Foxfire
Well-known member
He is issuing an executive order, pending legislation, [and] doing so after his many claims he could do no such thing.
Trump says he won't sign legislation banning separation of children from parents
- Thread starter The Barbarian
- Start date
He is issuing an executive order, pending legislation, [and] doing so after his many claims he could do no such thing.
Trump's own Chief of Staff, the Attorney General and his WH advisors are all on the record stating that the Trump Administration intended to interpret the existing immigration legislation in such a manner that "illegal" adults would now be charged with a criminal offence, thereby incarcerating then in prison waiting for their day in court.
This provided the Justice Department with the legal pretext to take these children, given that they were legally forbidden to remain with their parents in an adult jail - thereby serving as an example to discourage further illegal immigration!
What the Trump Administration engaged in was a classic moral exercise based on the false premise that "the ends justify the means" - something that any Christian with a knowledge of the Psalms could have told them!
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Trump's own Chief of Staff, the Attorney General and his WH advisors are all on the record stating that the Trump Administration intended to interpret the existing immigration legislation in such a manner that "illegal" adults would now be charged with a criminal offence, thereby incarcerating then in prison waiting for their day in court.
This provided the Justice Department with the legal pretext to take these children, given that they were legally forbidden to remain with their parents in an adult jail - thereby serving as an example to discourage further illegal immigration!
What the Trump Administration engaged in was a classic moral exercise based on the false premise that "the ends justify the means" - something that any Christian with a knowledge of the Psalms could have told them!
You’re fake news
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ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
how about that - treating people who break the law as criminals
whatever will they think of next?
Apparently "intojoy" has conveniently forgotten that "The Donald" spent several years peddling the "fake news" that President Obama was not born in the US and therefore constitutionally not entitled to hold office - a thinly veiled attempt to solicit the support of those who resented a "black" American in the White House!
"Fake news" is nothing more than members of the "Trump cult" engaging in a blanket denial to avoid explaining the "unexplainable" - which is rapidly becoming a daily occurrence given that American Presidents are expected to choose their words wisely, given that they can have a bad habit of coming back to haunt them!
He wasn’t born in hawaii. With all of the Obama’s butt kissers here, the doctor, the nurses, someone would’ve been bragging about his delivery but not a peep. I don’t believe a word obama says nor do I believe a word of the msm. You are all completely fake news. Who cares about the kids? They’ll be fine. They have a roof, food, clothing. Way better off now than in their s-holes they escaped from. With or without their parents. Come on. 5 years from now they won’t even remember this
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eider
Well-known member
We heard this morning that President Trump has decided to 'U Turn' and repeal his own legislation, and that parent/child separation will end.
It seems that both National and International opinion may have caused him to rethink and turn his politics around in this situation.
It's really good when World Leaders are prepared to rethink, repeal their decisions and admit mistakes. And so I think President Trump's decision here was wise....... to do a 'U Turn' on this.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
not as much of a U-turn as you might think - zero tolerance is still in effect, children will be held in detention centers with their parents.
so instead of getting them processed and into foster homes eating ice cream, watching tv and sleeping in beds in heartland usa, they'll be in cages with their parents on military bases
yes, congratulations lefties, this was a big win for you
as long as you don't keep pretending you really cared about the children
eider
Well-known member
I've missed you so much.............. missed the joy of reading your wonderful posts.
Now.... let's see....
So children won't be separated......... that's really good. It shows that President Trump will change his mind when he listens to others out there...... that's all good.
We saw pictures of children locked up in cages, rapped up in space blankets. You mean to say that you gave them nice accommodation, telly, ice cream and care? That is so sweet..... really.
But kids are massively traumatised when taken away from their Mums and Dads...... but your President figured that out, and that is good. All good.
Now don't take the laurels away from President Trump like that! He made the decisions here...... it's his win that the World can see that he is a thinking President. Really...... and I thought that you supported him.
China built a wall. And they have hardly any Mexicans. The wall was built to keep out Mongols, Manchus, Xiongnu, and so on. How well did it work?
