The Catholics believe the same thing.
Unless You Believe That I Am "HE" (GOD) You Will Die In Your Sins, John 8:24
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
The Catholics believe the same thing.
Moses power was limited. It was God that brought the plagues on pharoh, not Moses.
The same thing is said of Yeshua:
Acts 10:37 KJV That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;
Acts 10:38 KJV How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
Krsto
Well-known member
John never penned those words.
Krsto
Well-known member
James too. Not you?
Krsto
Well-known member
Jesus' power was limited. He said himself he can do nothing of himself. Your 4th century creed doesn't respect that fact.
everready
New member
Hebrews 1:8
Hebrews 1:8
Yes He did:
Hebrews 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
verse 8
"8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom."
everready
Hebrews 1:8
Yes He did:
Hebrews 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
verse 8
"8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom."
everready
everready
New member
This proves He's whom He says He is by raising Himself from the dead.
John 10:18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
everready
Jesus had unlimited power just like God, Colossians 1:16-19.
Krsto
Well-known member
You just don't believe Jesus when he says he can do NOTHING without his father and then interpret this verse in Col. to say it means he has unlimited power, when it says no such thing. What you need to do Robert, if you believe the bible to be the Word of God, is to harmonize all the scriptures, not just pick and choose which ones you want to accept. To harmonize these scriptures, you would have to conclude that everything he does per this verse is because God delegated that ability to him. There's actually a better way to understand this verse but this will do for now.
If all things were created by him in heaven and earth then he has unlimited power, Colossians 1:16.
Its in the Bible and I believe the Bible.
You seem to think that scripture contradicts scripture.
No one can understand the trinity. Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit are all one, but their works are different. The Father stays in heaven, The Son comes into the world as the savior. The Holy Spirit glorifies the Son and works in the life of the believer.
keypurr
Well-known member
Could he say who could sit on his right or left side?
The only power he had was given to him by his creator.
How many times does a person need to be corrected concerning this passage? The only real problem is a willing blindness to what it says because of a particular preexisting paradigm-mindset. Just because ye olde king James and his court said it was true does not make it true:
Col 1:15 KJV WhoG3739 isG2076 the imageG1504 of theG3588 invisibleG517 God,G2316 the firstbornG4416 of everyG3956 creature:G2937
Col 1:16 KJV ForG3754 byG1722 himG846 were all thingsG3956 created,G2936 thatG3588 are inG1722 heaven,G3772 andG2532 thatG3588 are inG1909 earth,G1093 visibleG3707 andG2532 invisible,G517 whetherG1535 they be thrones,G2362 orG1535 dominions,G2963 orG1535 principalities,G746 orG1535 powers:G1849 all thingsG3956 were createdG2936 byG1223 him,G846 andG2532 forG1519 him:G846
G1722 ἐν
en
A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), that is, a relation of rest (intermediate between G1519 and G1537); “in”, at, (up-) on, by, etc.: - about, after, against, + almost, X altogether, among, X as, at, before, between, (here-) by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + give self wholly to, (here-) in (-to, -wardly), X mightily, (because) of, (up-) on, [open-] ly, X outwardly, one, X quickly, X shortly, [speedi-] ly, X that, X there (-in, -on), through (-out), (un-) to(-ward), under, when, where (-with), while, with (-in). Often used in compounds, with substantially the same import; rarely with verbs of motion, and then not to indicate direction, except (elliptically) by a separate (and different) prep. Total KJV occurrences: 2720
G1223 διά
dia
dee-ah'
A primary preposition denoting the channel of an act; through (in very wide applications, local, causal or occasional). In composition it retains the same general import: - after, always, among, at, to avoid, because of (that), briefly, by, for (cause) . . . fore, from, in, by occasion of, of, by reason of, for sake, that, thereby, therefore, X though, through (-out), to, wherefore, with (-in). In composition it retains the same general import. Total KJV occurrences: 610
Young's Literal Bible Translation speaks the truth herein:
Col 1:16 YLT because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created,
You simply have the wrong understanding of "by" which does not come "through" in English. Messiah Yeshua the Word is the channel or vessel through which the Father created all things. This means that the Father Himself is the SOURCE of the CREATIVE POWER.
