God's Truth
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You said something about it would be no good to reply to me.
You also put down the guy who made the OP.
ECT Clearing up the confusion of Creation!
- Thread starter iamaberean
- Start date
You said something about it would be no good to reply to me.
You also put down the guy who made the OP.
God's Truth
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My problem is that you're so heavenly minded you're no earthly good.
So this never walked the earth?
Or this?
Or these?
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=dinosaur+fossil+images
No, of course not. That would be called a metaphor.
I haven't heard of any "dragon" fossils ever being discovered, but I've heard of and seen plenty of dinosaur fossils. All dragons are dinosaurs, but not all dinosaurs are dragons.
Yes, leviathan and behemoth.
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So then you believe the Bible speaks of dinosaurs.
Even a plant eating dinosaur, according to scientists: Their jaws and teeth show that these dinosaurs were plant eaters. Some sauropods were the largest land animals that ever lived, weighing as much as 80 metric tons (176,370 pounds) and attaining lengths of up to 35 m (115 ft.).
So tell me how these dinosaurs ate enough of our plant life to sustain their size and weight.
Derf
Well-known member
Did it do any good? Did you consider what I wrote? Your post was a response to mine where I had laid out my case. Your reply was a statement of "fact", without, seemingly, consideration of what I wrote. And your responses to the others was indicative of your not considering either what I wrote or what they wrote in support of what I wrote. Now, I can understand if you think a particular way on an issue, but to state it as a fact without discussion or additional evidence seems a bit presumptuous.
If that was rude, then I apologize. But if it was true, I hope you will consider it well. We'd all do well to consider what others write about us, whether written nicely or not.
[MENTION=16627]iamaberean[/MENTION]'s a big boy, he can take care of himself. My point to him, which was made in posts over a year ago and repeated in my response to you, was that it didn't make sense to drop a thread where the discussion wasn't going the way he liked, just to take up the topic again in a different thread--it's either a waste of thread space or a deliberate attempt to avoid having to consider the other side of an issue--something we all can use help with, don't you think? Iamaberean would do well to consider what others write about him, whether written nicely or not.
I'm not sure I need to apologize to you for potentially offending him, do I?
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Yes, because it does, and the fossil record supports the Bible, does it not?
I imagine that they did it quite well. God did create a Garden, did He not? Do you think God wouldn't create enough resources for His creation to thrive on?
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God's Truth
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You claim there were dinosaurs in Jobs time.
So tell us how much food a bunch of dinosaurs ate to keep their 176,370 pounds.
How many heads of cabbage did the dinosaurs eat to survive?
Ok, now you're being ridiculous, asking specific questions like that one. What is your point? Did you really not know that dinosaurs existed?
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Derf
Well-known member
This is a pretty interesting question. First, as a creationist that holds to the idea that the flood and its attending consequences is largely responsible for the fossils we find, I would suggest that almost ALL (more than 99% would be my guess) of the dinosaur fossils that have been discovered were alive at the time of the flood. So if that idea is correct, it means that the feeding of such creatures might represent a serious burden to the earth, as you suggest.
Well, there are several factors that could play into the equation.
- How many dinosaurs there were.
- How much land area was available for them, and
- How well did the land support the dinosaurs.
On #1. I couldn't find an answer--maybe [MENTION=15431]6days[/MENTION] knows. I saw one estimate of about 2100 "good" fossil dinosaur skeletons worldwide, "good" meaning maybe about 60% of the bones. But let's just say for a minute that because of the unusually good conditions for forming fossils that occurred during the flood, compared to the unusually poor conditions that occur when animals die today, that maybe 0.1% of the dinosaurs were actually fossilized, and let's say the total number of fossils that belong to different animals is over 1000 times the number of good fossils out there. That puts the potential number of actual dinosaurs at the time of the flood at 2.1 billion dinosaurs (I think that may be conservatively large??). And I've heard that the average size of a dinosaur was probably about the size of a sheep.