Today, in China, there are 5.8 million Mongols, more than live in Mongolia. They conquered China, forming the Yuan dynasty.
There are 10.2 million Manchus. They conquered China, forming the Qing dynasty.
As George Santana wrote, "Those who do not remember the past are condemned to repeat it." Another drawback of electing an ignoramus to the office.
Perhaps Trump should have pulled a Jack Ma * and starred in that recent "this time, an Anglo saves the Great Wall of China" farce, starring Matt Damon **.
:chuckle:
_______________
* Jack Ma is a Chinese Billionaire who founded the colossal Ali Baba competitor to the likes of EBay and Amazon, who at times stars in his own various, very well made, highly successful movies.
Then again, the man is an actual Billionaire, with endless talent, well known in business throughout the world for his brilliant mind - not some fraud from New York.
** Enjoyed the movie, but well aware throughout of its' need for the ever predictable "Anglo saves the world" nonsense.
What is it with us Americans that our own amazing achievements are apparantly not impressive enough to us, that we just have to go and rob other nations of theirs?
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
I haven't seen evidence of this, at all.
Well, I supported President Obama when he was the chief executive of the executive branch also, I support the president no matter who he or she is, that's just . . . I don't know what it is. I salute the rank, not the person, I guess. But President Trump is better on the Second Amendment than a President Hillary Clinton would have been, so there is that.
He's better on it than either Clinton or President Obama was. There are already so many infringements of the right of the people to keep and bear arms, that the only real champions of the essential or inalienable right would be those who are trying to repeal laws, not add new ones.
When did either of them say they'd grab our guns first and worry about the law later? You're making a mistake if you think Trump cares about any constitutional rights at all.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
Clinton and bammy are skilled lawyer/politicians who learned over a lifetime to achieve success by masking their true intentions and manipulating weak-minded people
trump, on the other hand, has achieved success by being brash, loud and obnoxious
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Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
He's made some comments about guns that don't sound anything like what President Obama or Hillary Clinton have ever said. In response to the Pulse shooting for example, he said he wished there was someone armed there to kill the murderer to save lives. Neither of those other two ever talked like that.
And as to 'worry about the law later,' this was in the context of accused domestic abusers, if I'm not mistaken, not just grabbing guns willy-nilly. Not that I agree with him, we ought to affirm both the inalienable right to keep and bear arms, and this Constitutionally created right to due process both.
People should avoid entering into intimate relationships with murderers and rapists.
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
The end game for Democrats is repealing the Second Amendment, and in the meantime, they promote legislation for 'reasonable regulation,' which is euphemism for 'infringe,' which is explicitly forbidden in the Second Amendment.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
Given that the only major politician of either party who has advocated removing the 2nd Amendement is Donald Trump, I'd say you were way off base. Yes, I know you're telling us "he didn't mean it", and you're also telling us that the democrats don't mean it when they support the 2nd Amendment. But there is something about the reality we actually have, that makes it worth considering.
And every right is subject to "reasonable regulation." If you can be arrested for inciting a riot with inflammatory speech, why would it be surprising that you can be denied a weapon if you are a criminal or have a mental illness?
Indeed, the NRA, before it became radicalized, supported such legislation.
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
Where'd he say that? I've heard him say the opposite. But as I've mentioned, the only people who really champion the right are those who promote easier access to guns, and freer carrying of them---repealing current infringements iow.
Show me where he said it.
I won't say 'he didn't mean it.'
Because Democrats are in support of current infringements, and want to add to the list of infringements.
I'll thoughtfully consider whatever you have which shows President Trump saying he wants to repeal the Second Amendment. I have not heard or read that.
Inalienable rights are not.
Inciting a riot is not free speech, but a crime, as is slander and libel, and perjury. Just because you can say it or write it, does not mean that it's free speech.
I don't have a problem with disarming prison inmates, but once they're deemed safe enough to reenter society, then why would their inalienable right to keep and bear arms be infringed?
