Brexit

[eider]

I agree that Britain should have left. I'm a conservative. I never falsely agree with something. Ever since I got here you've been a gruff moron

Hi.....
It was never a Conservative Remain, Liberal Leave kind of vote.

David Cameron 'Remain' is Conservative.
Boris Johnson 'Leave' leader is Conservative.

In fact, the Right, Middle and Left Politicians and citizens were split in their intentions, and so we had a far-left Leader (Mr Corbyn) campaining with a Conservative Prime Minster to Remain.

A country split through, totally regardless of right or left politics.

I voted 'Leave' and I'm a slightly left voter in elections.

 

[rocketman]

My personal situation isn't rare or unique. There are consequences to erecting barriers between people, and they really impact people. Most likely, the consequences will be small in the long run, and I'm not opposed in principle to every partition, but I would still recommend a bit of caution. If you have to cross three checkpoints to get across town, you might start feeling less free rather than more.

National sovereignty, borders, language, and culture are what make a country. The mish mash of multiple cultures inside one border does not work, i.e. multiculturalism is not compatible, a failure, and it is at the heart of why BREXIT came to pass. Multiple cultures can reside in one country but, only one culture is the dominant one, it is the national identity, and all other cultures must assimilate to the national culture or society breaks down. Nobody is trying to put in checkpoints to cross town Rex, what the Brits as well as Americans want are defined borders, national language, and all other cultures to assimilate to the national culture or leave...
maybe you are not paying attention that this is the same sentiment that is happening in America as well.

 

[musterion]

National sovereignty, borders, language, and culture are what make a country. The mish mash of multiple cultures inside one border does not work, i.e. multiculturalism is not compatible, a failure, and it is at the heart of why BREXIT came to pass. Multiple cultures can reside in one country but, only one culture is the dominant one, it is the national identity, and all other cultures must assimilate to the national culture or society breaks down. Nobody is trying to put in checkpoints to cross town Rex, what the Brits as well as Americans want are defined borders, national language, and all other cultures to assimilate to the national culture or leave...
maybe you are not paying attention that this is the same sentiment that is happening in America as well.

When I went back to get my Masters about 10 years ago, an instructor insisted the melting pot is dead, replaced with the salad bowl. I took issue with that for the reasons you cited. She did NOT like it but never answered back.

 

[rocketman]

Would you embrace a legal divide being established between yourself and your family? Would you like to have to traverse a checkpoint staffed by armed guards and limited civil liberties in order to visit them? That's the point.

Oh, you are always one for dramatics and exaggeration aren't you? Is this really what you see happening...just silly. :chuckle:

 

[annabenedetti]

National sovereignty, borders, language, and culture are what make a country. The mish mash of multiple cultures inside one border does not work, i.e. multiculturalism is not compatible, a failure, and it is at the heart of why BREXIT came to pass. Multiple cultures can reside in one country but, only one culture is the dominant one, it is the national identity, and all other cultures must assimilate to the national culture or society breaks down. Nobody is trying to put in checkpoints to cross town Rex, what the Brits as well as Americans want are defined borders, national language, and all other cultures to assimilate to the national culture or leave...
maybe you are not paying attention that this is the same sentiment that is happening in America as well.

Define the national culture, please.

To what exactly do you want everyone to assimilate?

 

[chrysostom]

wallace, buchanan, perot, trump are all racists
-they will always get a lot of votes anytime their kind is a candidate

 

[eider]

National sovereignty, borders, language, and culture are what make a country.

This might be true of the USA, although I doubt that, having noticed massive variation in cultures from one State to another. We are cosmopolitan in nature, with many differing languages and dialecys. My wife's home town (Gillingham) is one of the largest Sikh communities in Britain. A Muislim friend of mine lives near Wembley, and the High street there is totally different!
We are multicultural, multi lingual and cosmopolitan in nature. London ios one of many examples.

The mish mash of multiple cultures inside one border does not work, i.e. multiculturalism is not compatible, a failure, and it is at the heart of why BREXIT came to pass. Multiple cultures can reside in one country but, only one culture is the dominant one, it is the national identity, and all other cultures must assimilate to the national culture or society breaks down.

This might be true of some countries, but here we have tried hard to bust down as much prejudice, discrimination as we can. Our Equality Act 2010 shows this well.

is trying to put in checkpoints to cross town Rex, what the Brits as well as Americans want are defined borders, national language, and all other cultures to assimilate to the national culture or leave...
maybe you are not paying attention that this is the same sentiment that is happening in America as well.