How many times does a person need to be corrected concerning this passage? The only real problem is a willing blindness to what it says because of a particular preexisting paradigm-mindset. Just because ye olde king James and his court said it was true does not make it true:
Col 1:15 KJV WhoG3739 isG2076 the imageG1504 of theG3588 invisibleG517 God,G2316 the firstbornG4416 of everyG3956 creature:G2937
Col 1:16 KJV ForG3754 byG1722 himG846 were all thingsG3956 created,G2936 thatG3588 are inG1722 heaven,G3772 andG2532 thatG3588 are inG1909 earth,G1093 visibleG3707 andG2532 invisible,G517 whetherG1535 they be thrones,G2362 orG1535 dominions,G2963 orG1535 principalities,G746 orG1535 powers:G1849 all thingsG3956 were createdG2936 byG1223 him,G846 andG2532 forG1519 him:G846
G1722 ἐν
en
A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), that is, a relation of rest (intermediate between G1519 and G1537); “in”, at, (up-) on, by, etc.: - about, after, against, + almost, X altogether, among, X as, at, before, between, (here-) by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + give self wholly to, (here-) in (-to, -wardly), X mightily, (because) of, (up-) on, [open-] ly, X outwardly, one, X quickly, X shortly, [speedi-] ly, X that, X there (-in, -on), through (-out), (un-) to(-ward), under, when, where (-with), while, with (-in). Often used in compounds, with substantially the same import; rarely with verbs of motion, and then not to indicate direction, except (elliptically) by a separate (and different) prep. Total KJV occurrences: 2720
G1223 διά
dia
dee-ah'
A primary preposition denoting the channel of an act; through (in very wide applications, local, causal or occasional). In composition it retains the same general import: - after, always, among, at, to avoid, because of (that), briefly, by, for (cause) . . . fore, from, in, by occasion of, of, by reason of, for sake, that, thereby, therefore, X though, through (-out), to, wherefore, with (-in). In composition it retains the same general import. Total KJV occurrences: 610
Young's Literal Bible Translation speaks the truth herein:
Col 1:16 YLT because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created,
You simply have the wrong understanding of "by" which does not come "through" in English. Messiah Yeshua the Word is the channel or vessel through which the Father created all things. This means that the Father Himself is the SOURCE of the CREATIVE POWER.
You are pretty good at twisting scripture to try and prove your perverted anti-Christ doctrine.
Lets look at what the Bible really says.
"For BY HIM were all things created, that are in heaven and that are in the earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities or powers: all things were created BY HIM and for him" Colossians 1:16.
"And he is before all things, and by him all things consist" Colossians 1:17.
Bolding everything does not make your translation more correct. :crackup:
Again:
Colossians 1:16 YLT
16. because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created,
And others say essentially the same:
Colossians 1:16 NIV - New International Version
16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.
Colossians 1:16 NLV - New Living Translation
16 for through him God created everything in the heavenly realms and on earth. He made the things we can see and the things we can't see--such as thrones, kingdoms, rulers, and authorities in the unseen world. Everything was created through him and for him.
Colossians 1:16 ASV - American Standard Version
16 for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;
Colossians 1:16 ERV - English Revised Version
16 for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;
Sure glad I have no need to put my faith in the words of Robert Pate.
Bolding everything does not make your translation more correct. :crackup:
Again:
Colossians 1:16 YLT
16. because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; all things through him, and for him, have been created,
And others say essentially the same:
Colossians 1:16 NIV - New International Version
16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.
Colossians 1:16 NLV - New Living Translation
16 for through him God created everything in the heavenly realms and on earth. He made the things we can see and the things we can't see--such as thrones, kingdoms, rulers, and authorities in the unseen world. Everything was created through him and for him.
Colossians 1:16 ASV - American Standard Version
16 for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;
Colossians 1:16 ERV - English Revised Version
16 for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;
Sure glad I have no need to put my faith in the words of Robert Pate.
What is your true faith?
Just your same old theory.