The Wonderful Dispensation of Grace

[lightninboy]

Dear patman,
Thank you for your reply.

I think the law was supposed to make one see his need for salvation by grace through faith in God’s Provision.

An expert in the Law of Moses came to Jesus to test Him (Luke 10:25) and asked, "Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"
Jesus turned the questions back on him and asked what the Law of Moses said about that. The lawyer said, "‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, and with all your mind,’ and ‘your neighbor as yourself’" (Luke 10:17, quoting Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18).
The Lord Jesus said, "You have answered rightly; do this and you will live."
The answer can be found by taking the Lord’s reply seriously.
The fact that no one can or does keep the law doesn’t mean this isn’t hypothetically possible. The Lord Jesus unmistakably holds out obeying God’s commands as the legalistic way to gain eternal life.
The apostle Paul spoke of this hypothetical method of justification too. He said, "Not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified" (Romans 2:13). However, he goes on to show that absolutely no one is a doer of the law (cf. Romans 3:10-20, esp. v 20, "by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law comes the knowledge of sin").
Whenever we are faced with a person who thinks they can gain eternal life by their works, we can help them by showing them the impossibility of this hypothetical method of salvation. Once a person is stripped of this false hope, they must look elsewhere for eternal life. Then their only hope is the one Person who indeed fulfilled the entire Law and who died in our place.

I refer you to posts #168, #170, #173, #254, #255, #259, #267, #273, #274, #278, and #280.

 

[godrulz]

proof?

Genesis to Revelation.

The veil was torn at the cross. The finished work of Christ is sufficient to introduce the New Covenant where there is neither Jew nor Gentile, but all are one in Christ.

Since your view is the new kid on the block and contradicted by biblical, historical Christianity through the centuries, I think the burden of proof lies with you, not the self-evident view held for centuries.

 

[lightninboy]

I am part of the sister organization (PAOCanada) to AofG. I was a credentialed pastor and studied their statement of faith/essential truths (see their website). If anyone teaches what you think they do, then they are out of step with the fellowship. You are simply misinformed and misunderstand classical Pentecostal beliefs that are not hyper-Arminian.

Here's a word to refute your Arminian legalism: www.evangelicaloutreach.org

 

[patman]

Genesis to Revelation.

The veil was torn at the cross. The finished work of Christ is sufficient to introduce the New Covenant where there is neither Jew nor Gentile, but all are one in Christ.

Since your view is the new kid on the block and contradicted by biblical, historical Christianity through the centuries, I think the burden of proof lies with you, not the self-evident view held for centuries.

GR, what kind of proof is that? The Pentecostal church is a new church too. So better stop going I guess.

Jesus fulfilled the law, he brought God and man together, but he did not abolish it until Paul. Grace is grossly misunderstood by most christians because they are still following rules for their salvation because they have been taught to by people who try to bring the law and grace under one roof.

 

[patman]

Dear patman,
Thank you for your reply.

I think the law was supposed to make one see his need for salvation by grace through faith in God’s Provision.

An expert in the Law of Moses came to Jesus to test Him (Luke 10:25) and asked, "Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"
Jesus turned the questions back on him and asked what the Law of Moses said about that. The lawyer said, "‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, and with all your mind,’ and ‘your neighbor as yourself’" (Luke 10:17, quoting Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18).
The Lord Jesus said, "You have answered rightly; do this and you will live."
The answer can be found by taking the Lord’s reply seriously.
The fact that no one can or does keep the law doesn’t mean this isn’t hypothetically possible. The Lord Jesus unmistakably holds out obeying God’s commands as the legalistic way to gain eternal life.
The apostle Paul spoke of this hypothetical method of justification too. He said, "Not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified" (Romans 2:13). However, he goes on to show that absolutely no one is a doer of the law (cf. Romans 3:10-20, esp. v 20, "by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law comes the knowledge of sin").
Whenever we are faced with a person who thinks they can gain eternal life by their works, we can help them by showing them the impossibility of this hypothetical method of salvation. Once a person is stripped of this false hope, they must look elsewhere for eternal life. Then their only hope is the one Person who indeed fulfilled the entire Law and who died in our place.

I refer you to posts #168, #170, #173, #254, #255, #259, #267, #273, #274, #278, and #280.

Once again, I do not totally disagree with you. But you still do not fully appreciate that Jesus WAS saying to follow the law. And Paul was saying not to.

The plan is very similar in that it requires faith. But deeds for one plan, one grace. But in both, faith in Jesus death is what covers the sins.

It is a technical difference really. We both believe in grace, you just do not see the law in Christ's message, but it is there. It is not Acts 2 that explains why no one can raise the dead today, it is MAD.

 

[lightninboy]

Dear patman,
Thank you for your reply.

I hope you read those posts I mentioned. I should check them again. Notice that my position was official doctrine of the Baptist Church.

I'm glad you agree with me some.

If faith in Christ covered sins, does it not make sense that keeping the law was for some non-salvation reason?

Do you have any users of Christian Revolution who are Acts 2?
Would you say they are deluded?

 

[patman]

Dear patman,
Thank you for your reply.

I hope you read those posts I mentioned. I should check them again. Notice that my position was official doctrine of the Baptist Church.

I'm glad you agree with me some.

