The Late Great Urantia Revelation

[Livelystone]

* Legalistic quibbling! A demon or Satan never could make a person do something against their will. "The prince of this world" or "crafty beast" was himself a Son of God, he was present on this old world when Adam and Eve arrived. This brilliant being of light, who had embraced sin and rebellion against the rule and even the existence of the Father, was able to sabotage "the plan" for Adam and Eve of rehabilitation of the world. He was clever and able to change Eve's mind, but the choice was still hers just like sin is a choice for man.

THE TEMPTATION OF EVE​

75:3.1 Adam had just finished his first one hundred years on earth when Serapatatia, upon the death of his father, came to the leadership of the western or Syrian confederation of the Nodite tribes. Serapatatia was a brown-tinted man, a brilliant descendant of the onetime chief of the Dalamatia commission on health mated with one of the master female minds of the blue race of those distant days. All down through the ages this line had held authority and wielded a great influence among the western Nodite tribes.

75:3.2 Serapatatia had made several visits to the Garden and had become deeply impressed with the righteousness of Adam's cause. And shortly after assuming the leadership of the Syrian Nodites, he announced his intention of establishing an affiliation with the work of Adam and Eve in the Garden. The majority of his people joined him in this program, and Adam was cheered by the news that the most powerful and the most intelligent of all the neighboring tribes had swung over almost bodily to the support of the program for world improvement; it was decidedly heartening. And shortly after this great event, Serapatatia and his new staff were entertained by Adam and Eve in their own home.

75:3.3 Serapatatia became one of the most able and efficient of all of Adam's lieutenants. He was entirely honest and thoroughly sincere in all of his activities; he was never conscious, even later on, that he was being used as a circumstantial tool of the wily Caligastia.

75:3.4 Presently, Serapatatia became the associate chairman of the Edenic commission on tribal relations, and many plans were laid for the more vigorous prosecution of the work of winning the remote tribes to the cause of the Garden.

75:3.5 He held many conferences with Adam and Eve—especially with Eve—and they talked over many plans for improving their methods. One day, during a talk with Eve, it occurred to Serapatatia that it would be very helpful if, while awaiting the recruiting of large numbers of the violet race, something could be done in the meantime immediately to advance the needy waiting tribes. Serapatatia contended that, if the Nodites, as the most progressive and co-operative race, could have a leader born to them of part origin in the violet stock, it would constitute a powerful tie binding these peoples more closely to the Garden. And all of this was soberly and honestly considered to be for the good of the world since this child, to be reared and educated in the Garden, would exert a great influence for good over his father's people.

75:3.6 It should again be emphasized that Serapatatia was altogether honest and wholly sincere in all that he proposed. He never once suspected that he was playing into the hands of Caligastia and Daligastia. Serapatatia was entirely loyal to the plan of building up a strong reserve of the violet race before attempting the world-wide upstepping of the confused peoples of Urantia. But this would require hundreds of years to consummate, and he was impatient; he wanted to see some immediate results—something in his own lifetime. He made it clear to Eve that Adam was oftentimes discouraged by the little that had been accomplished toward uplifting the world.

75:3.7 For more than five years these plans were secretly matured. At last they had developed to the point where Eve consented to have a secret conference with Cano, the most brilliant mind and active leader of the near-by colony of friendly Nodites. Cano was very sympathetic with the Adamic regime; in fact, he was the sincere spiritual leader of those neighboring Nodites who favored friendly relations with the Garden.

75:3.8 The fateful meeting occurred during the twilight hours of the autumn evening, not far from the home of Adam. Eve had never before met the beautiful and enthusiastic Cano—and he was a magnificent specimen of the survival of the superior physique and outstanding intellect of his remote progenitors of the Prince's staff. And Cano also thoroughly believed in the righteousness of the Serapatatia project. (Outside of the Garden, multiple mating was a common practice.)

75:3.9 Influenced by flattery, enthusiasm, and great personal persuasion, Eve then and there consented to embark upon the much-discussed enterprise, to add her own little scheme of world saving to the larger and more far-reaching divine plan. Before she quite realized what was transpiring, the fatal step had been taken. It was done. UB



Caino

What you are reading is a bunch of garbage!

Jesus describes Satan very well as a murderer from the beginning and the father of all lies.

He never was anything but evil even though God created him that way for a purpose.

That is why God says he created evil and that nothing happens that is evil without his knowledge.

Satan is only transfigured to appear as light but is not a source of light himself.

