, I'll take peer reviewed studies over your personal anecdotes. Have any of those to offer?

Here's another one that I ran across that'll give you nightmares:

Consequences of Illegal Drug Use

Quick! Bury the embarrassment by providing more links. No one is disputing the consequence(s) of illegal drug use. We're debating the way to combat it. So, you're confused again it seems.
 

WizardofOz

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State rejects 'grossly offensive' Satanic Temple display


The Satanic Temple will not be placing its holiday display in the Florida Capitol, but is still adamant about its inclusion.

The group’s application was declined by the Department of Management Services.

In an email Wednesday afternoon, DMS officials rejected Satanic Temple spokesperson Lucien Greaves’ request to display a kiosk adorned with an angel falling into a pit of flames and the words “Happy Holidays from the Satanic Temple.”

“The Department’s position is that your proposed display is grossly offensive during the holiday season,” the message stated.

A member of the group has asked for clarification from DMS and said he’ll wait for a response before deciding about any legal action he might take.

The Satanic Temple applied Dec. 10 to include its display in the Capitol rotunda, now home to six displays from various groups, but was stalled when it failed to submit a required photo of what the exhibit would be. Once the picture was submitted, the display was denied.

“It is not our intention to offend,” Grieves wrote DMS on Thursday. “Like the Nativity scene, it presents an image from a Biblical story, which is shared with other religious traditions besides our own. In addition, a positive sentiment of ‘Happy Holidays’ is displayed.”

In its initial application, the Satanic Temple described its exhibit as a poster “of religious symbols and images that adhere to community standards ... to contribute to the plurality of the community by representing the spirit of good will from other faiths.”

In a statement Thursday, the American Civil Liberties Union of Florida criticized the state’s decision to allow holiday displays at all and said deeming a message “grossly offensive is not a basis for government to limit free expression.”

“This is the knot that the state tied itself into because officials refused to see that there are more appropriate places for displays of religious messages than the Capitol rotunda,” the ACLU statement said. “The only way the state could allow the placement of the original religious display, that some officials wanted to promote, was to create a space where any group could put up whatever message they choose. If state officials are surprised by how this has turned out, then they don’t understand how free speech works.”

Monday, a display from the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster joined a Nativity scene, a Festivus pole, signs from various atheist groups and one from the Madison, Wis.-based Freedom from Religion Foundation. A menorah earlier was displayed in the rotunda, but was removed at the end of Hanukkah. A second Nativity scene is expected to be on display Dec. 27 in observance of Three Kings Day.

story



bilde


And the Flying Spaghetti Monster

spghettimonster.png

"A closed mouth catches no noodly appendages. ProvHerbs 3:27."

They're not mocking at all, are they...:sigh:
 

PureX

Well-known member
Lady Gaga's ArtFlop

5773510473_e3582c3a80_z-640-2.jpg


" Lady Gaga, for the first time in her career, seems culturally tone-deaf, releasing an album that’s ostensibly about modern art — a “reverse Warholian expedition,” as Gaga so loftily describes it — to a public that doesn’t care."

:chuckle:

Story here ...
 

drbrumley

Well-known member
Christians in Syria face mounting horrors

DAMASCUS, Syria (BP) -- For Hanna, a Syrian Christian mother living in Damascus, the country's civil war is more than just statistics and news articles.

"Every day when I walk to the school I work at I hold my breath; every minute something can happen," she wrote in a first-person account to Open Doors USA, an organization supporting persecuted Christians. "Many streets are closed and when you walk the streets you see the traces of the battle: little fires all over the streets. Also in our house you see the traces of the war: we already noticed a bullet hole in our guest room, but recently I also discovered one in the room of my girls."

As the conflict between President Bashar al-Assad's forces and rebel fighters rages on, the country's Christians fear they are becoming easy targets for Islamic extremists.

"In fact attacks on churches happen a lot now. They are also targeting Christians," Hanna wrote. "Many of them are killed or kidnapped. When they are kidnapped they ask their families for ransom or they force them to convert to Islam. Women are often raped. The people that return from such events are traumatized. One of the men I know that came back from a kidnapping didn't speak a word since he came back. He is crying a lot. Nobody knows what happened to him."

Nina Shea, who directs the Hudson Institute's Center for Religious Freedom, wrote in the National Review Online about the plight of Syria's Christians. She relayed a report by the Vatican news agency Fides about the discovery of a mass grave containing 30 bodies near the ancient Christian town of Sadad. Since Oct. 21, rebel-allied Islamist militias have killed 45 people there in total.

"Surviving relatives and friends uncovered the graves after government forces recently recaptured the town from rebels," Shea wrote. "Those killed were reported by the local Syriac Orthodox metropolitan, who presided over 30 of their funerals this week, to be Christian civilians, including women and children."

St. Theodore's Syriac Orthodox Church, along with other churches and a monastery, have been desecrated, Shea wrote, and about 2,500 families have fled Sadad.

Rebels allied with al-Qaeda have not been shy about imposing their harsh view of Islam on areas under their control.

The town of Raqqa, CNN reported, formerly was one of Syria's most liberal cities before Islamist radicals took over. Now locals call it Tora Bora.

After attacks by Assad's regime on the town, moderate rebels were pushed aside by foreign jihadist rebels from the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS), a militant group with links to al-Qaeda. They started indoctrinating children with their extreme view of Islam. Edicts began springing up on the town walls -- No smoking. No cameras. Women could not walk alone or style or show their hair.

A man called Adnan, whose name was changed for fear of his safety, was caught writing anti-ISIS graffiti and filming. The jihadists dragged him into a church they had torched and turned into an ISIS base.

"Every 15 minutes, someone poured water on me, electrocuted me, kicked me, then walked out," he told CNN, adding that the screams of other tortured prisoners was worse than his own pain.

"When a person is tortured in front of you, you feel responsible. That's the hardest. One guy still inside used to call me Dad as I taught him about democracy," Adnan said.

Shea wrote that Syria's top Catholic leader, Gregorios III Laham, the Melkite Greek Catholic patriarch of Antioch and all the East, estimates more than 450,000 of Syria's roughly 1.75-2 million Christians have fled their homes since 2011.

Hanna wrote to Open Doors USA that she and her husband struggled with that decision.

"As a mother and as a wife I want to leave, but as a Christian I want to stay. Every time my husband and I pray, God gives us a burden on our heart: stay in Syria," she wrote. "He has things to do for us here. God will bless Syria, know this for sure. He is already blessing us. Every time we go to church, the church is full; people come together in times of despair."

Many new refugees from Muslim backgrounds are appearing at her church, she wrote. They say they have lost everything but in Jesus have found what is most important.

"The situation is hard," Hanna wrote, "but we are living by faith."
 

WizardofOz

New member
Indiana moves closer to constitutional ban on same-sex marriage


The Indiana Senate on Monday approved a proposed amendment to the state's constitution that would prohibit same-sex marriage but more steps are required before it goes to voters in 2016.

The Indiana Senate approved the proposed ban by a vote of 32-17, following approval in the House of Representatives last month. But under state law, both chambers must approve the measure again, with the same language, in the next legislative session in 2015 or 2016 in order for the proposal to go before voters in 2016.

 
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