If faith in Christ covered sins, does it not make sense that keeping the law was for some non-salvation reason?

Do you have any users of Christian Revolution who are Acts 2?
Would you say they are deluded?

Man, I dunno. It is a brand new site, still in the works. Many people are Acts 2, i used to be. But Acts 9 is technically more accurate.

I am sorry to say I did not read those post, I do no have a lot of time to go back and find them. I find that I generally agree with the Baptist, for whatever that is worth.

God established the law for a reason, he asked the early christians to follow it for a reason. Now that reason is not applicable, so Grace is the covenant.

 

[godrulz]

Here's a word to refute your Arminian legalism: www.evangelicaloutreach.org

Sounds like he rejects Calvinism.

Both Arminianism or Calvinism can become legalistic, but this is not a cause-effect relationship.

A quick look at the statement of faith seems fine. He also rejects OSAS, as I do. What is your point?

 

[Bob Hill]

Pastor Hill, please describe the Great Tribulation and the Millennium in detail!

When we look at the end times scenario, one church says Christ is already reigning. They believe the prophecy in Daniel 7:13,14 has already been fulfilled. Daniel 7:13,14 “I was watching in the night visions, and behold, One like the Son of Man, coming with the clouds of heaven! He came to the Ancient of Days, and they brought Him near before Him. 14 Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom, that all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and His kingdom the one which shall not be destroyed.”

A spokesman for this church wrote, “In fulfillment of this prophecy, Acts 2:1-47 clearly teaches these things:
(1)The kingdom was set up on the first day of Pentecost following the resurrection of Christ.
(2) Christ became king over a spiritual kingdom (the church of the Lord Jesus Christ, Matt. 16:13-18) and not over some military, material earthly kingdom with a political throne in Jerusalem.

Premillennialists presently tell us that time is not yet come!

But the writer of Hebrews said they received the kingdom in the first century.
Heb 12:28 Therefore, since we are receiving a kingdom which cannot be shaken, let us have grace, by which we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear.

Yet, we read the context of Rev 12:10, prophesying about the future day of the Lord.
Rev 12:10 Then I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, “Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down.

But, after reading that, we see that it was still in the future when John wrote the book of Revelation in about 90 AD.

Another denomination believes the church will influence the world so that the world will get better and Christ will return. They call themselves post-millennialists. This group spiritualizes the Bible and applies the promises made to Israel applicable to the church.

But Paul wrote about Israel in Romans 11:25-29: For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The Deliverer will come out of Zion, and He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob; 27 For this is My covenant with them, when I take away their sins.” 28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

Therefore, I believe the next event that we will see is the rapture, if we are still here at that time. 2 Th 2:1-4 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ is now present. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition.

The rapture of the Body of Christ will start a sequence of many prophetic events. The rapture is before the tribulation because nothing in this present Dispensation of Grace is prophesied. Eph 3:8,9 To me, who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9 and to make all see what is the dispensation of the mystery, which has been hidden from ages in God who created all things through Jesus Christ.

That’s what I call the nature of the mystery.

Then the next thing will be the tribulation. Israel was identified as the people of the tribulation by Daniel in Dan 9:24; 10:14; 12:1.

Our Lord Jesus Christ mentioned Daniel’s abomination of desolation (Dan 9:27; 11:31) in the tribulation’s setting. Mat 24:15-21 “Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17 Let him who is on the housetop not go down to take anything out of his house. 18 And let him who is in the field not go back to get his clothes. 19 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! 20 And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be.”

The purpose of the tribulation will be to purify Israel for her kingdom reign (Dan 9:24; Zec 13:9). That’s why Jeremiah 30:7 says the tribulation is precisely called a time of tribulation for Jacob.

Since the Dispensation of the Mystery has nothing to do with Israel, the tribulation, which is specifically designated for Israel, is irrelevant to the present Body of Christ Church which is His body.

The nature of the mystery shows us that the body of Christ is never referred to in prophecy prior to Paul’s conversion.

Therefore, we can make some conclusions about when it will occur.
They are:
A. Prophecy about the people in the tribulation could not refer to the body of Christ.
B. Prophecy about the day of the Lord could not apply to the body of Christ.
C. Prophecy about the people under the wrath of God could not apply to the body of Christ.

Therefore, the rapture, since it only applies to the body of Christ, must take place prior to the prophetic program which follows it for the next seven years.

After that, the great and awesome day of the Lord is next. This is what is normally called the second coming. Acts 2:20 The sun shall be turned into darkness and the moon into blood before the coming of the great and awesome day of the LORD.

Mat 24:29,30 Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Next, the judgment of the nations will take place.
Mat 25:31,32 When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.

Then the millennial reign of Christ begins. Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

After that, Satan is loosed. Rev 20:7-9 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. 9 They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them.

Then the great white throne judgment will take place. Rev 20:11-15 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

Then the New Heavens and Earth are established. And they reign forever.
Rev 21:1,3,27; 22:5 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. . . . 3 Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. . . . 27 only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. 22:5 And they shall reign forever and ever.