Ironically the word “Lucifer” (who was a man) that was used at the time (and only when the King James Bible translation was first made in English), referred to the planet Venus that appeared as a Morning Star, but in the presence of the true Morning Star that is the Sun (Son) in heaven, it falls (disappears) from heaven.

Blessings

Doug

 

[SimplyHisSheep]

What you are reading is a bunch of garbage!

Jesus describes Satan very well as a murderer from the beginning and the father of all lies.

He never was anything but evil even though God created him that way for a purpose.

That is why God says he created evil and that nothing happens that is evil without his knowledge.

Satan is only transfigured to appear as light but is not a source of light himself.

Ironically the word “Lucifer” (who was a man) that was used at the time (and only when the King James Bible translation was first made in English), referred to the planet Venus that appeared as a Morning Star, but in the presence of the true Morning Star that is the Sun (Son) in heaven, it falls (disappears) from heaven.

Blessings

Doug

Wow!! :thumb:

 

[SimplyHisSheep]

NO!

My understanding comes from 1st hand experience.

And it is only through his heavenly seed that is made available to us as “Christ in us the hope of glory” that we can overcome sin.

Meanwhile the spirit of Adam that is in all mankind will continue to lead mankind into committing sin.

Man is not born with the seed of Christ already in him despite what many would like to believe.

If you want to read about my experience of being resurrected from the dead as well as seeing other people who have died being resurrected back onto life, read my book.

Blessings

Doug

Speaking of Doug's book, I also highly recommend it. (Had very timely info in it for me recently, thanks Doug. )

In regards to Christ not being in everyone though, Christ is the light that enlightens every man that comes into the world... doesn't that mean He's in everyone who comes into the world?

 

[Caino]

What you are reading is a bunch of garbage!

Jesus describes Satan very well as a murderer from the beginning and the father of all lies.

He never was anything but evil even though God created him that way for a purpose.

That is why God says he created evil and that nothing happens that is evil without his knowledge.

Satan is only transfigured to appear as light but is not a source of light himself.

Ironically the word “Lucifer” (who was a man) that was used at the time (and only when the King James Bible translation was first made in English), referred to the planet Venus that appeared as a Morning Star, but in the presence of the true Morning Star that is the Sun (Son) in heaven, it falls (disappears) from heaven.

Blessings

Doug

With the Urantia revelation we know much more about Lucifer, his assistant Satan and the "Prince of this world".

God is not a house divided against itself, he did not create an evil twin God and use him to play tricks on his children. That is horrible, sick theology! God delegates authority in his Sons, Lucifer became corrupt within his own mind, he fell in love with himself. It took time to offer forgiveness and repentance to Lucifer but he rejected it. The passing of "time" is quite different in the spiritual realm where Christ Michael and Lucifer exist. To Christ Michael he's only been gone from our world several days.

The Causes of Rebellion​

(602.4) 53:2.1 Lucifer and his first assistant, Satan, had reigned on Jerusem for more than five hundred thousand years when in their hearts they began to array themselves against the Universal Father and his then vicegerent Son, Michael.

(602.5) 53:2.2 There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion. It is our belief that the idea took origin and form in Lucifer’s mind, and that he might have instigated such a rebellion no matter where he might have been stationed. Lucifer first announced his plans to Satan, but it required several months to corrupt the mind of his able and brilliant associate. However, when once converted to the rebel theories, he became a bold and earnest advocate of “self-assertion and liberty.”

(602.6) 53:2.3 No one ever suggested rebellion to Lucifer. The idea of self-assertion in opposition to the will of Michael and to the plans of the Universal Father, as they are represented in Michael, had its origin in his own mind. His relations with the Creator Son had been intimate and always cordial. At no time prior to the exaltation of his own mind did Lucifer openly express dissatisfaction about the universe administration. Notwithstanding his silence, for more than one hundred years of standard time the Union of Days on Salvington had been reflectivating to Uversa that all was not at peace in Lucifer’s mind. This information was also communicated to the Creator Son and the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek.

(602.7) 53:2.4 Throughout this period Lucifer became increasingly critical of the entire plan of universe administration but always professed wholehearted loyalty to the Supreme Rulers. His first outspoken disloyalty was manifested on the occasion of a visit of Gabriel to Jerusem just a few days before the open proclamation of the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. Gabriel was so profoundly impressed with the certainty of the impending outbreak that he went direct to Edentia to confer with the Constellation Fathers regarding the measures to be employed in case of open rebellion.

