Where are your tithes going?

taoist

New member
Crow said:
Yup. And it's a lousy system. A few people own property. A private company wants to obtain their property so that they can develop it for profit. So rather than respecting the right of a person to possess their own property and having to make that person an offer that they will feel is acceptable for that property or even having to look for other property to purchase, it's decided that relatively more people will make relatively more money if the property owner is forced off his property and given a below-market value payment for the seized property. Oh, and if the present owner should take the case to court, which is his legal right, and lose, you might as well throw in charging him rent on his own property for the time that it took to receive the judgement, say five years or so.

Ok, now we have precident. Private developers can hook up with a town council and seize private property by eminent domain not to develop a road or something vital to the needs of the community, but to put up a strip mall, and pretty much tell you how much they're willing to pay for your property, as opposed to having to pay what the owner wants for his land or having to locate their mall where people are willing to sell.

So if Standard oil wants to seize a forest privately owned by a conservation group and set up a refinery, that's no longer wrong. They can make bunches more money than a lousy bunch of tree huggers who just happen to own that land. Heck, by the time the owners legally contest the seizure, they might end up owing the land grabber more than they were offered for the property in the first place. It's OK, because it's expedient, and it's been done before.

Or is it?

That's a problem I see when you toss abosolutes out. Because I am someone who bases my morality upon biblical standards, I perceive that it is absolutely wrong for one private party to seize another private party's property just because they possess greater economic and political influence.
Wonderful. But ...

I can find a biblical precedent not just for tossing a landowner off his land without payment ... but for killing him, his wife, his kids and even his livestock in the process. The choice of an absolute standard, it turns out, depends on your relative beliefs.

If there are inherent difficulties with a relative system, they are at least subject to revision through legislative feedback. Find anything that'll do the same job in an absolute system and I'll say you've made your point. The bible, as I've mentioned before, is an inherently immoral, primitive and downright barbaric standard from which to set up a system of moral beliefs for human beings.

Ask Job's kids if you don't believe me. The first ten, that is.
 

fool

Well-known member
Hall of Fame
Zakath said:
200 posts later, and has anyone actually addressed the opening post? :chuckle:
I thought I did somewhere, somthin about hanging the preists, their bosses, their bosses bosses,ect.
 

Zakath

Resident Atheist
fool said:
I thought I did somewhere, somthin about hanging the preists, their bosses, their bosses bosses,ect.
[Montgomery Burns voice]

Excellent, excellent.

[/Montgomery Burns voice]
 

death2impiety

Maximeee's Husband
Oh and, to answer the q on the thread, I send my offerings directly to World Vision so I'm in high hopes that they go to starving children but hey, ya never know...
 

allsmiles

New member
taoist said:
Wonderful. But ...

I can find a biblical precedent not just for tossing a landowner off his land without payment ... but for killing him, his wife, his kids and even his livestock in the process. The choice of an absolute standard, it turns out, depends on your relative beliefs.

If there are inherent difficulties with a relative system, they are at least subject to revision through legislative feedback. Find anything that'll do the same job in an absolute system and I'll say you've made your point. The bible, as I've mentioned before, is an inherently immoral, primitive and downright barbaric standard from which to set up a system of moral beliefs for human beings.

Ask Job's kids if you don't believe me. The first ten, that is.

ooh ooh! don't forget the levite and his concubine! or lot gettin' jiggy with his daughters, or david (the man after their god's own heart) murdering that hittite after bumpin' uglies with his wife, don't forget that Moses was a murderer, don't forget all of the concubines, the hundreds of wives, the city populations taken into slavery or wiped out, don't forget when Elijah wiped out the priests of Baal (according to the bible, the price for freedom of religion is death:))etc.
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
Turbo said:
It DOES mean that your assertion that murder has never been made legal is false.

And I'm surprised that you downplay the significance of these by calling them legal loopholes.

I misspoke, my bad. You're absolutely correct. (By the way I have NEVER seen a Christian on TOL admit they were out of line or inaccurate in a post.):devil:

I'm not downplaying anything, I'm saying that loopholes like this are grotesque and don't justify a thing.

Happy Thursday!
 

Crow

New member
taoist said:
Wonderful. But ...

I can find a biblical precedent not just for tossing a landowner off his land without payment ... but for killing him, his wife, his kids and even his livestock in the process. The choice of an absolute standard, it turns out, depends on your relative beliefs.

If there are inherent difficulties with a relative system, they are at least subject to revision through legislative feedback. Find anything that'll do the same job in an absolute system and I'll say you've made your point. The bible, as I've mentioned before, is an inherently immoral, primitive and downright barbaric standard from which to set up a system of moral beliefs for human beings.

Ask Job's kids if you don't believe me. The first ten, that is.

tao, can you cite that precident? I'm curious if was an action taken on the direct command of God, such as the Jews taking the land of Cannan, or it is an example of humans using the justice system God set up for when they deal with civil and criminal law.
 
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