toldailytopic: Same-sex marriage: for it, or against it?

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Rusha

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thank you for another opportunity to point out that it is just not practical to determine whether or not someone can't or will not have children

So why do YOU keep insisting that it's a valid requirement for deciding who should be allowed to marry? You have no way of knowing whether or not two individuals of the same sex will be adding an addition to their family. In the same way you have know way of knowing whether or not a heterosexual couple will be adding an addition to their family.

Women as young as 25 years of age are not always capable of having children. I know, I am one of those women.

So, perhaps you would like to explain what the difference is for a heterosexual couple who utilizes a surrogate or a homosexual couple who uses a surrogate. The result is the same ... an outside source was necessary to bring a child into the world.

Chrys, face it. You are a lazy debater and refuse to admit what we all know: You have no valid reason to oppose gay marriage other than religious bigotry.
 

chrysostom

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So why do YOU keep insisting that it's a valid requirement for deciding who should be allowed to marry? You have no way of knowing whether or not two individuals of the same sex will be adding an addition to their family. In the same way you have know way of knowing whether or not a heterosexual couple will be adding an addition to their family.

Women as young as 25 years of age are not always capable of having children. I know, I am one of those women.

So, perhaps you would like to explain what the difference is for a heterosexual couple who utilizes a surrogate or a homosexual couple who uses a surrogate. The result is the same ... an outside source was necessary to bring a child into the world.

Chrys, face it. You are a lazy debater and refuse to admit what we all know: You have no valid reason to oppose gay marriage other than religious bigotry.

when a man and a woman get married it is a reasonable assumption that they can and will have children
 

Rusha

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when a man and a woman get married it is a reasonable assumption that they can and will have children

Then why do married couples use birth control? Does that sound like they married for the SOLE PURPOSE of having children?
 

Rusha

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I think there is more of chance of getting all marriages banned across the board than having Chrys present a reasonable argument.
 

Rusha

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the reason a person gets married is not necessarily the purpose of marriage

So the couple should be mandated to divorce? Should all childless couples have their marriages revoked and be made null and void?
 

Town Heretic

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the same constitution that allows you to kill your baby?
Sure. Like I've said, there's a struggle to live up to our founding principles and move beyond our bias in this or that, from racism and slavery to sexism and suffrage to homophobia and contract.

or
is it just the interpretation of some liberal judge
No. It's a continuation of the guiding principle trumpeted by the executors of that Constitution in their/our Declaration that ALL men are created equal, that we are created equal and that the law/governments are instituted among men to ensure that equality.

I suppose I should just be happy that you've found at least one union to approve of, if in a limited capacity.
 

chrysostom

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It's a continuation of the guiding principle trumpeted by the executors of that Constitution in their/our Declaration that ALL men are created equal, that we are created equal and that the law/governments are instituted among men to ensure that equality.

but we are not created equal

one can have a baby and the other cannot

the one that can have a baby needs the other to get one
and
you need both of them to protect it

don't you think there is an overwhelming/compelling societal interest in this?
 

Silent Hunter

Well-known member
but we are not created equal

one can have a baby and the other cannot
. . . that isn't what the phrase means . . .

. . . everyone shares the same "rights" . . . as the Declaration of Independence says . . . "that among these (rights, SH) are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men".

the one that can have a baby needs the other to get one
. . . really? . . . so much for in-vitro fertilization . . . :rolleyes:.

and
you need both of them to protect it
. . . which is demonstratively not true.

don't you think there is an overwhelming/compelling societal interest in this?
. . . no . . . but one of your over riding themes is to recycle your inane assertions.

. . . see . . .

. . . here . . .

. . . and . . .

. . . here.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
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but we are not created equal
We are before the law/or that was the intent we struggle toward, to our credit.

one can have a baby and the other cannot
Untrue, but off point on the right of contract, since those who can procreate within the bounds of a committed relationship, without resorting to surrogacy, frequently choose not to and needn't to marry/contract.

the one that can have a baby needs the other to get one
and
you need both of them to protect it

don't you think there is an overwhelming/compelling societal interest in this?
As I've explained more than once, that isn't how you apply the standard. We are equal in right. To abrogate, to take from someone their otherwise unobstructed right, to put them in an unequal position in terms of the exercise of that right, to deny them a thing someone else is allowed by right, you must find a compelling interest that overwhelms THEIR otherwise unobstructed usage.

That means you have to advance an overwhelming (and legally rare) interest in DENYING the homosexual couple the right to contract as the heterosexual couple can. That is, there must be something in allowing the contract between them that is threatening/dangerous to the Republic and demonstrably so, to the point where the abrogation of right is necessitated.

So when we wanted, as a nation, to inter people of Japanese ancestry, denying them due process among other rights, we had to show a compelling state interest to justify the abrogation. Some advanced our inability to distinguish the saboteur from the loyal American, that to allow many near cousins to our enemy to move about freely would pose a danger to our military forces and capability. And the danger posed by the emotions of Americans in the wake of Pearl Harbor to those same citizens was cited by some as a part of the necessity.

Try again.
 

chrysostom

Well-known member
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so where did marriage come from?

it goes way back before there was a constitution
but
not before there were lawyers

prostitutes and lawyers could be the oldest professions

they are needed to get around the original intent
 
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