(603.1) 53:2.5 It is very difficult to point out the exact cause or causes which finally culminated in the Lucifer rebellion. We are certain of only one thing, and that is: Whatever these first beginnings were, they had their origin in Lucifer’s mind. There must have been a pride of self that nourished itself to the point of self-deception, so that Lucifer for a time really persuaded himself that his contemplation of rebellion was actually for the good of the system, if not of the universe. By the time his plans had developed to the point of disillusionment, no doubt he had gone too far for his original and mischief-making pride to permit him to stop. At some point in this experience he became insincere, and evil evolved into deliberate and willful sin. That this happened is proved by the subsequent conduct of this brilliant executive. He was long offered opportunity for repentance, but only some of his subordinates ever accepted the proffered mercy. The Faithful of Days of Edentia, on the request of the Constellation Fathers, in person presented the plan of Michael for the saving of these flagrant rebels, but always was the mercy of the Creator Son rejected and rejected with increasing contempt and disdain.



Caino

 

[Burning Bush]

With the Urantia revelation we know much more about Lucifer, his assistant Satan and the "Prince of this world".

God is not a house divided against itself, he did not create an evil twin God and use him to play tricks on his children. That is horrible, sick theology! God delegates authority in his Sons, Lucifer became corrupt within his own mind, he fell in love with himself. It took time to offer forgiveness and repentance to Lucifer but he rejected it. The passing of "time" is quite different in the spiritual realm where Christ Michael and Lucifer exist. To Christ Michael he's only been gone from our world several days.

The Causes of Rebellion​

(602.4) 53:2.1 Lucifer and his first assistant, Satan, had reigned on Jerusem for more than five hundred thousand years when in their hearts they began to array themselves against the Universal Father and his then vicegerent Son, Michael.

(602.5) 53:2.2 There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion. It is our belief that the idea took origin and form in Lucifer’s mind, and that he might have instigated such a rebellion no matter where he might have been stationed. Lucifer first announced his plans to Satan, but it required several months to corrupt the mind of his able and brilliant associate. However, when once converted to the rebel theories, he became a bold and earnest advocate of “self-assertion and liberty.”

(602.6) 53:2.3 No one ever suggested rebellion to Lucifer. The idea of self-assertion in opposition to the will of Michael and to the plans of the Universal Father, as they are represented in Michael, had its origin in his own mind. His relations with the Creator Son had been intimate and always cordial. At no time prior to the exaltation of his own mind did Lucifer openly express dissatisfaction about the universe administration. Notwithstanding his silence, for more than one hundred years of standard time the Union of Days on Salvington had been reflectivating to Uversa that all was not at peace in Lucifer’s mind. This information was also communicated to the Creator Son and the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek.

(602.7) 53:2.4 Throughout this period Lucifer became increasingly critical of the entire plan of universe administration but always professed wholehearted loyalty to the Supreme Rulers. His first outspoken disloyalty was manifested on the occasion of a visit of Gabriel to Jerusem just a few days before the open proclamation of the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. Gabriel was so profoundly impressed with the certainty of the impending outbreak that he went direct to Edentia to confer with the Constellation Fathers regarding the measures to be employed in case of open rebellion.

(603.1) 53:2.5 It is very difficult to point out the exact cause or causes which finally culminated in the Lucifer rebellion. We are certain of only one thing, and that is: Whatever these first beginnings were, they had their origin in Lucifer’s mind. There must have been a pride of self that nourished itself to the point of self-deception, so that Lucifer for a time really persuaded himself that his contemplation of rebellion was actually for the good of the system, if not of the universe. By the time his plans had developed to the point of disillusionment, no doubt he had gone too far for his original and mischief-making pride to permit him to stop. At some point in this experience he became insincere, and evil evolved into deliberate and willful sin. That this happened is proved by the subsequent conduct of this brilliant executive. He was long offered opportunity for repentance, but only some of his subordinates ever accepted the proffered mercy. The Faithful of Days of Edentia, on the request of the Constellation Fathers, in person presented the plan of Michael for the saving of these flagrant rebels, but always was the mercy of the Creator Son rejected and rejected with increasing contempt and disdain.



Caino

Again; Lucifer was not Satan. The text says, IS THIS THE MAN.....

He had stones as his covering. So did the High Priest. Adam was a priest unto God, which is why his sons knew about sacrifice.

This nonsense writing, is a lie, right out of the pit.

 

[Caino]

Again; Lucifer was not Satan. The text says, IS THIS THE MAN.....

He had stones as his covering. So did the High Priest. Adam was a priest unto God, which is why his sons knew about sacrifice.

This nonsense writing, is a lie, right out of the pit.