So what should we do?
Rev 5:11-14 Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne, the living creatures, and the elders; and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands, 12 saying with a loud voice: “Worthy is the Lamb who was slain To receive power and riches and wisdom, And strength and honor and glory and blessing!” 13 And every creature which is in heaven and on the earth and under the earth and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, I heard saying: “Blessing and honor and glory and power Be to Him who sits on the throne, And to the Lamb, forever and ever!” 14 Then the four living creatures said, “Amen!” And the twenty-four elders fell down and worshiped Him who lives forever and ever.

That doesn’t tell us, but we should focus on loving God for all He has done for us.

Returning to our Dispensation of Grace, it’s important for us to remember that the dispensation of grace ends with the rapture. 2 Th 2:3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition.

Yes, then the tribulation. This is the Lord’s Day. The first beast is revealed and makes a covenant with Israel for 7 years. He breaks the covenant after 3½ years. Dan 9:27a He will strengthen a covenant with the many for one heptad; and at the midpoint of the heptad he will stop sacrifice and grain offering.

Then, it says, according in Dan 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days.

The Great and Notable Day of the Lord happens after the tribulation.
Acts 2:20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord. Mat 24:29,30 Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Then judgment. The sheep and goat nations are judged. Tribulation martyrs are resurrected.
Mat 25:31,32 When the Son of Man comes in His glory and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.

Then there is the 1,000 year reign, and tribulation martyrs reign with Christ 1,000 years.
Rev 20:4 Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Then, Satan is loosed, and he deceives the nations and leads them to the battle of Gog and Magog. They are destroyed.
Rev 20:7-9 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. 9 They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them.

Then there is the Great White Throne judgment when all of the rest of the dead are judged.
Rev 20:11-15 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it . . . 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 . . . And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

Then there is the New Heaven and Earth, and Israel’s promised kingdom is established in peace and righteousness. They shall reign forever.
Rev 21:1,3,27; 22:5 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. . . . 3 Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. . . . 27 only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. 22:5 And they shall reign forever and ever.

So the next thing that will happen is the rapture of the Body of Christ. 2 The 2:1-4 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition.

Then, after the rapture, the tribulation.

What should we do? It tells us in Eph 3:8,9.
Eph 3:8,9 To me, who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9 and to make all see what is the dispensation of the mystery, which has been hidden from the ages in God who created all things through Jesus Christ.

Other important passages are: Dan 9:24; 10:14; 12:1; 9:27; 11:31; Mat 24:15-21; Dan 9:24; Zec 13:9; Jer 30:7

Therefore:
A. Prophecy about the people in the tribulation would not refer to the body of Christ.
B. Prophecy about the day of the Lord would not apply to the body of Christ.
C. Prophecy about the people under the wrath of God would not apply to the body of Christ.

Then the great and awesome day of the Lord takes place.
Then the judgment of the nations takes place.
Then the millennial reign of Christ takes place.
Then Satan is loosed.
Then the great white throne judgment takes place.
Then the new heavens and earth are established.

We look forward to the Rapture, because everything else comes to pass after that.
1Cor 15:24 Then [comes] the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.

In Christ,
Bob Hill

 

[godrulz]

GR, what kind of proof is that? The Pentecostal church is a new church too. So better stop going I guess.

Jesus fulfilled the law, he brought God and man together, but he did not abolish it until Paul. Grace is grossly misunderstood by most christians because they are still following rules for their salvation because they have been taught to by people who try to bring the law and grace under one roof.

See other threads for more responsive detail.

The early church (Corinth; Acts) was Pentecostal. Just because it waxed and waned in church history due to man's unbelief does not mean it was invented at Azusa Street. The roots are biblical and historical.

I beg to differ as to the timing of things. Jesus, not Paul, was the epitomy of the grace message. Jesus promised to build His church (neither Jew nor Gentile) and birthed it in power at Pentecost, not when Paul fell off a horse.

 

[Bob Hill]

The Dispensation of Grace was given to Paul first.

Col 1:24-26 I now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up in my flesh what is lacking in the afflictions of Christ, for the sake of His body, which is the church, 25 of which I became a minister according to the stewardship from God which was given to me for you, to fulfill the word of God, 26 the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, but now has been revealed to His saints.

Rom 16:25,26 Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began 26 but now has been made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures has been made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith

Eph 3:1-7 For this reason I, Paul, the prisoner of Christ Jesus for you Gentiles – 2 if indeed you have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which was given to me for you, 3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, 7 of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power.

It had been given to Paul, “which was given to me for you” for the Ephesians: “not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets”.

In Christ,
Bob Hill

 

[Bob Hill]

Originally Posted by Lighthouse

Pastor Hill, What is your opinion of John 3:16 being applicable to people in The Wonderful Dispensation of Grace?

Lighthouse, even though it was not written to us, John 3:16 is very applicable in The Wonderful Dispensation of Grace, “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” I do think that when we use it that we should explain what it means.

In Christ,
Bob Hill

 

[godrulz]

Lighthouse, even though it was not written to us, John 3:16 is very applicable in The Wonderful Dispensation of Grace, “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” I do think that when we use it that we should explain what it means.

In Christ,
Bob Hill

If John 3:16 is not applicable to us, then neither is Jn. 1:12; 3:3; 14:6; etc. John wrote after Paul, I think, and was writing to believers in the Son of God. Pauline thought was based on the teachings of the Master. They were not superior to them?! Note that Jesus did not teach faith + works as Mid-Acts assumes. In the same chapter, he also talks about 'born again', regeneration, which is not diametrically opposed to Pauline thought either. Johannine and Pauline thought both find their foundation in Christ's teachings and are complementary, not competing.