I don't think that you have this correct about us. For instance, when we next drive over to Gillingham I will ask how the huge Sikh population voted in the referendum, or the Wembley Muslims, or the Southal Hindhus, Or the retired Gurkhas around Folkestone. Although I don't know the answer I would bet that the vote was split within all of these communities.
We're all just Brits, and were 70 years ago during the war......

We'll be sad about the tighter borders, it was the decisions and directives from Brussels that stung us.

 

[drbrumley]

Would you embrace a legal divide being established between yourself and your family? Would you like to have to traverse a checkpoint staffed by armed guards and limited civil liberties in order to visit them? That's the point.

Enlighten us, what is this legal divide?

Actually you are just throwing mud balls right now hoping something sticks.

 

[radind]

National sovereignty, borders, language, and culture are what make a country. The mish mash of multiple cultures inside one border does not work, i.e. multiculturalism is not compatible, a failure, and it is at the heart of why BREXIT came to pass. Multiple cultures can reside in one country but, only one culture is the dominant one, it is the national identity, and all other cultures must assimilate to the national culture or society breaks down. Nobody is trying to put in checkpoints to cross town Rex, what the Brits as well as Americans want are defined borders, national language, and all other cultures to assimilate to the national culture or leave...
maybe you are not paying attention that this is the same sentiment that is happening in America as well.

The US in the past was a 'melting pot'. The Secular Humanist progressive Democrats seem to reject assimilation and push a 'salad bowl' without promoting peace and harmony. In particular I see increasing attacks on Christian values.

 

[ok doser]

What time is it in England ?

time to get a new prime minister :banana:

What time is it in England ?

time to get a new prime minister :chuckle:

Yes I'm a Trudeau lover....after Stephen Harper I would have voted for a bit of lemon peel floating down the St. Lawrence River

I don't think that was a lemon peel :noid:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/montreal-sewage-midnight-deadline-1.3310772

 

[radind]

wallace, buchanan, perot, trump are all racists
-they will always get a lot of votes anytime their kind is a candidate

I don't see Buchanan,Perot and Trump as racist. There are issues with Trump, but my key issue is with godless Secular Humanist Clinton who attacks Christian values.

 

[ok doser]

Define the national culture, please.

To what exactly do you want everyone to assimilate?

 

[radind]

I would like to see a more cohesive and harmonious society. The current approach seems to promote strife with different groups pitted against each other.
The salad bowl/mosaic concept might work with effort, but recently I see less peace and harmony. The article by Salam has some interesting ideas.
My personal concern is the continuing attacks on Christian values. In my opinion, the US is now dominated by Secular Humanism that is operating as the majority de facto religion.

The Melting Pot Is Broken By Reihan Salam
… "As delicious as this multiethnic salad sounds—more croutons, please—I continue to be the melting pot’s biggest fan. As a consequence, I’ve gone from being a rah-rah enthusiast for mass immigration to one who is more skeptical of its virtues. That’s because I think the melting and fusing of different ethnic groups is essential to building a more cohesive and humane society, and that slowing down immigration would help this process along.”…

 

[rocketman]

Define the national culture, please.

To what exactly do you want everyone to assimilate?

Are you just playing ignorant Anna? or are you that removed from reality that there is a unique "American" culture? Since the inception of the United States of America people of many nations have (legally) immigrated to this nation, they came here to be "Americans" not to drag their former culture with them with the expectation of their cultural customs or language to be honored by the host nation. Nobody is saying that someone has to divorce themselves from their heritage or cultural customs but, they should have no expectation that the host nation is in any way obligated to adhere, honor, or respect their cultural customs and should assimilate to the culture of the country they have immigrated to. The onus to make a cultural change is not upon the citizens of the country you have immigrated to, nobody owes them that...plain & simple.

 

[rexlunae]

Enlighten us, what is this legal divide?

AKA, "a border". Young men and women with M16s screening traffic, checking papers, collecting duties, etc.

Actually you are just throwing mud balls right now hoping something sticks.

Not at all. I'm pointing out the part of secession you don't want to think about.

 

[rocketman]

I would like to see a more cohesive and harmonious society. The current approach seems to promote strife with different groups pitted against each other.
The salad bowl/mosaic concept might work with effort, but recently I see less peace and harmony. The article by Salam has some interesting ideas.
My personal concern is the continuing attacks on Christian values. In my opinion, the US is now dominated by Secular Humanism that is operating as the majority de facto religion.