Burning Bush, your reading comprehension is not well; it clearly says that Lucifer and Satan were two different beings from the celestial world. Lucifer didn't wear a dress made from stones. He was in heaven where he and Michael had an ideological battle.

The Urantia Book is the new Bible, it's more accurate and up to date.


Caino

 

[SimplyHisSheep]

Burning Bush, your reading comprehension is not well; it clearly says that Lucifer and Satan were two different beings from the celestial world. Lucifer didn't wear a dress made from stones. He was in heaven where he and Michael had an ideological battle.

The Urantia Book is the new Bible, it's more accurate and up to date.


Caino

Golly...

Caino you have obviously bought into this hook, line and sinker.

 

[Caino]

Golly...

Caino you have obviously bought into this hook, line and sinker.

......so said the families of the Apostles who left the inherited religion of their fathers to follow a carpenter from Nazareth, his own mother thought he was insane!

I am an unapologetic disciple of Jesus of Nazareth, liberated by "the good news" that all men and women are sons and daughters of the living God.


Urantia Book readers are the new apostles, persecuted by those who think they are doing a service to God.


Caino

 

[freelight]

Salvation

Salvation

WHAT MUST I DO TO BE SAVED?​

150:5.1 One evening at Shunem, after John’s apostles had returned to Hebron, and after Jesus’ apostles had been sent out two and two, when the Master was engaged in teaching a group of twelve of the younger evangelists who were laboring under the direction of Jacob, together with the twelve women, Rachel asked Jesus this question: “Master, what shall we answer when women ask us, What shall I do to be saved?” When Jesus heard this question, he answered:

150:5.2 “When men and women ask what shall we do to be saved, you shall answer, Believe this gospel of the kingdom; accept divine forgiveness. By faith recognize the indwelling spirit of God, whose acceptance makes you a son of God. Have you not read in the Scriptures where it says, `In the Lord have I righteousness and strength.’ Also where the Father says, `My righteousness is near; my salvation has gone forth, and my arms shall enfold my people.’ `My soul shall be joyful in the love of my God, for he has clothed me with the garments of salvation and has covered me with the robe of his righteousness.’ Have you not also read of the Father that his name `shall be called the Lord our righteousness.’ `Take away the filthy rags of self-righteousness and clothe my son with the robe of divine righteousness and eternal salvation.’ It is forever true, `the just shall live by faith.’ Entrance into the Father’s kingdom is wholly free, but progress—growth in grace—is essential to continuance therein.

150:5.3 “Salvation is the gift of the Father and is revealed by his Sons. Acceptance by faith on your part makes you a partaker of the divine nature, a son or a daughter of God. By faith you are justified; by faith are you saved; and by this same faith are you eternally advanced in the way of progressive and divine perfection. By faith was Abraham justified and made aware of salvation by the teachings of Melchizedek. All down through the ages has this same faith saved the sons of men, but now has a Son come forth from the Father to make salvation more real and acceptable.”

150:5.4 When Jesus had left off speaking, there was great rejoicing among those who had heard these gracious words, and they all went on in the days that followed proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom with new power and with renewed energy and enthusiasm. And the women rejoiced all the more to know they were included in these plans for the establishment of the kingdom on earth.

150:5.5 In summing up his final statement, Jesus said: “You cannot buy salvation; you cannot earn righteousness. Salvation is the gift of God, and righteousness is the natural fruit of the spirit-born life of sonship in the kingdom. You are not to be saved because you live a righteous life; rather is it that you live a righteous life because you have already been saved, have recognized sonship as the gift of God and service in the kingdom as the supreme delight of life on earth. When men believe this gospel, which is a revelation of the goodness of God, they will be led to voluntary repentance of all known sin. Realization of sonship is incompatible with the desire to sin. Kingdom believers hunger for righteousness and thirst for divine perfection.” UB


Salvation by simple faith and spiritual transformation was replaced by belief that Jesus was a human sacrifice to satisfy God.



Caino

:thumb:

The teaching of Jesus above accords with the essential message of the good news of the kingdom. These fundamentals hold, even if some take on other interpretive channels or angles on the kingdom message, nevertheless the kingdom of God and his will is central.

Even Paul acknowledges certain spiritual laws and principles, such as 'spiritual sonship', - "they who are led by the Spirit of God, these are the sons of God", "to be spiritually minded is life and peace", and so forth. The teaching of 'vicarious blood atonement' was mixed into the interpretation of the NT, since blood sacrifice was central to Judaic temple rites and the mystery religions of the times, -these naturally inter-phased with Jesus being the Lamb of God, an atoning sacrifice for sin, that faith in his blood would afford salvation, etc.

