Another wolf is marked/exposed/identified.

[heir]

So GOD changes to you, and promotes division?

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You "made up":

One people of GOD.

One Gospel.

No division.

No change.

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Try and keep up.

 

[heir]

Did I say in order to be saved?

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I assumed that's what you mean since you believe not in "grace alone/belief alone" for salvation.

Those who deny the effectual power of faith in the Christ of GOD are those who preach grace alone/ belief alone.

1 Corinthians 1:18 KJV

 

[God's Truth]

Are you saying that all verbal abuse is a sin?

You don't even have common sense; you say Jesus was verbally abusive.

 

[God's Truth]

His faith is not our faith. To say they are the same is stupid, which is what you say.

No, I said that scripture is about our having to have faith in Jesus. What you say the scripture says is just ridiculous.

 

[God's Truth]

1 Corinthians 1:18 KJV

Preaching of the cross means you have to have faith that Jesus' shed blood on the cross cleans the believer of the sins they repent of doing.

That is what it means.

Believe and repent.

 

[JudgeRightly]

You don't even have common sense; you say Jesus was verbally abusive.

How many people (including God) repented of mocking/ridiculing/verbally abusing/etc. in these passages?

Please explain how the following passages are not verbally abusive/mocking/ridiculing/mean spirited/etc...:

Judges 7:13-14
1 Kings 18:27
2 Kings 6:8-20
Matthew 11:17
Matthew 16:23
Matthew 23:15-16,24
John 8:44
Matthew 21:12-13
Mark 11:15-17
Luke 19:45-46
John 2:14-15
Matthew 7:6
Ezekiel 16:33
1 Timothy 1:10
Hebrews 13:4
Revelation 21:8
Revelation 22:15

Shall I continue?

 

[marhig]

For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die.But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—(For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many.And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous. - Romans 5:6-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans5:6-19&version=NKJV

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus,who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God,but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men.And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. - Philippians 2:5-8 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Philippians2:5-8&version=NKJV

I could pull up more, but two are sufficient.



Some of this tells me "how," but none of it tells me "why." I asked "Why did Jesus have to die on the cross?" Please answer the question that asked, and not the question that I didn't ask.

If it is, as you say, that Jesus was already saving people while living, then why not have Him keep living? Why have Him die at all, let alone be crucified, one of the most horrific ways to be executed at the time?

\

I did answer it. I answered it with a question of my own. Answer mine, and you'll have the answer to yours.



Those who live by the will of God are those who believe He died to save mankind. You clearly don't. You think He saved mankind just by living, yet you can't tell me why Jesus was crucified, only how and who did it.



Says the hypocrite as she judges me for judging....



YOU CONTRADICT SCRIPTURE, HERETIC.

For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die.But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—(For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many.And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification.For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous. - Romans 5:6-19 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans5:6-19&version=NKJV

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus,who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God,but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men.And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. - Philippians 2:5-8 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Philippians2:5-8&version=NKJV

Firstly, none of those verses say that Jesus dying on the cross saves you, in fact they clearly say we are saved by his life! Which is what I believe! And whereas Adam brought death into the world, grace and righteousness will reign in life through Christ Jesus. We are saved by life not death.

Also dying for our sins doesn't mean that's how we are saved, Jesus came to this world to bare witness to the truth and help us who were sinners, and he was murdered for it, thus he died for our sins, he came and suffered even being murdered for preaching the gospel and baring witness to the truth. No where in those verses does it say that Jesus was crucified to save us. Jesus was murdered by wicked men under the influence of satan. That was nothing to do with God.

As for why Jesus died on the cross, Jesus came as a living sacrifice, and in doing so, he was willing to suffer whatever was set before him, even the cross. Whatever satan did to him, including crucifying him, Jesus had to bare it, this was the cup that he was given and in doing so and suffering it and denying satan and not letting sin in, he overcame the world and satan. Nothing satan did could make Jesus sin, including scourging and murdering him. He overcame his evil with good and love. He endured the cross and suffered it and overcame the world. And he is our perfect example to follow. We are saved through Christ Jesus, through the gospel by word of God if we truly believe, we are saved by the grace of God through faith and we are then to live by the will of God.