The paragraph by Salam is exactly correct, and we have seen in American culture that when immigration was metered the melting pot worked and different cultures had time to melt into the one, instead of distinct cultural factions attempting to reside together which quite obviously ends in strife.

 

[rexlunae]

Oh, you are always one for dramatics and exaggeration aren't you? Is this really what you see happening...just silly. :chuckle:

It's unclear. No one knows. One of the main drivers of the Leave vote seems to have been immigration. Currently, the Irish border is nearly invisible. Do you not think that the UK's only land border, which it shares with the EU, will necessarily have to become more real if the will of the voters is to be kept?

 

[rexlunae]

The margin was so narrow, 52 to 48 per cent, but that is deceptive. Obama is very popular in Britain, we had him warning us that we would be at the back of the queue, we had every single government leaders, the banks, the bosses, the IMF along with every single other financial institution frightening the life out of us.

We had 3 former Prime Ministers, 4 ex Chancellors. They threatened the workers, they threatened the students they threatened even to cut the pensions.

It was enough to make your hair stand on end...they threatened that war would break out.

It does all follow a certain template. This is about the US, but I think it fits the UK maybe even better at this moment. http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/04/america-tyranny-donald-trump.html

For the sake of Britain, I hope the problem with the elites was that they really were corrupt and out of touch, and not merely a convenient scapegoat.

But STILL the English people voted OUT.

That's the problem. The English people voted out. English (and Welsh), not British. So much for #BetterTogether.

 

[rocketman]

This might be true of the USA, although I doubt that, having noticed massive variation in cultures from one State to another. We are cosmopolitan in nature, with many differing languages and dialecys. My wife's home town (Gillingham) is one of the largest Sikh communities in Britain. A Muislim friend of mine lives near Wembley, and the High street there is totally different!
We are multicultural, multi lingual and cosmopolitan in nature. London ios one of many examples.

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Yes, by the looks of it multiculturalism is working just fine in Europe, quite cosmopolitan... are you saying Sharia, and the radical idealist sects of some cultures are not dangerous? I am not speaking of the melting pot of different cultures into a unique national culture which is healthy, I am speaking of foreign cultures that want other cultures to acquiesce to their worldview & cultural customs which is why multiculturalism is not compatible in a healthy society.

This might be true of some countries, but here we have tried hard to bust down as much prejudice, discrimination as we can. Our Equality Act 2010 shows this well.

Nonsense! those pictures above prove why a healthy society should be both prejudice & discriminatory of dangerous cultures attempting to dominate their healthy national culture. Your political correctness as well as that of those in my nation is absolutely dangerous to yourself & others, don't be so acceptant that you are willing to sacrifice societal harmony to cultural ideals that are inconsistent with your national values.

I don't think that you have this correct about us. For instance, when we next drive over to Gillingham I will ask how the huge Sikh population voted in the referendum, or the Wembley Muslims, or the Southal Hindhus, Or the retired Gurkhas around Folkestone. Although I don't know the answer I would bet that the vote was split within all of these communities.
We're all just Brits, and were 70 years ago during the war......

We'll be sad about the tighter borders, it was the decisions and directives from Brussels that stung us.

It is called reality that is stinging you, not all cultures are to be accepted, and it isn't racism or bigotry to discriminate between good & evil but, at some point you have to identify it, and reject it even if it offends yours or others sensibilities to do so.

 

[drbrumley]

It's unclear. No one knows. One of the main drivers of the Leave vote seems to have been immigration. Currently, the Irish border is nearly invisible. Do you not think that the UK's only land border, which it shares with the EU, will necessarily have to become more real if the will of the voters is to be kept?

Dont worry Rex, UK isn't going anywhere...

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...heir-breath/ar-AAhCuCf?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=ASUDHP

Thursday's referendum wasn't actually legally binding — Cameron could have set it up to be so (a nationwide 2011 referendum was set up to be), but he apparently decided better of it. This means that, in theory at least, the British government could completely ignore the results and do whatever it thinks is best.

Of course, doing that would anger the majority of the country who voted to leave the E.U. But a new referendum could provide some democratic justification to the decision.

The close result does help the argument somewhat. Britain's 1975 referendum on membership of the European Economic Community was decided by a 67.2 percent vote to stay in. In the 2011 vote (on whether to use the Alternative Vote electoral system) was decided by 67.9 percent of the vote. Nigel Farage, a key Brexit supporter, unwittingly provided support for this argument by saying that if "remain" won by a "52 to 48" margin, there would be "unfinished business" and an argument for another vote.