Again, I have no problems with using blood as a powerful symbol or metaphor, for even the old time pentecostals found 'power in the blood' (but note that is according to the faith thats invested in it). Yet blood is not the only means of acquiring atonement.

What is essential is repentance and believing in the kingdom, partaking of divine sonship, spiritually engaging with God, serving His will. This way one is active in the kingdom as a present reality, in community.

Jesus death reveals undying loyalty to the Father's will, his matchless love, and calls us to also lay down our lives for our brothers. Such giving of his life, is the giving of his 'soul' for the sheep.

 

[Burning Bush]

......so said the families of the Apostles who left the inherited religion of their fathers to follow a carpenter from Nazareth, his own mother thought he was insane!

I am an unapologetic disciple of Jesus of Nazareth, liberated by "the good news" that all men and women are sons and daughters of the living God.


Urantia Book readers are the new apostles, persecuted by those who think they are doing a service to God.


Caino

This is just sad.

 

[freelight]

Morning star

Morning star

Ironically the word “Lucifer” (who was a man) that was used at the time (and only when the King James Bible translation was first made in English), referred to the planet Venus that appeared as a Morning Star, but in the presence of the true Morning Star that is the Sun (Son) in heaven, it falls (disappears) from heaven.

Blessings

Doug

We cover this more in the "Who or what is Lucifer?" thread

The UB as shared earlier presents Lucifer as a different being than Satan, although many have confused the two as the same 'person'. There were certainly 'co-horts' if you will, in the Rebellion. Even if the story is 'religious fiction' or 'mythology',...it still conveys the plight of 'souls in rebellion', the great cosmic struggle, the quest for individual power against the orginal divine order or will, the rise of personal egoity or pride, and many other allegories. Ultimately only that of divine value and reality prevails. Or to quote John,...."they who do the will of God abide forever".

The Lucifer Rebellion




pj

 

[freelight]

God is the Heart of all

God is the Heart of all

Burning Bush, your reading comprehension is not well; it clearly says that Lucifer and Satan were two different beings from the celestial world. Lucifer didn't wear a dress made from stones. He was in heaven where he and Michael had an ideological battle.

Caino

BB apparently did not read the presentation. Until he learns what the UB actually is and what it teaches, his 'presumptions' are just that. I've given the recent guests to the thread ample resource links if they really want to learn, and readers are welcome to search out both our UB threads. A proper education can do wonders.

You are much more devout to the UB as a primary source-text and guide, while I'm more eclectic, enjoying samplings from many religious traditions and spiritual paths, seeing the golden thread in all. In this sense I'm a true universalist. Would you agree you're more of a UB fundamentalist than myself?

'God' is truly the First Source and Center of all that is,....which the papers call 'The Universal Father'. - The Creation includes worlds without number, and many new worlds being formed with life potential, and yet undisclosed dimensions unfolding within The Infinite.

The papers chart this wonderful expansion of cosmic creation and the plan of progress for mortals in their spiritual ascent towards Paradise, the very Heart of God, whereby they fuse with that eternal God-fragment within, and become immortal.


pj

 

[SimplyHisSheep]

......so said the families of the Apostles who left the inherited religion of their fathers to follow a carpenter from Nazareth, his own mother thought he was insane!

I am an unapologetic disciple of Jesus of Nazareth, liberated by "the good news" that all men and women are sons and daughters of the living God.


Urantia Book readers are the new apostles, persecuted by those who think they are doing a service to God.


Caino

Oh beloved Caino, no!! True apostles are those who are led by His voice! (My sheep hear my voice) NOT any readers of any book! (That includes simply reading the Bible, interpreting it for yourself, without being led by the Spirit.) As many as are led by the Spirit of God, THESE are the sons of God.

I am not "persecuting" you Caino. I am DEEPLY concerned for you and for all others who would be led astray by this thread. Please hear me!

(Btw, for the record, I DO believe that EVERY knee will bow and EVERY tongue will confess that JESUS CHRIST IS LORD [to the GLORY of the Father]).

 

[Caino]

Oh beloved Caino, no!! True apostles are those who are led by His voice! (My sheep hear my voice) NOT any readers of any book! (That includes simply reading the Bible, interpreting it for yourself, without being led by the Spirit.) As many as are led by the Spirit of God, THESE are the sons of God.

I am not "persecuting" you Caino. I am DEEPLY concerned for you and for all others who would be led astray by this thread. Please hear me!