 

[lightninboy]

Sounds like he rejects Calvinism.

Both Arminianism or Calvinism can become legalistic, but this is not a cause-effect relationship.

A quick look at the statement of faith seems fine. He also rejects OSAS, as I do. What is your point?

The point is you and Dan Corner don't agree on what sin causes a Christian to cease being a Christian.
He says adultery and you don't.
He says suicide and you don't.
People who believe in conditional security can disagree on what sin causes a Christian to cease being a Christian, but people who believe in salvation by grace through faith plus nothing have full coverage against all sins.

 

[godrulz]

The point is you and Dan Corner don't agree on what sin causes a Christian to cease being a Christian.
He says adultery and you don't.
He says suicide and you don't.
People who believe in conditional security can disagree on what sin causes a Christian to cease being a Christian, but people who believe in salvation by grace through faith plus nothing have full coverage against all sins.

Read my lips: The sin of UNBELIEF is unique. Before conversion, we can be forgiven for unbelief, but not while peristing in it. FAITH is a condition of salvation. You cannot believe and not believe in ultimate intention (God vs Self) at the same time (you can waver in your faith and doubt like Thomas did without becoming Judas...honest doubt is not fatal like hardened unbelief).

Likewise, those who revert to unbelief (possible unless we are robots who cannot change our minds and wills) are not believers and forfeit the promises and privileges of unbelievers (John 3:16, 36 knows nothing of an 'unbelieving believer').

We can talk about identity (sozo's objection anticipated), but our identity is based on being IN HIM and remaining in HIM (I Jn. 5:11-13). If we identify with our former state of godless unbelief, we do not have the life of God. One cannot reject the person and work of Christ (whether one once believed or not) and claim the security reserved for BELIEVERS, not apostates or unbelievers.

The issue is not sins, like adultery. Christians who are immoral have provision for sins. One sin (unlike persistent unbelief) affects fellowship/intimacy without negating relationship and salvation.

 

[lightninboy]

16 Fundamental Truths of the Assemblies of God

5. The Salvation of Man
Conditions to Salvation
Salvation is received through repentance toward God and faith toward the Lord Jesus Christ. By the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, being justified by grace through faith, man becomes an heir of God, according to the hope of eternal life.
The Evidence of Salvation
The inward evidence of salvation is the direct witness of the Spirit.
The outward evidence to all men is a life of righteousness and true holiness.
7. The Baptism in the Holy Spirit
All believers are entitled to and should ardently expect and earnestly seek the promise of the Father, the baptism in the Holy Spirit and fire, according to the command of our Lord Jesus Christ. This was the normal experience of all in the early Christian Church. With it comes the enduement of power for life and service, the bestowment of the gifts and their uses in the work of the ministry.
This experience is distinct from and subsequent to the experience of the new birth.
With the baptism in the Holy Spirit come such experiences as:
• an overflowing fullness of the Spirit, John 7:37-39 [KJV/NIV], Acts 4:8 [KJV/NIV]
• a deepened reverence for God, Acts 2:43 [KJV/NIV], Hebrews 12:28 [KJV/NIV]
• an intensified consecration to God and dedication to His work, Acts 2:42 [KJV/NIV]
• and a more active love for Christ, for His Word and for the lost, Mark 16:20 [KJV/NIV]
8. The Initial Physical Evidence of the Baptism in the Holy Spirit
The baptism of believers in the Holy Spirit is witnessed by the initial physical sign of speaking with other tongues as the Spirit of God gives them utterance.
The speaking in tongues in this instance is the same in essence as the gift of tongues, but is different in purpose and use.
9. Sanctification
Sanctification is an act of separation from that which is evil, and of dedication unto God.
The Scriptures teach a life of "holiness without which no man shall see the Lord."
By the power of the Holy Spirit we are able to obey the command: "Be ye holy, for I am holy."
Sanctification is realized in the believer by recognizing his identification with Christ in His death and resurrection, and by the faith reckoning daily upon the fact of that union, and by offering every faculty continually to the dominion of the Holy Spirit.
10. The Church and its Mission
The Assemblies of God exists expressly to give continuing emphasis to this reason for being in the New Testament apostolic pattern by teaching and encouraging believers to be baptized in the Holy Spirit. This experience:
1. Enables them to evangelize in the power of the Spirit with accompanying supernatural signs.
2. Adds a necessary dimension to worshipful relationship with God.
3. Enables them to respond to the full working of the Holy Spirit in expression of fruit and gifts and ministries as in New Testament times for the edifying of the body of Christ.
12. Divine Healing
Divine healing is an integral part of the gospel. Deliverance from sickness is provided for in the atonement, and is the privilege of all believers.

