toldailytopic: During His earthly ministry would Jesus have approved of the homosexua

[elohiym]

What part of this verse are you having trouble understanding?

None of it.

The specific act is a man having sexual intercourse with a man as if the male was a woman.

No. That's not what it means. A man cannot have sex with another "as with" (in like manner) a woman. It's not physically possible. :duh: The Hebrew word translated to "as with" doesn't even mean "as with." It a complete mistranslation of the Hebrew.

Also, you don't have a scripture related to female homosexuality. Compare that to the prohibition where both men and women were prohibited from having sex with animals.

It is impossible for the man of a heterosexual married couple to do the same specific act with his wife since his wife is not a male.

It is possible for a man married to a woman to commit adultery with another man. That is what the scripture is specifically about. The conditional clause and use of both Hebrew words shakab and miskab didn't clue you in to that?

The act in question is clearly a male homosexual act being engaged in by a man who has a marital bed (miskab) with a woman. It's just describing another form of adultery.

 

[genuineoriginal]

I disagree. 1 John 3:15 is clear a murderer does not have eternal life abiding in him, so cannot be saved while being a murderer.

Leviticus 19:17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.​

1 John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.​

So, anyone that does not rebuke homosexuals for committing sinful acts is a murderer and does not have eternal life in him.

Sounds pretty clear to me.

 

[elohiym]

:think: I'm going to consider sharing a little story here. Depends if this thread's going to turn into a debate on whether or not Christians can sin.

You brought up a Christians capacity to sin, too. Remember your point about murder?

 

[genuineoriginal]

The act in question is clearly a male homosexual act being engaged in by a man who has a marital bed (miskab) with a woman. It's just describing another form of adultery.

No, the act in question is clearly a male attempting to have sex with another male as if the other male is his wife.

You seem to have a lot of problems understanding what the Bible clearly states about this issue.

Are you attempting to twist the Law in order to justify your own acts in your mind?

 

[MaryContrary]

Why can't the same be said for every sin? And if it can, then every Christian who claims to sin from time-to-time (most on TOL) still has an unregenerate heart.

I disagree. 1 John 3:15 is clear a murderer does not have eternal life abiding in him, so cannot be saved while being a murderer. There are other scriptures to support that as well. Furthermore, murder is a wilful act by definition.

What sins do Christians commit unwillingly? And what does that say about free will?

And heeere we go again. :mmph:
This is why I don't usually bother with you, Elo.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Hey elohiym yes or no...

During His earthly ministry would Jesus have approved of the homosexual lifestyle?

(there isn't a chance in Hades that he's gonna answer the question is he? :chuckle: )

 

[elohiym]

So, anyone that does not rebuke homosexuals for committing sinful acts is a murderer and does not have eternal life in him.

What about people who claim to be Christian, yet still sin from time-to-time? Do they have eternal life in them? Are they not murderers, too?

Do you still sin from time-to-time? Yes or no.

 

[MaryContrary]

Hey elohiym yes or no...

During His earthly ministry would Jesus have approved of the homosexual lifestyle?

(there isn't a chance in Hades that he's gonna answer the question is he? :chuckle: )

No, that would require taking a clear position that risks someone else doing to it what he does to everyone else's. lain:

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

...

 

[elohiym]

And heeere we go again. :mmph:

Unresponsive.

This is why I don't usually bother with you, Elo.

And this is why I don't usually bother with you. :chuckle:

 

[MaryContrary]

Elo, I still to this day have a crush on Summer Glau. I watch Firefly or the Terminator Chronicles every once in a while and sigh wistfully. Still think Hilary Swank in Million Dollar Baby is super hot. If I had to pick between Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt, I'd have to think about it.

Now, tell me I'm not a Christian.

Don't give me a bunch of crap, just answer simply. Yes or No. Just as you demand everyone else answer.

Let's hear it.

 

[genuineoriginal]

What about people who claim to be Christian, yet still sin from time-to-time? Do they have eternal life in them?

Since you are refusing to rebuke homosexual acts, I would have to say you do not have eternal life in you.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

And this my friends is what thread hijacking looks like.

 

[rocketman]

And this my friends is what thread hijacking looks like.

:chuckle:

 

[elohiym]

Hey elohiym yes or no...

During His earthly ministry would Jesus have approved of the homosexual lifestyle?

I would like to answer no, but I don't know what you mean by "homosexual lifestyle," and don't know what you mean by "approve." It's a moving target.

Help me understand what you are really asking. I need to know at least how you define "homosexual lifestyle."

If homosexual acts are sin then homosexual desire/orientation itself is sin. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: Yes.)

If homosexual desire/orientation is not sin, then God approves of homosexual desire/orientation. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: Yes.)

If homosexuals who are sexually attracted to the same sex do not engage in sexual acts with the same sex, they are not living the homosexual lifestyle. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: No.)

If homosexual desire/orientation is not sin, but homosexual acts are sin, the same sexual acts are sinful when married heterosexuals perform them. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: Yes.)

there isn't a chance in Hades that he's gonna answer the question is he? :chuckle

The reason I can't answer should be obvious from my questions, and obvious to anyone who believes the gospel.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I would like to answer no

:BRAVO: See it wasn't that hard to answer was it?

but I don't know what you mean by "homosexual lifestyle," and don't know what you mean by "approve." It's a moving target.

Whatever you say, Bill Clinton.

 

[genuineoriginal]

If homosexual acts are sin then homosexual desire/orientation itself is sin. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: Yes.)

If homosexual desire/orientation is not sin, then God approves of homosexual desire/orientation. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: Yes.)

If homosexuals who are sexually attracted to the same sex do not engage in sexual acts with the same sex, they are not living the homosexual lifestyle. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: No.)

If homosexual desire/orientation is not sin, but homosexual acts are sin, the same sexual acts are sinful when married heterosexuals perform them. Do you agree? Yes or no. (My answer: Yes.)

So, you think:

• Homosexual desire is a sin
• God approves of homosexual desire
• Homosexuals that do not commit homosexual acts are living the homosexual lifestyle
• Married heterosexuals are committing homosexual acts by having heterosexual sex

You are very confused.

 

[elohiym]

Elo, I still to this day have a crush on Summer Glau. I watch Firefly or the Terminator Chronicles every once in a while and sigh wistfully. Still think Hilary Swank in Million Dollar Baby is super hot. If I had to pick between Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt, I'd have to think about it.

Now, tell me I'm not a Christian.

Why would I do that? Others were making arguments that would imply you are not a Christian, not me.

Don't give me a bunch of crap, just answer simply. Yes or No. Just as you demand everyone else answer.

You didn't ask a question, Mary. And you didn't ask a "yes or no" question.

Let's hear it.

What? :idunno:

You haven't addressed any of my points.

 

[elohiym]

So, you think:

• Homosexual desire is a sin
• God approves of homosexual desire
• Homosexuals that do not commit homosexual acts are living the homosexual lifestyle
• Married heterosexuals are committing homosexual acts by having heterosexual sex

You are very confused.

I'm not confused. All my questions were conditional ("If"), so don't make assumptions. You didn't understand the questions or my answers. For example, I didn't say heterosexuals commit homosexual acts by having heterosexual sex. Please learn to read, or ask an adult what acts homosexuals engage in that heterosexuals engage in, too. You may figure out what I'm asking and why.

 

[MaryContrary]

Why would I do that? Others were making arguments that would imply you are not a Christian, not me.

You didn't ask a question, Mary. And you didn't ask a "yes or no" question.

What? :idunno:

You haven't addressed any of my points.

Never mind. I'll just let this stand as it is.