(Btw, for the record, I DO believe that EVERY knee will bow and EVERY tongue will confess that JESUS CHRIST IS LORD [to the GLORY of the Father]).

Agreed, but if you truly follow the voice of the shepherd then you should be able to hear his voice wherever the spirit of truth is spoken. But while you say you aren’t lead by the Bible as a fetish it sounds like you need the shamans to interpret it for you and tell you how to think. Jesus is my shepherd, I know his voice well.

To criticize a book that you have not read makes you look dishonest.




SERMON ON THE GOOD SHEPHERD

165:2.1 A company of over three hundred Jerusalemites, Pharisees and others, followed Jesus north to Pella when he hastened away from the jurisdiction of the Jewish rulers at the ending of the feast of the dedication; and it was in the presence of these Jewish teachers and leaders, as well as in the hearing of the twelve apostles, that Jesus preached the sermon on the "Good Shepherd." After half an hour of informal discussion, speaking to a group of about one hundred, Jesus said:

165:2.2 "On this night I have much to tell you, and since many of you are my disciples and some of you my bitter enemies, I will present my teaching in a parable, so that you may each take for yourself that which finds a reception in your heart.

165:2.3 "Tonight, here before me are men who would be willing to die for me and for this gospel of the kingdom, and some of them will so offer themselves in the years to come; and here also are some of you slaves of tradition, who have followed me down from Jerusalem, and who, with your darkened and deluded leaders, seek to kill the Son of Man. The life which I now live in the flesh shall judge both of you, the true shepherds and the false shepherds. If the false shepherd were blind, he would have no sin, but you claim that you see; you profess to be teachers in Israel; therefore does your sin remain upon you.

165:2.4 "The true shepherd gathers his flock into the fold for the night in times of danger. And when the morning has come, he enters into the fold by the door, and when he calls, the sheep know his voice. Every shepherd who gains entrance to the sheepfold by any other means than by the door is a thief and a robber. The true shepherd enters the fold after the porter has opened the door for him, and his sheep, knowing his voice, come out at his word; and when they that are his are thus brought forth, the true shepherd goes before them; he leads the way and the sheep follow him. His sheep follow him because they know his voice; they will not follow a stranger. They will flee from the stranger because they know not his voice. This multitude which is gathered about us here are like sheep without a shepherd, but when we speak to them, they know the shepherd's voice, and they follow after us; at least, those who hunger for truth and thirst for righteousness do. Some of you are not of my fold; you know not my voice, and you do not follow me. And because you are false shepherds, the sheep know not your voice and will not follow you."

165:2.5 And when Jesus had spoken this parable, no one asked him a question. After a time he began again to speak and went on to discuss the parable:

165:2.6 "You who would be the undershepherds of my Father's flocks must not only be worthy leaders, but you must also feed the flock with good food; you are not true shepherds unless you lead your flocks into green pastures and beside still waters.

165:2.7 "And now, lest some of you too easily comprehend this parable, I will declare that I am both the door to the Father's sheepfold and at the same time the true shepherd of my Father's flocks. Every shepherd who seeks to enter the fold without me shall fail, and the sheep will not hear his voice. I, with those who minister with me, am the door. Every soul who enters upon the eternal way by the means I have created and ordained shall be saved and will be able to go on to the attainment of the eternal pastures of Paradise.

165:2.8 "But I also am the true shepherd who is willing even to lay down his life for the sheep. The thief breaks into the fold only to steal, and to kill, and to destroy; but I have come that you all may have life and have it more abundantly. He who is a hireling, when danger arises, will flee and allow the sheep to be scattered and destroyed; but the true shepherd will not flee when the wolf comes; he will protect his flock and, if necessary, lay down his life for his sheep. Verily, verily, I say to you, friends and enemies, I am the true shepherd; I know my own and my own know me. I will not flee in the face of danger. I will finish this service of the completion of my Father's will, and I will not forsake the flock which the Father has intrusted to my keeping.

165:2.9 "But I have many other sheep not of this fold, and these words are true not only of this world. These other sheep also hear and know my voice, and I have promised the Father that they shall all be brought into one fold, one brotherhood of the sons of God. And then shall you all know the voice of one shepherd, the true shepherd, and shall all acknowledge the fatherhood of God.

165:2.10 "And so shall you know why the Father loves me and has put all of his flocks in this domain in my hands for keeping; it is because the Father knows that I will not falter in the safeguarding of the sheepfold, that I will not desert my sheep, and that, if it shall be required, I will not hesitate to lay down my life in the service of his manifold flocks. But, mind you, if I lay down my life, I will take it up again. No man nor any other creature can take away my life. I have the right and the power to lay down my life, and I have the same power and right to take it up again. You cannot understand this, but I received such authority from my Father even before this world was."