Confession of Sins

The word confess means "acknowledge." Confession of sins is an acknowledgment or admission of sins, with the intent of seeking forgiveness. The Scriptures promise, "If we confess our sins, he [God] is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins" (1 John 1:9). Today when we come to Jesus with our sins our prayer ought to be that of the repentant tax collector, "God, have mercy on me, a sinner" (Luke 18:13).
When we share the gospel with sinners, God uses us to challenge them to repent and receive His forgiveness. In leading people to Christ, the confession of sins is to be directed to God through Jesus Christ. Nowhere does God’s Word tell us to confess our sins to a clergyman or human mediator in order to receive God’s forgiveness. Instead this is to be done from the repentant heart of the sinner directly to the Savior–Jesus Christ.


Security of the Believer (Backsliding)

The Assemblies of God has taken a strong stand against the teaching that God’s sovereign will completely overrides man’s free will to accept and serve Him. In view of this we believe it is possible for a person once saved to turn from God and be lost again. However, we do not go to the other extreme of teaching that mankind’s choice of receiving or rejecting Christ makes a person totally responsible for his own salvation apart from Christ’s atonement.
In view of the biblical teaching that the security of the believer depends on a living relationship with Christ (John 15:6); in view of the Bible's call to a life of holiness (1 Peter 1:16; Hebrews 12:14); in view of the clear teaching that a man may have his part taken out of the Book of Life (Revelation 22:19); and in view of the fact that one who believes for a while can fall away (Luke 8:13); The General Council of the Assemblies of God disapproves of the unconditional security position which holds that it is impossible for a person once saved to be lost.
The Assemblies of God leans toward Arminianism, though it accepts scriptural truth found in both positions. We agree with the Calvinist emphasis on God's sovereignty or supreme power and authority. But we also firmly believe the Arminian emphasis on mankind's free will and responsibility for his actions and choices. We believe the Bible teaches both truths.
The Assemblies of God also stands on these wonderful truths knowing we need not fear that something external will overpower us and take away our salvation. Only our willful choices can do that.
But because we are creatures with free wills, we must be vigilantly on guard because the enemy of our soul, the devil, "prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. Resist him, standing firm in the faith" (1 Peter 5:8,9). In our Fellowship we believe carelessness can lead to apathy, apathy to neglect, and neglect to a conscious decision to sin. We often refer to this spiritual decline as backsliding. We believe one who backslides is in danger of losing his salvation if the individual persists in rejecting the Spirit's call to repentance and restoration.
Luke 8:13 makes clear the fact that believers can lose their salvation. It says some "believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away." Revelation 22:19 says "If anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life, and in the holy city."
Certainly there are true Christians who believe and teach Calvinism; there are also true Christians who believe and teach that men and women have free will. Unfortunately, both sides have spent more time arguing doctrinal terminology and interpretations of theology than reaching out to a lost world. The irony of the disagreement is that Calvinists, who believe in predestination, are sometimes more active in witnessing and evangelism than Arminians who believe that man has a free will and should be encouraged to accept Christ as Savior. God, of course, looks on the heart and the actions rather than on the eloquence with which one defends a position.
Although the Assemblies of God adheres basically to the Arminian position on the spiritual security of the believer, there are extremes and potential abuses which must be avoided. The Christian life is not a roller coaster of Sunday salvation and Monday through Saturday backsliding. On the other hand, no Christian, no matter how spiritual, can claim perfection and sinlessness (1 John 1:8-10; 2:1). Therefore as Christians we must continually come to God sincerely asking His forgiveness for living below the potential He makes possible through the gift of His Holy Spirit.
The truth of God's marvelous and free grace has sadly led some to imagine and indulge in a cheap grace, a grace that covers all sins with no need to live a holy life. Such an attitude is an insult to the great price Christ paid to purchase our salvation. Though we may fail and fall, and sometimes sin, the heart of the true believer always regrets, repents, asks forgiveness, and seeks never to sin that way again. To carelessly participate in sin, expecting to gain forgiveness later, is itself an act of backsliding that will lead ultimately to losing one's salvation. We therefore reject any "once saved, always saved" doctrine that excuses sinful lifestyles.
Once saved can mean forever saved–if one continues in faith, growing in sanctification and holiness day by day. But God will not arbitrarily usurp mankind's free will. Our sovereign God does not overrule free will just to prove He is sovereign.

 

[Bob Hill]

I must disagree with some excellent Christian men on this site, such as godrulz.

The gospel of the circumcision had its basis in the covenant of circumcision. The apostles of the circumcision were acutely aware of its requirements. Gen 17:9-14 And God said to Abraham: “As for you, you shall keep My covenant, you and your descendants after you throughout their generations. 10 This is My covenant which you shall keep, between Me and you and your descendants after you: Every male child among you shall be circumcised; 11 and you shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskins, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between Me and you. 12 He who is eight days old among you shall be circumcised, every male child in your generations, he who is born in your house or bought with money from any foreigner who is not your descendant. 13 He who is born in your house and he who is bought with your money must be circumcised, and My covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. 14 And the uncircumcised male child, who is not circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin, that person shall be cut off from his people; he has broken My covenant.”

They would not go against God’s covenant without God’s intervention. Act 10:28 Then he said to them, “You know how unlawful it is for a Jewish man to keep company with or go to one of another nation. But God has shown me that I should not call any man common or unclean.”