So, in the world today, there are approximately 1 billion domestic sheep, the same number of pigs, and maybe 1.4 billion cows (see here). I think that would put the amount of food needed by dinosaurs somewhere less than the current needs of just the 3 most popular domesticated food animals today. And they are doing pretty good along with over 6 billion people (also about the same size as sheep), and a whole bunch of cats and dogs, not to mention all non-domestic animals. The number of the very large dinosaurs is probably pretty insignificant compared to the total land area.
On #2. It's hard to know what the world looked like before the flood. It likely had a lot more land area, but if the current amount of water in the world doesn't cover the mountains, then it's also likely that the mountains were smaller, so more land was available to the lowland-type creatures (as dinosaurs seem to have been, preferring swamps or similar landscapes).
Plus, if much of the water that fed the flood was from underground, then it's likely the seas were smaller.
On #3. If more lowland, and fewer mountains, and a climate that could sustain dinosaurs even in Antarctica, the land would be able to sustain the animals quite well, it seems.
Of course the dogs, cats, cows, sheep, pigs, etc. were also there, but we've also had more than twice the amount of time since the flood for the numbers to grow, compared to the time from creation to the flood. It doesn't really seem like that big a deal to me.
God's Truth
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You said dinosaurs existed in Job's time.
A plant eating dinosaur weighs 176,370 pounds.
So how did those dinosaurs have enough plants to eat everyday from our little in comparison trees?
See Derf's post above. You're using the largest dinosaurs as a representation of all the dinosaurs, which when doing averages, doesn't work at all. Also, you're forgetting that Job lived after the Flood, which means that many animals would be eating meat (granted, probably not behemoth, but perhaps leviathan would have), so the requirements for food for all dinosaurs would be lessened.
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God's Truth
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How do you ever get that I forgot that Job lived after the flood and what difference does it make?
You said the leviathan was real and not about Satan, as I said. The leviathan is a real and giant sea monster, according to you; so tell me how do you think it died in the flood? A sea monster would survive a flood.
God's Truth
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Why do you say all the dinosaurs died during the flood?
God said two of each animal.
If there were dinosaurs in Noah's time then you would have to prove with scripture God told Noah not to include the dinosaurs.
Actually, God said two of each kind of animal. There's a pretty big difference.
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God's Truth
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Genesis 6:19 And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female.
Genesis 6:20 Two of every kind of bird, of every kind of animal and of every kind of creature that moves along the ground will come to you to be kept alive.
Again, you have not proven that dinosaurs were all killed in the flood when it would have been saved with Noah.
God's Truth
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You can't get out of this one, JudgeRightly.
What are you talking about? Please keep track of who said what. When I said "I never said all were [killed in the flood]," I meant it. Please pay attention.
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God's Truth
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You referred me to Derf's post. Derf said they all died in the flood.
You ALSO argued against Noah bringing them on the ark.
If Noah didn't bring them on the ark then they did not survive the flood.
Go ahead then explain what happened to the dinosaurs.
God's Truth
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So tell me, JudgeRightly, since you say Noah did not bring them on the ark, how did they survive the flood?
Derf
Well-known member
You really need to read more carefully! Neither of us said all the dinosaurs died in the flood. I said almost all of the dino fossils were from dinos killed in the flood. It's a pretty big difference.
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6days
New member
Derf said:
Yes... we do not know what the pre-flood world looked like, it was destroyed. "So God said to Noah, "I am going to put an end to all people, for the earth is filled with violence because of them. I am surely going to destroy both them and the earth".
The mountains we see today are a result of post-flood activity. (Stripe or others can do a better job of explaining tectonics, subduction etc. But, the mountains are great evidence for the flood and rapid formation. We see fossil marine organisms on every mountain range in the world. We see large sedimentary layers that formed when soft and pliable and now hardened into rock (folded / bent layers).*
Is there enough water to cover the whole earth...Definetly!. If the earth was flat the entire earth would be under 1.5 miles of water.*