165:2.11 When they heard these words, his apostles were confused, his disciples were amazed, while the Pharisees from Jerusalem and around about went out into the night, saying, "He is either mad or has a devil." But even some of the Jerusalem teachers said: "He speaks like one having authority; besides, who ever saw one having a devil open the eyes of a man born blind and do all of the wonderful things which this man has done?"


165:2.12 On the morrow about half of these Jewish teachers professed belief in Jesus, and the other half in dismay returned to Jerusalem and their homes.


Caino

 

[bucksplasher]

With the Urantia revelation we know much more about Lucifer, his assistant Satan and the "Prince of this world".

God is not a house divided against itself, he did not create an evil twin God and use him to play tricks on his children. That is horrible, sick theology! God delegates authority in his Sons, Lucifer became corrupt within his own mind, he fell in love with himself. It took time to offer forgiveness and repentance to Lucifer but he rejected it. The passing of "time" is quite different in the spiritual realm where Christ Michael and Lucifer exist. To Christ Michael he's only been gone from our world several days.

TER]The Causes of Rebellion[/CENTER]

(602.4) 53:2.1 Lucifer and his first assistant, Satan, had reigned on Jerusem for more than five hundred thousand years when in their hearts they began to array themselves against the Universal Father and his then vicegerent Son, Michael.

(602.5) 53:2.2 There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion. It is our belief that the idea took origin and form in Lucifer’s mind, and that he might have instigated such a rebellion no matter where he might have been stationed. Lucifer first announced his plans to Satan, but it required several months to corrupt the mind of his able and brilliant associate. However, when once converted to the rebel theories, he became a bold and earnest advocate of “self-assertion and liberty.”

(602.6) 53:2.3 No one ever suggested rebellion to Lucifer. The idea of self-assertion in opposition to the will of Michael and to the plans of the Universal Father, as they are represented in Michael, had its origin in his own mind. His relations with the Creator Son had been intimate and always cordial. At no time prior to the exaltation of his own mind did Lucifer openly express dissatisfaction about the universe administration. Notwithstanding his silence, for more than one hundred years of standard time the Union of Days on Salvington had been reflectivating to Uversa that all was not at peace in Lucifer’s mind. This information was also communicated to the Creator Son and the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek.

(602.7) 53:2.4 Throughout this period Lucifer became increasingly critical of the entire plan of universe administration but always professed wholehearted loyalty to the Supreme Rulers. His first outspoken disloyalty was manifested on the occasion of a visit of Gabriel to Jerusem just a few days before the open proclamation of the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. Gabriel was so profoundly impressed with the certainty of the impending outbreak that he went direct to Edentia to confer with the Constellation Fathers regarding the measures to be employed in case of open rebellion.

(603.1) 53:2.5 It is very difficult to point out the exact cause or causes which finally culminated in the Lucifer rebellion. We are certain of only one thing, and that is: Whatever these first beginnings were, they had their origin in Lucifer’s mind. There must have been a pride of self that nourished itself to the point of self-deception, so that Lucifer for a time really persuaded himself that his contemplation of rebellion was actually for the good of the system, if not of the universe. By the time his plans had developed to the point of disillusionment, no doubt he had gone too far for his original and mischief-making pride to permit him to stop. At some point in this experience he became insincere, and evil evolved into deliberate and willful sin. That this happened is proved by the subsequent conduct of this brilliant executive. He was long offered opportunity for repentance, but only some of his subordinates ever accepted the proffered mercy. The Faithful of Days of Edentia, on the request of the Constellation Fathers, in person presented the plan of Michael for the saving of these flagrant rebels, but always was the mercy of the Creator Son rejected and rejected with increasing contempt and disdain.



Caino

There is "no time" in the spiritual realm as the angels were created in eternity before time. In eternity they made their decision to follow God or not. There was no "gradual" change. Only "one" of the reasons this enlightenment is claptrap.

tWINs

 

[Caino]

BB apparently did not read the presentation. Until he learns what the UB actually is and what it teaches, his 'presumptions' are just that. I've given the recent guests to the thread ample resource links if they really want to learn, and readers are welcome to search out both our UB threads. A proper education can do wonders.

You are much more devout to the UB as a primary source-text and guide, while I'm more eclectic, enjoying samplings from many religious traditions and spiritual paths, seeing the golden thread in all. In this sense I'm a true universalist. Would you agree you're more of a UB fundamentalist than myself?