Their ministry before the body of Christ began seems to have been to their fellow Jews. Isa 66:18-21 “For I know their works and their thoughts. It shall be that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come and see My glory. 19 I will set a sign among them; and those among them who escape I will send to the nations: to Tarshish and Pul and Lud, who draw the bow, and Tubal and Javan, to the coastlands afar off who have not heard My fame nor seen My glory. And they shall declare My glory among the Gentiles. 20 Then they shall bring all your brethren for an offering to the Lord out of all nations, on horses and in chariots and in litters, on mules and on camels, to My holy mountain Jerusalem,” says the Lord, “as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the Lord. 21 And I will also take some of them for priests and Levites,” says the Lord. 22 “For as the new heavens and the new earth which I will make shall remain before Me,” says the Lord, “So shall your descendants and your name remain.”

Mat 10:5-15 These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: “Do not go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans. 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give. 9 Provide neither gold nor silver nor copper in your money belts, 10 nor bag for your journey, nor two tunics, nor sandals, nor staffs; for a worker is worthy of his food. 11 Now whatever city or town you enter, inquire who in it is worthy, and stay there till you go out. 12 And when you go into a household, greet it. 13 If the household is worthy, let your peace come upon it. But if it is not worthy, let your peace return to you. 14 And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet. 15 Assuredly, I say to you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city!”

Mat 28:18-20 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”

as late as Act 10:28, we see that Peter and the rest of the 12 doubted that they should go to Gentiles.

Instead, they had the Davidic kingdom in mind. Act 1:6 Therefore, when they had come together, they asked Him, saying, “Lord, will You at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?”

The gospel of the kingdom for them seems to be the good news that the long promised Davidic kingdom would be established.

The time of their trouble was near. Now, their new marching orders had been given: “Go therefore” (Mat 28:19); and, “This gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all nations, and then the end will come” (Mat 24:14).

As baptism was essential for salvation under the Baptist’s and Christ’s ministries, Lk 2:2,3 John the son of Zacharias in the wilderness. 3 And he went into all the region around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

Jo 3:5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.”

In Mark 16:15,16 Christ said: “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

It was the same under the ministry of the twelve. Act 2:38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Even after the body of Christ began with the salvation of Paul, we see that water baptism still saved the covenant people 1 Pe 3:20,21 who formerly were disobedient, when once the Divine longsuffering waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water. 21 There is also an antitype which now saves us - baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

We have no record of a circumcision apostle evangelizing after Cornelius was saved. The only activity we read about in the Bible concerning the Circumcision Apostles is their written ministry. This was extremely important because it was preparing the covenant people for their prophesied time of trouble, the tribulation.

We must read the Covenant of Circumcision and its gospel, and the Circumcision Epistles, Hebrews through 2 Peter, we must continue to look at the rest of the circumcision epistles, 1 John through Revelation.

We must continue to look at the passages that are hard to explain for those who hold theological positions that maintain no difference between Paul’s ministry and the ministry of the Circumcision Apostles.

In Christ,
Bob Hill

 

[Bob Hill]

1 John is very important. All conservative and some liberal scholarship is in agreement. The Apostle John is the author of all three epistles and Revelation. There is considerable agreement that he was writing to members of churches to whom he had ministered for a long time.

Since he wrote to the seven churches in Asia, “John, to the seven churches which are in Asia” (Rev 1:4), I believe many of the recipients of these letters could be found in those same churches.

What kind of believers are these recipients?

We see that John’s ministry was to circumcision believers from Galatians 2:7-9: But on the contrary, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision had been committed to me, as the gospel of the circumcision was to Peter 8 (for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles), 9 and when James, Cephas [Peter], and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcision.

From Revelation 1:9 we see that the believers under Peter, James, and John, are believers who are expecting to go through the tribulation, “I, John, both your brother and companion in the tribulation and kingdom”.

We can see from this that John expected to be their companion (a joint sharer) in both the kingdom and the tribulation.

We can also see that they were circumcision believers since the nation of Israel would be baptized to become a kingdom of priests. John the Baptist baptized Israel in fulfillment of Exodus 19:5,6 and Isaiah 61:6.

Exodus 19:5,6 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey My voice and keep My covenant, then you shall be a special treasure to Me above all people; for all the earth is Mine. 6 And you shall be to Me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation. These are the words which you shall speak to the children of Israel.

Isaiah 61:6 But you shall be named the priests of the LORD, They shall call you the servants of our God. You shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory you shall boast.

John the Baptist was preparing them to be a kingdom of priests.

In Acts 2:38, Peter was doing the same thing. He called them a “holy priesthood” in 1 Peter 2:5,6, you also, as living stones, are being built up a spiritual house, a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. 6 Therefore it is also contained in the Scripture, “Behold, I lay in Zion a chief cornerstone, elect, precious, and he who believes on Him will by no means be put to shame.”

God was making them the promised royal priesthood of Exodus 19:6.

When John came baptizing, he preached that his baptism was for the remission of sins (Mat 3:1-6; Lk 3:3,8).

He was calling the whole nation back into covenant relationship with God. Like the prophets of old, he was calling them to repentance.

His baptism concerned purification of sins based on covenant principles (Num 19:9-21; John 3:22-26).

The purpose of his ministry was to bring knowledge of the Messiah and remission of sins to the people, Israel (Lk 1:76,77), in preparation for their priesthood.

John told them this twofold office was fulfilled in them in Revelation 1:6, “and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever.”

