Could Hugh Hefner & Donald Trump Be Homosexual?

[Arthur Brain]

easy - both homosexuality and murder are perversions of normalcy

Then you'd think the same about lying, lusting, coveting, stealing? Most people are guilty of entertaining at least one of those. Far less in relation to murder and heterosexuality precludes homosexual attraction so not even the same as any of the above.

a statement that's as convincing as my claim that my state of being a non-murderer is as fixed as the color of my skin

(as it happens, the color of my skin changes quite a bit when I go out in the sun :chuckle: )

It doesn't really matter if you're convinced or not as the truth of the matter won't change anything. There's reasons that can drive someone to kill, be it for good or evil. Heterosexuality isn't something that changes with ethics or situations.

Fair enough on the last bit though...shoulda said being Caucasian ain't gonna change.

 

[ok doser]

Then you'd think the same about lying, lusting, coveting, stealing?

of course

Most people are guilty of entertaining at least one of those.

most people are sinful by nature :idunno:

Far less in relation to murder

unproven

remember, murder is murder if it's in your heart


ever hear of road rage?

and heterosexuality precludes homosexual attraction

obviously not

(see:hugh hefner)

 

[Arthur Brain]

of course

Ok.

most people are sinful by nature :idunno:

Most, not all?

unproven

remember, murder is murder if it's in your heart


ever hear of road rage?

Yes, I've been in cars where the drivers have had it. Don't think they were entertaining sincere thoughts of killing random strangers though.

obviously not

(see:hugh hefner)

Then perhaps his orientation isn't as fixed as I presumed it was, wrongly on my part. Mine is though so other people's don't count. Can't act on an attraction that simply isn't there.

 

[ok doser]

Can't act on an attraction that simply isn't there.

and we've come full circle

 

[Arthur Brain]

and we've come full circle

Well, that was an argument that didn't work as anyone can be in a position where killing or murder could cross their mind as I outlined before. Situational ethics doesn't apply to being straight and incapable of altering that.

 

[ok doser]

Well, that was an argument that didn't work ...

not going round and round again artie

 

[Arthur Brain]

not going round and round again artie

Good, because your argument doesn't work in relation and you should try another.

 

[glassjester]

My heterosexuality is as fixed as the colour of my skin,

If you want it to be.

Hefner chose to keep his (orientation) malleable.

You're more closed-minded than him.
Good for you!

 

[ok doser]

If you want it to be.

Hefner chose to keep his (orientation) malleable.

You're more closed-minded than him.
Good for you!

do you find it as fascinating as I do that artie is more close minded to perverting his sexuality than he is to perverting his status as a non-murderer?

 

[MrDante]

yes, and most people know which ones are appropriate to go onto marriage and which are not.

are you talking about having matching skin tones?

 

[Arthur Brain]

If you want it to be.

Hefner chose to keep his (orientation) malleable.

You're more closed-minded than him.
Good for you!

What I 'want' doesn't enter into it. There's no 'close mindedness' or 'moralistic' decision making process involved. It's simply the way it happens to be, much the same way as I can't help being bored by bland manufactured pap music.

 

[glassjester]

do you find it as fascinating as I do that artie is more close minded to perverting his sexuality than he is to perverting his status as a non-murderer?

It's a bit strange.
But probably most people would have a similar opinion.
Our society teaches us that sexual orientation is immutable and innate.
He's convinced.

Or it could be that Arthur is more able to conceive of a situation that might lead to him killing someone than one that would lead to him becoming attracted to his own gender.

In which case, it doesn't seem so strange.
I can't think of a compelling reason to want to become attracted to my own gender.
I can think of compelling reasons to take a life.

Though I do not wish to do either one.



There also may be two separate arguments going on here.
Arthur may be arguing that his orientation cannot now become other than it is.
I (at least, possibly you as well) am arguing that it could have been (based on socialization) other than it is.
Not necessarily that it would change now.

 

[Arthur Brain]

do you find it as fascinating as I do that artie is more close minded to perverting his sexuality than he is to perverting his status as a non-murderer?

A non sequitur of yours from the outset and duly addressed and rebutted. Still, if you or he find that fascinating then hey, have at it.

 

[glassjester]

What I 'want' doesn't enter into it. There's no 'close mindedness' or 'moralistic' decision making process involved. It's simply the way it happens to be, much the same way as I can't help being bored by bland manufactured pap music.