'God' is truly the First Source and Center of all that is,....which the papers call 'The Universal Father'. - The Creation includes worlds without number, and many new worlds being formed with life potential, and yet undisclosed dimensions unfolding within The Infinite.

The papers chart this wonderful expansion of cosmic creation and the plan of progress for mortals in their spiritual ascent towards Paradise, the very Heart of God, whereby they fuse with that eternal God-fragment within, and become immortal.


pj

Yes, the UB is revelation, it's the first time a "book" has ever been a composite revelation by celestial beings who "know whereof they speak."

92:4.9 5. The Urantia Papers. The papers, of which this is one, constitute the most recent presentation of truth to the mortals of Urantia. These papers differ from all previous revelations, for they are not the work of a single universe personality but a composite presentation by many beings. But no revelation short of the attainment of the Universal Father can ever be complete. All other celestial ministrations are no more than partial, transient, and practically adapted to local conditions in time and space. While such admissions as this may possibly detract from the immediate force and authority of all revelations, the time has arrived on Urantia when it is advisable to make such frank statements, even at the risk of weakening the future influence and authority of this, the most recent of the revelations of truth to the mortal races of Urantia.


Truth may be but relatively inspired, even though revelation is invariably a spiritual phenomenon. While statements with reference to cosmology are never inspired, such revelations are of immense value in that they at least transiently clarify knowledge by:

(1109.7) 101:4.6 1. The reduction of confusion by the authoritative elimination of error.

(1109.8) 101:4.7 2. The co-ordination of known or about-to-be-known facts and observations.

(1110.1) 101:4.8 3. The restoration of important bits of lost knowledge concerning epochal transactions in the distant past.

(1110.2) 101:4.9 4. The supplying of information which will fill in vital missing gaps in otherwise earned knowledge.

(1110.3) 101:4.10 5. Presenting cosmic data in such a manner as to illuminate the spiritual teachings contained in the accompanying revelation.


Caino

 

[Caino]

There is "no time" in the spiritual realm as the angels were created in eternity before time. In eternity they made their decision to follow God or not. There was no "gradual" change. Only "one" of the reasons this enlightenment is claptrap.

tWINs

Know your Bible bucksplasher, you have to get up mighty early in the morning to fool me.


2 Peter 3:8–9 reads:

‘But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance."

Time is not reckoned on Paradise; the sequence of successive events is inherent in the concept of those who are indigenous to the central Isle. But time is germane to the Havona circuits and to numerous beings of both celestial and terrestrial origin sojourning thereon. Each Havona world has its own local time, determined by its circuit. All worlds in a given circuit have the same length of year since they uniformly swing around Paradise, and the length of these planetary years decreases from the outermost to the innermost circuit.

14:1.12 Besides Havona-circuit time, there is the Paradise-Havona standard day and other time designations which are determined on, and are sent out from, the seven Paradise satellites of the Infinite Spirit. The Paradise-Havona standard day is based on the length of time required for the planetary abodes of the first or inner Havona circuit to complete one revolution around the Isle of Paradise; and though their velocity is enormous, owing to their situation between the dark gravity bodies and gigantic Paradise, it requires almost one thousand years for these spheres to complete their circuit. You have unwittingly read the truth when your eyes rested on the statement "A day is as a thousand years with God, as but a watch in the night." One Paradise-Havona day is just seven minutes, three and one-eighth seconds less than one thousand years of the present Urantia leap-year calendar.


14:1.13 This Paradise-Havona day is the standard time measurement for the seven superuniverses, although each maintains its own internal time standards.​

Caino

 

[bucksplasher]

Know your Bible bucksplasher, you have to get up mighty early in the morning to fool me.


2 Peter 3:8–9 reads:

‘But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.


Caino

God obviously can enter and leave time at will, as well as the angels at his command.

We will enter eternity at the end of our lives and eternity by definition does away with time.

Were not the angels created in eternity before time? What says UB?

tWINs

 

[Caino]

God obviously can enter and leave time at will, as well as the angels at his command.

We will enter eternity at the end of our lives and eternity by definition does away with time.

Were not the angels created in eternity before time? What says UB?

tWINs

.....unless you are prepared to argue that Satan was created as a good angel and a bad angel simultaneously?

I added more to my post on time, yes, celestials outside of eternal paradise are subject to various dimensions of "time passing".



Caino

 

[bucksplasher]

They (the angels) made one decision at their creation...yea or nay.

We are given the privilege? of taking our good natured time about our decision, but it is the same decision.

tWINs