Jesus said, the he was born and came into this world to bare witness to the truth, and those who are of the truth hear his voice.

Now can you answer my question please?

How does God coming down from heaven to be crucified by wicked men to appease his own wrath, save you? Thanks

 

[marhig]

You did say Jesus didn't have to die on the cross.

We do have to believe in his blood shed on the cross.

The Bible explains it many times that through his body, his blood, and the cross.

Go and read my posts again, I said that Jesus didn't have to die on the cross TO SAVE US.

Jesus was saving before he died, we are saved through Christ Jesus, through the gospel, by the word of God, by grace of God through faith, once we baptised of the Spirit we are saved daily from this world of sin and death as he helps us to overcome if we live by the will of God and remain in his goodness.

 

[marhig]

Are you kidding by saying that to Meshak when she goes against others who are saved? She has condemned many many times by saying I am a fake Christian, etc. She also says Paul is condemned. Where are we supposed to use scripture to build up those who are hypocrites? Don't you then share in their guilt?

Meshak speaks the truth in Jesus, as for Paul, I'm hoping that she will see the truth, that he is an apostle of God. At first I couldn't understand why meshak thought like she did, and then I saw what some were writing here, they seem to be following Paul rather then following Jesus, saying that the gospel Jesus taught is not for them, even saying that they are saved by Paul's gospel. There is only one gospel, the gospel of God preached by Jesus and his apostles including Paul.

We are to follow Christ Jesus not Paul, and Paul didn't say follow me, but rather follow me as I follow Christ, Paul followed Christ and we are to do the same. I hope that meshak will believe that Paul speaks the truth, but only God can judge her heart, and yours and mine also.

As for being called names or spoken ill of, many have done the same to me too, we have to take it and carry on and forgive and don't hold it and have hope for everyone, regardless of what they say or do to us and pray to God that we don't let our hearts harden against them, and leave it all to God, he will judge us all.

 

[popsthebuilder]

I assumed that's what you mean since you believe not in "grace alone/belief alone" for salvation.


1 Corinthians 1:18 KJV

Don't assume things.

We are saved by grace through faith.

That in no way means faith is not effectual and does not cause change.

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[marhig]

Vs.(memorize "for"):

1 Cor. 15 KJV

1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:


1 Peter 3 KJV
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:


1 Thessalonians 5 KJV

8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.

9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.



2 Corinthians 5 KJV

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.


Hebrews 2 KJV

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.



Romans 4 KJV

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.



Hebrews 9 KJV
15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.





Colossians 1 KJV
21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled 22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:


Romans 14 KJV
15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.

1 Corinthians 8 KJV
11 And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?



Contrasts.

Nothing there says that Jesus died on the cross to save us.

1 Peter 3 is talking about death to self, he was dead to his flesh and quickened by the Spirit, and being filled with the Spirit he preached the gospel of truth saving those who believe by the word of God.

Hebrews 2 is talking about Jesus going through what we do, he came into this sinful flesh and tasted death, he suffered at the hands of Satan like we do only he didn't sin, he was dead to his flesh, dead to his self will and lived by the will of God and he overcame the world.

And as for 1 Corinthians 15, it says there that we are saved by the gospel, which is the gospel of God that Christ and all his apostles, including Paul preached. And Christ died for our sins, he came and bore witness to the truth and was murdered for it, thus he died for our sins, yet knowing what would happen to him he was willing for it and he willingly suffered to bring us the truth, so he preached the gospel with the hope of saving as many as would believe on him, believe in the word of God, and through Christ Jesus we are saved, though faith by the grace of God.