I think people are more Pavlovian than you give them credit for.

If you were conditioned to enjoy Beyonce's "Single Ladies," then you'd enjoy it. Genuinely.
If you were conditioned to be attracted to your own gender, than you would be. Genuinely.

And people are quite often the authors of their own conditioning.

 

[MrDante]

Adultery is still a crime in many states, and the penalty for sodomy castration at the country's founding.

what was the penalty for escaping enslavement?

But, you all consider 'prejudice' to be simply disagreeing with it, and 'oppression' if one's vote doesn't go to, let's say, gay marriage- as if one is supposed to renounce what their religion dictates to go and cater to you morons

Yeah because your right to discriminate trumps anyone elses right to be treated like human beings. It's not like Jesus preached something like the golden rule or anything

You're just a bunch of crybabies whose idea of persecution is not being sold a gay cake at a visibly Christian bakery.
I mean, why the hell didn't that Muslim bakery get shut down for doing the same thing?

Are you referring to this? :

Of course you know that this guys claims were exposed as false. He supposedly filmed three Muslim owned bakeries refusing ot bake a wedding cake for a same sex marriage. However one of the three only baked bread, no cakes of any kind. Another bakery was staffed by a non English speaking individual and the third bakery actually did take the order for this guys fake cake.

You see, you all are also just a bunch of anti-Christians, for the sake of being an enemy to your own countrymen.
That's why you all want to throw them under the bus for aliens and dissolve America into a globalist gig.

I think you ought to put the horn down and recognize that people aren't falling for you're crap anymore, hombre.

If only horn embraced false witness against Muslims and the promotion of hate and discrimination then he could be just like you.

 

[Arthur Brain]

I think people are more Pavlovian than you give them credit for.

If you were conditioned to enjoy Beyonce's "Single Ladies," then you'd enjoy it. Genuinely.
If you were conditioned to be attracted to your own gender, than you would be. Genuinely.

And people are quite often the authors of their own conditioning.

Nobody "conditioned" me to like the opposite sex.

Nobody "conditioned" me to be blown away by 'The Rite Of Spring' as a thirteen year old kid either.

You seem to consider yourself an expert of sorts in psychology but you really aren't. Genuinely.

 

[MrDante]

Haha, right.

Sexual orientation was just undiscovered? Really?
It's a social construct. It hadn't been constructed yet.

Just like Native American is a social construct. You claimed that no one could possibly have been heterosexual before the name was coined

Heck, you couldn't even be heterosexual at all, prior to the invention of sexual orientation in the 1800's.

.
So on one could have been Native American before the invention of North America

 

[Arthur Brain]

It's a bit strange.
But probably most people would have a similar opinion.
Our society teaches us that sexual orientation is immutable and innate.
He's convinced.

Or it could be that Arthur is more able to conceive of a situation that might lead to him killing someone than one that would lead to him becoming attracted to his own gender.

In which case, it doesn't seem so strange.
I can't think of a compelling reason to want to become attracted to my own gender.
I can think of compelling reasons to take a life.

Though I do not wish to do either one.



There also may be two separate arguments going on here.
Arthur may be arguing that his orientation cannot now become other than it is.
I (at least, possibly you as well) am arguing that it could have been (based on socialization) other than it is.
Not necessarily that it would change now.

Again, nobody "taught" me that being attracted to the opposite sex was 'normal' or 'immutable'. That's simply the way it is for me. Your 'pop' psychology in regards to 'choosing' not to like certain things, be it pop songs or men is pretty much just that. I figured you might have had the good sense to drop that line of 'reasoning' by now. Evidently not.

lain:

 

[MrDante]

Why are there more homosexual acts within prisons than in the general population if homosexuality is innate and not fluid?

because acts are independent of orientation. Otherwise virgins couldn't have a sexual orientation.

 

[glassjester]

You seem to consider yourself an expert of sorts in psychology but you really aren't.

No, I definitely don't, and I'm definitely not.

All I'm saying is, if you'd been raised like a Greek, you'd be acting like one now.

And as far as an "innate" musical taste... do you find it strange that so many Americans like American music, and not, let's say, Mongolian folk songs?

Were they just lucky enough to be born in the place that best suited their innate musical taste?
That would be quite the coincidence.