Therefore, I wrap this up. John was a circumcision apostle writing to circumcision believers who were expecting to go through the tribulation. They had no need to be taught, but they did have the need to be admonished about certain spiritual problems.

Generally, I want to cover the material in John’s writings which show the conditions, principles and requirements of the Circumcision Gospel.

In Christ,
Bob Hill

 

[lightninboy]

Dear patman, I went through some old posts for good stuff.

#168 One of the primary purposes of the Law was to declare what is right and what is wrong. So the Law was designed to bring us to brokenness.

#170 Salvation in the old covenant was not limited to the circumcised.

#171 The covenant of grace supersedes the covenant of the law and thus abolishes the law as a supposed way of salvation. The law can never give salvation; in fact, the law does not make a man an heir, it makes him a criminal who deserves the wrath of God.

#196 The law did not provide eternal salvation at all but rather offered temporal purification for the Jews (Hebrews 9:13-14)
Because the utter sinfulness of man makes him absolutely incapable of having any part in earning his own salvation (Romans 3:21-23, 10-18; Psalm 14:1-3; Ecclesiastes 7:20; Isaiah 64:6)
If merit allows a man to glory in earning his salvation and this kind of glorying is wrong, then why is it wrong for us but all right for those in other dispensations?
If merit was wrong for Abraham (Romans 4:2), the great Old Testament saint who was called the friend of God (James 2:23), then why is it all right for other Old Testament saints?
Because works-salvation makes God a debtor to man, something He can never be. (Romans 4:3-5; 11:35)
Second, even under the law, men came to God ultimately by faith. Even
though their faith might be expressed in works (as ours should be), it
was still faith that got God's attention.
With the exception of Judas, the apostles were certainly saved during the lifetime of Christ, though I would not speculate as to the exact time.

#199 ALL MEN in every dispensation have been made just by God, before God by grace through faith alone, apart from any works they did to earn or keep their just standing before God.
Christ's Sacrifice is the Only Acceptable
Tribulation and Millennial Sacrifice
The Tribulation period, often placed by some as a separate dispensation, is in reality the judgment of God upon the Christ-rejecters of the Dispensation of Grace. Then we come to the next dispensation, commonly known as the Millennial reign of Christ. Whether you categorize the Tribulation Period as a separate dispensation, or the judgment upon our present Dispensation of Grace, many more serious errors are being taught concerning these two periods of time.
Take, for instance, the teaching that in these two periods people will return to the Old Testament sacrifices for justification before God. True, the unbelieving Jews will set up sacrifices in the rebuilt temple in Jerusalem, but the 144,000 saved and sealed Jews will "look upon [Christ] whom they have pierced" (Zechariah 12:10; Revelation 1:7). They will recognize their Paschal Lamb as the risen Lord Jesus Christ, and will accept His once-for-all sacrifice for their sins. "For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats should take away sin." (Hebrews 10:4). As the ultra-dispensationalists like to remind us, this is the book for them (the future Tribulation and Millennial saints), not us! If that be the case, Chapters 10 and 11 will teach them that faith in His blood shed at Calvary is the only remedy for sin. The great multitude won by their testimony, will be pointed to the death, burial and resurrection of the soon coming Saviour, King Jesus, not to the temple in Jerusalem, where the Abomination of Desolation shall seat himself as God.
During the Millennium, the Lamb of God, Son of David, King of kings and Lord of lords will sit on the throne/mercy seat in the Millennial temple in Jerusalem, with the veil removed, and all the nations of the world will resort to Him. There will be no temple sacrifice, for that would be blasphemous in the presence of Him who replaced the Old Testament sacrifices once for ever with His one-time, all sufficient sacrifice. Those who teach this error do not recognize the all-sufficiency of the sacrifice that Christ made at Calvary. He died for all men, past, present and future!

#252 The principle of salvation by faith continued under the Mosaic law. Because no one could perfectly satisfy the law's demands, the law brought awareness of human sin and helplessness ( Romans 3:9-23; 7:7-14 ; Galatians 3:19-25 ). Its provisions for animal sacrifice were a further revelation of the seriousness and ugliness of sin. But the provision for sacrifice also pointed forward to Calvary and God's provision of grace.
Old Testament believers offered sacrifices as an expression of their faith. By themselves, sacrificial offerings could never take away sin. When they were offered in faith, however, God accepted them because they pointed to Jesus Christ, the one sacrifice worthy to atone for all the sins of the world ( Hebrews 10:1-17 ).

#254 One teaching of the Bible which would not allow me to accept that Tribulation saints are saved by a combination of faith and works or blood and faithfulness is the doctrine that grace and works are mutually exclusive. "And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work" (Romans 11:6). That verse is not referring merely to salvation in this age. It points back to the Old Testament and points to the future to the salvation of Israel. That is the context. This is also the context of Romans 4, which plainly teaches that salvation is by grace WITHOUT WORKS. That passage points back to the Old Testament, both before the law (vv. 1-5) and during the law (vv. 6-8). Paul teaches us that Old Testament saint Abraham is the example of salvation for all ages (Romans 4:9-25). "Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure TO ALL THE SEED; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all" (Romans 4:16). I don't see how you can say this applies only to church-age saints.
The verses you cited do not necessarily say that eternal salvation in the Tribulation is gained by some sort of works or holding out faithful. In my estimation, only two of the verses you cited even APPEAR to teach that salvation during the tribulation is by works. You say, "I believe that if any saint in the Tribulation takes the mark of the Beast that they will lose their salvation." I don't understand this because I don't see any verse which plainly says that. You cited three in Revelation, but none of them teach that.