I'll ask you the same question as I asked judge rightly,

How does God coming from heaven to be murdered at the hands of wicked men to appease his own wrath save you? Thanks

 

[meshak]

As for being called names or spoken ill of, many have done the same to me too,

Yes, I have seen tons of times. And I have been called names too.

We should not dwell on what the men says about us.

We are showing our immature in the faith by easily angered spirit. It is so against Jesus' spirit.


You are faithful with fruit. You are an excellent representative of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Yes, I have seen tons of times. And I have been called names too.

We should not dwell on what the men says about us.

We are showing our immature in the faith by easily angered spirit. It is so against Jesus' spirit.


You are faithful with fruit. You are an excellent representative of our Lord Jesus Christ.

So Jesus never got angry at anyone?

 

[popsthebuilder]

So Jesus never got angry at anyone?

He got angry with a fig tree that produced no fruit; and it died.

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[JudgeRightly]

He got angry with a fig tree that produced no fruit; and it died.

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Wait a minute, you're not Meshak. I want Meshak to answer the question.
[MENTION=13959]meshak[/MENTION], did Jesus ever get angry?

 

[meshak]

He got angry with a fig tree that produced no fruit; and it died.

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this is an excellent one.

thank you

 

[meshak]

He got angry with a fig tree that produced no fruit; and it died.

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have you seen my fruitful Cristian list thread?

it was titled "gentle spirited Christians".

 

[heir]

Firstly, none of those verses say that Jesus dying on the cross saves you, in fact they clearly say we are saved by his life! Which is what I believe! And whereas Adam brought death into the world, grace and righteousness will reign in life through Christ Jesus. We are saved by life not death.

Also dying for our sins doesn't mean that's how we are saved,

The means by which we are saved is that Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again the third day. If that were not the case, Paul wouldn't have declared it to be true in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV.

1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

1 Corinthians 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

 

[heir]

Go and read my posts again, I said that Jesus didn't have to die on the cross TO SAVE US. Jesus was saving before he died, we are saved through Christ Jesus, through the gospel, by the word of God, by grace of God through faith, once we baptised of the Spirit we are saved daily from this world of sin and death as he helps us to overcome if we live by the will of God and remain in his goodness.

What a load of dung! We couldn't be saved by anything else, but by the blood of Christ!

Ephesians 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

Ephesians 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

Ephesians 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

...

Ephesians 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

Ephesians 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

Ephesians 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

 

[john w]

Nothing there says that Jesus died on the cross to save us.

Yes, they do, Christ rejector. Do not confuse your lack of reading comprehension skills, due to that 2 Cor. 4:4 KJV, 1 Cori. 2:14 KJV blindness from your "god," with any possible error on my exposition.

1 Peter 3 is talking about death to self, he was dead to his flesh and quickened by the Spirit, and being filled with the Spirit he preached the gospel of truth saving those who believe by the word of God.

No-Peter asserts that the Lord Jesus Christ died for our sins, and Paul explains that He was raised again, for our justification.

Hebrews 2 is talking about Jesus going through what we do, he came into this sinful flesh and tasted death, he suffered at the hands of Satan like we do only he didn't sin, he was dead to his flesh, dead to his self will and lived by the will of God and he overcame the world.

No-Hebrews asserts that the Lord Jesus Christ died for our sins, and Paul explains that He was raised again, for our justification.

And as for 1 Corinthians 15, it says there that we are saved by the gospel, which is the gospel of God that Christ and all his apostles, including Paul preached

.

1 Cor. 15:1-4 KJV is not the gospel of God, blind one-it is the gospel of God-they are not equivalent. The content of faith, required to be believ4ed, in Mt.-John, prior to the dbr, was the gospel of God=that He was the Christ...believe on His name=and that was void of the dbr as the content of faith. You have been shown that, but your daddy devil tells you to keep saying "It all says the same thing."

Quit perverting the gospel of Christ, wolf. Get out of our territory-we do not like wolves roaming here, awaiting to "spiritually" plunder/rape/molest the sheep.