Did Christ die for all men?
- Thread starter Sonnet
- Start date
Jesus died for everyone, but his shed blood is for the firstborn. Unbelievers do not heed his shed blood.
Bociferous
New member
Piper may have been preaching from the position that there could be elect listening whom the Lord had not yet quickened, in which case God could use human preaching as a tool for hearing on the specific day that particular sinner is to be awakened. [I'm not defending Calvinism, only suggesting a possible reason he preached as he did that day.]
And grave sins will bury you. :rip:
Sonnet
New member
Ok - but Piper will still be telling those whom he considers not among the elect that Jesus died for their sins. That would be disingenuous.
Sonnet
New member
Certainly scripture teachers that Jesus shed his blood for all.
Christianity is just a game for you.
Bociferous
New member
I'm merely invoking the timeliness principle--people called at different points in time--in the parable at the beginning of Mat 2 as a possible explanation for Piper's preaching. I.e., none but God knows (from the Calvinist perspective, not mine)when or using what means He intends to awaken the elect in time. Preaching may, in this scenario, merely be the tool God uses to aid in the awakening of one or more of the elect. It's not disingenuous at all. Piper would likely assume that the non-elect wouldn't "hear" his preaching anyway, he preached in the event God might use his words to the benefit of those elected to be awakened at that particular point in time via that particular preaching. Do you see what I mean? Maybe I'm not properly representing the Calvinist position and a Calvinist will correct me here.
Sonnet
New member
Mat 22?
But the so called non-elect not 'hearing' does not guard against them understanding what Piper is telling them - that Christ died for them - even though Piper believes that Christ did not die for all men.
Surely he (Piper) is tripping over the awkwardness of his own mistaken theology? And we are talking about the very essence of the saving work of Christ - the essence of the good news.
do you know why gospel is called a good news?
Not really, it's just that some times you are so funny.
But you do need to quit judging the faith of others.
So do all heed his shed blood? (Hint: the answer is no.)
yes - do you?
"Who are you to judge another’s servant?" (Paul)
that we might be saved
when His word is spread falsely I will not hesitate to correct it.
We have responsibility to spread the whole truth, not half gospel.
to be more clear, God is giving all of us opportunity to be in His kingdom for eternity through Jesus Christ.
BTW, do you know you have asked this question to me tons of times?
Do you think I will change my word just because you repeat over and over?
No, friend. My answer will be always the same.
My faith in Jesus is solid.
this is to chris.