#255 Given the relational context and the righteousness (justification) by faith that were already a part of the covenant since Abraham's day, I doubt these sacrifices were meant to bring forgiveness in the sense of justification (righteous standing before God). I suspect they brought instead healing to a wounded relationship with God—in the same sense that Christians today are "forgiven" when we confess our sins (1 John 1:9). These deal with the quality of our fellowship with God, not with the establishment of a relationship with God.

#259 To say that salvation is not the same in all ages is to say that man’s nature and needs have changed from age to age. This is impossible.
Some dispensationalists have said that Old Testament saints were not regenerated or indwelled by the Holy Spirit. But we must say, did not man’s fallen nature require such works of grace?
Whatever you need, the Old Testament saints needed as well. If you need the new birth, so did they. If you need the indwelling of the Spirit, so did they. The oneness of man’s fallen nature guarantees the oneness of salvation in all ages.

#267 But what about those who lived after the Law? Were they saved by the works of the Law? No, says Paul. David who lived after the Law represents all who lived after Moses. David was justified through faith alone.

#269 It is not true that the Holy Spirit is said to only come “upon” Old Testament believers.

#273

#274 Why the Law if it could not save a soul?
In order for God to show the human race how wicked they were, He gave us the Law to show us that we could not keep it. Cruel? Absolutely not! God did this out of compassion because if there was no law to compare our actions to, then there could be no standard by which to compare our lives to. God allowed the Law to come into existence to show that we needed a Savior. No human being alive could ever please God with enough good works because every good work we do is still tainted by sin.
The Apostle Paul gives an excellent summary of why God gave the Law. It was given to the world to drive the Elect to Christ whereby they would receive Grace but the unbeliever who is not justified through Grace will still be culpable to the demands of God’s righteous Law. We read that after a person becomes saved, they are no longer under the Law. This does not mean we live a lawless life but what it means is that since Christ fulfilled the requirements of the law through His atonement on Calvary, the Christian is no longer accountable for their sins. They have been washed clean for all eternity. This is the essence of salvation. It is this great truth that many Christians have a hard time with simply because they do not really know what happened at Calvary and the real significance of their salvation in Christ.
Quick summary up to this point
1. The Blood of Bulls and Goats cannot remove sins.
2. The Sacrificial System was only a foreshadow of the sacrifice of Christ.
3. The Law was written to drive the Elect to Christ.
4. The Great Day of Atonement was only a foreshadow of Christ’s day on Calvary.
5. The term “Saint” is used in the Hebrew Scriptures, not just the New Testament.

#276 The Bible makes it clear that it is IMPOSSIBLE for the Old Testament sacrifices to take away sins. The yearly sacrifice was a continuous reminder of the presence of sin so the people would not forget and it was a foreshadow that pointed ahead to the sacrifice that Jesus would one day make. Those who obeyed the law as an act of faith, were justified in Christ by their faith in God’s plan of redemption. Those who had no faith only performed a ritual that had zero eternal benefit. Many kept the law out of a fear of consequences so they would not be cut off from their people (which was God’s warning), but fearing judgment does not save them anymore than scaring people with hell today. There is a place for explaining the consequence of hell, but no one is saved by running away from hell. The Bible says that it is the goodness of God that leads you to repentance. We have faith and turn to a loving relationship with God that is offered through the cross.

#278 Unfortunately though, this wasn’t the case with most of the Israelites. They came out of Egypt and when it was time to go into the promised land they didn’t trust in God and his promises. They said “The giants of the land are too great for us,” and so virtually every one of them died in the wilderness. Were their sins forgiven? No, because they didn’t have faith. In fact, the vast majority of Israel from their inception through to the time of Christ were not saved; only a small remnant were ever saved because they were the only ones who had true faith. Sacrifices divorced from faith couldn’t save them because they were only a picture or a pointer to God.

#280 LOUISVILLE, Ky. (BP)--Persons were saved during Old Testament times by the same means as those in the New Testament -- by grace through faith in Jesus Christ -- a professor at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary told a group of college students.
Some Christians falsely believe that Old Testament saints were saved by keeping the law. Others say they were saved by "doing the best they could." Still others believe those who lived during Old Testament times were not saved at all, Block said.

 

[ApologeticJedi]

Note that Jesus did not teach faith + works as Mid-Acts assumes. In the same chapter, he also talks about 'born again', regeneration, which is not diametrically opposed to Pauline thought either. Johannine and Pauline thought both find their foundation in Christ's teachings and are complementary, not competing.

That tea and milk are both liquids do not make them the same thing. Two things may have a great number of similarities and still be different.

Mark 16 shows Jesus did teach faith+works. You must believe and be baptized to be saved. The same was according to Peter (Acts 2:38). But Paul states that he didn't really keep track of baptism because God did not call him to baptize!!! Did God call the apostles to baptize? Of course he did.