Why would victims of mental illness forfeit their inalienable right to keep and bear arms?
Wrongly.
“The only buffer you have is a parent. Take that away, and everything falls apart.”
Adversity in general is bad for kids. Things like poverty, racism, abuse, exposure to violence abuse can all produce what neuroscientists and development experts call toxic stress. Those issues do not have simple solutions. But the forcible, sudden separation of children from their parents is entirely avoidable.
“Here we have taken away what science has said is the most potent protector of children in the face of any adversity—the stability of the parent-child relationship,” says Jack Shonkoff, director of the Center on the Developing Child at Harvard University.
“This is not a scientific issue—it’s a fundamental, moral disaster.”
Why family separations are so devastating
When children are forcibly, abruptly separated from a parent or trusted caregiver, stress hormones like adrenaline and cortisol flood their systems. Over time, those hormones can start killing off neurons, causing both short- and long-term consequences that may cause learning and behavioral problems and/or physical and mental health issues, Shonkoff explains.
Children’s stress response systems, if persistently triggered over more than a brief encounter, can affect the immune system, the cardiovascular system, the metabolic system—and even alter the physical structure of the brain. The longer the separation, the worse the impact of the stress is likely to be.
“Every day that goes by that they remain separated from their parents is producing continuing activation of their stress responses, which is having a wear and tear effect on their developing brain and all of their biological systems,” Shonkoff says.
According to the attachment theory, developed in 1958 by John Bowlby and Mary Ainsworth, young children’s sense of security is rooted in their relationships with caregivers. That in turn shapes their social, cognitive, and emotional regulation skills. Separating a child from the caregiver puts the child’s long-term development at risk.
“The effect is catastrophic,” Charles Nelson, a pediatrics professor at Harvard Medical School, told the Washington Post. “There’s so much research on this that if people paid attention at all to the science, they would never do this.”
https://qz.com/1310749/the-fundamental-moral-disaster-of-family-separations/
And now we find, contradicting Trump's statements, that he has been planning this for over a year, as a way to discourage asylum applications.
Adversity in general is bad for kids. Things like poverty, racism, abuse, exposure to violence abuse can all produce what neuroscientists and development experts call toxic stress. Those issues do not have simple solutions. But the forcible, sudden separation of children from their parents is entirely avoidable.
“Here we have taken away what science has said is the most potent protector of children in the face of any adversity—the stability of the parent-child relationship,” says Jack Shonkoff, director of the Center on the Developing Child at Harvard University.
“This is not a scientific issue—it’s a fundamental, moral disaster.”
Why family separations are so devastating
When children are forcibly, abruptly separated from a parent or trusted caregiver, stress hormones like adrenaline and cortisol flood their systems. Over time, those hormones can start killing off neurons, causing both short- and long-term consequences that may cause learning and behavioral problems and/or physical and mental health issues, Shonkoff explains.
Children’s stress response systems, if persistently triggered over more than a brief encounter, can affect the immune system, the cardiovascular system, the metabolic system—and even alter the physical structure of the brain. The longer the separation, the worse the impact of the stress is likely to be.
“Every day that goes by that they remain separated from their parents is producing continuing activation of their stress responses, which is having a wear and tear effect on their developing brain and all of their biological systems,” Shonkoff says.
According to the attachment theory, developed in 1958 by John Bowlby and Mary Ainsworth, young children’s sense of security is rooted in their relationships with caregivers. That in turn shapes their social, cognitive, and emotional regulation skills. Separating a child from the caregiver puts the child’s long-term development at risk.
“The effect is catastrophic,” Charles Nelson, a pediatrics professor at Harvard Medical School, told the Washington Post. “There’s so much research on this that if people paid attention at all to the science, they would never do this.”
https://qz.com/1310749/the-fundamental-moral-disaster-of-family-separations/
And now we find, contradicting Trump's statements, that he has been planning this for over a year, as a way to discourage asylum applications.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
things like dragging them through violence-torn mexico and illegally crossing the border in the middle of the night?