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No, it was not "confusing"... it was CONFUSED.
The Gospel of the Kingdom and the plot twist.
- Thread starter Nick M
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@Hoping Please learn a little about baptism: https://graceambassadors.com/tradition/baptism/how-to-be-baptized-without-getting-wet
Romans 8:35-36 KJV
(35) Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
(36) As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
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Keep reading on to verse 37....
Rom 8:37 (AKJV/PCE)
(8:37) Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Paul is saying that we are NOT sheep to the slaughter!
I will stick with Jesus, Peter, and Paul on this topic.
Especially as I know this is how we enter into Christ. (Rom 6:3...."Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?" )
I know it doesn't always mean water.
But to be likened to "burial", and "planting", as it is in Rom 6:4-5, water baptism fits the best.
"For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:"
The baptism of the Holy Spirit doesn't fit at all.
Water baptism is something "man" must do, while the baptism of the Holy Spirit is something God does in response to a real repentance from sin.
The context almost always makes it clear which is being referred to.
Baptism by the Holy Spirit does.
1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free
Eph 1:13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
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Just like a cult leader would say.
There is NO WATER in THAT baptism. There is not a drop of water in the entire book to the Romans.
So you say, but you prove that you do not understand it in every one of your posts.
Water baptism was never about "burial" or "planting". It was always simply about cleansing for Israel and her priesthood.
The "planting" occurs by association without water.
The baptism into the body of Christ is baptism BY the Holy Spirit and NOT "of" the Holy Spirit.
Not in the body of Christ. You should join us.
You continue to be totally confused. No doubt that you did not bother to follow the link that I gave you. It could help you, but only if you wanted to know the truth.
First off, in Heb 6 we are reminded of the "principals of the doctrine of Christ".
After repentance and faith, the doctrine of baptisms is cited.
Plural baptisms.
So we know there is more than one.
Second, is the context of any baptism related scriptures; some relate to something man must do while others point to what God will, or has done.
Third, sometimes one of the the fruits of the baptism is mentioned. (Acts 2:4,11, 10:46, 19:6, 1 Cor 12:10,28,30)
Especially the destruction of the old man and ensuing life without sin. (Rom 6:6-7,17-18,20,22)
Fourth, on a couple of occasion both baptisms are listed together. (Acts 10, 19, 1 Cor 6:11)
"By", "For", they are the same thing.
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No, it is not water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins.
Your first is the gift of the Holy Ghost that is given by God to the truly repentant. (Acts 2:38, 10:44-47)
The second is the end of the world. (Zeph 3:8, Luke 12:49, 2 Peter 3:7, 2 Thes 1:7-9)
A follower of Jesus and His apostles will say it too.
I guess you can prove that by the result of the baptism you did partake of.
As it was the means of the destruction of your old man of sin, (Rom 6:6), and your own death, (Rom 6:3-4), did it make you free from sinning? (Rom 6:7) ?
That may be because the gift of the Holy Ghost is not often debated here.
Just Jesus' commanded water baptism.
As the command by Peter in Acts 2:38 didn't involve any priests, we might be able to claim it is only for believing Israelites.
But Cornelius' case dispels that thought, as he was a Gentile.
So too, were the Philippian jailer and the twelve at Ephesus.
As per Rom 6, I don't believe you.
Semantics.
"By", "Of", what's the difference?
No way.
I don't want to start sinning again, or walking in the flesh again !
I don't want to loose my communion with God or Christ !
I am not confused.
I saw no link either.
Don't bother posting things that will lead me away from the faith.
The truth freed me from serving sin. (John 8:32-34)
Did your truth free you from committing sin?
Idolater
"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
So you're saying there's more than one Christian or Church baptism in the Bible.
So is it possible that we're talking about different aspects of the same baptism then? Like a physical aspect and an eternal aspect, but both aspects being of the same thing?
There's obviously a difference between John's baptism (Acts 1:5, 19:4) and being baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus (Acts 8:16), and being baptized in the Holy Spirit.
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So according to you, you could be a "follower of Jesus and His apostles" or a cult leader. Great job!
You are what must be called a scripture twister. Paul says "freed from sin" and NOT "free from sinning".
Jesus was not talking to you. This is a big reason why you continue to be extremely confused.
Peter, also, was not talking to you.
Cornelius was a gentile that blessed Israel. He was not a "generic" gentile.
Your bias has blinded you.
There is no water in Romans.
It's not semantics, it's clearly different language with different meaning.
That you don't what to be in the body of Christ (i.e., today's body of believers) is quite telling.
Yes, you are.
Try these: https://graceambassadors.com/tradition/does-romans-6_3-4-teach-water-baptism
https://graceambassadors.com/tradition/baptism/how-to-be-baptized-without-getting-wet
And many of these: https://graceambassadors.com/baptism
Funny.
Enjoy your surprise then Christ shows you the truth.
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Paul says that there is only one.
Eph 4:5 (AKJV/PCE)
(4:5) One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
The ONE baptism is not physical.
1Cor 12:13 (AKJV/PCE)
(12:13) For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether [we be] Jews or Gentiles, whether [we be] bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Obviously... this is why we must rightly divide the word of truth.
Me and Hebrews 6:2 say that is so..
No, as the water baptism done in the name of Jesus Christ is for the remission of past sins, while the gift of the Holy Ghost/baptism of the Holy Spirit is given by God to the truly repentant
Yes, as the water baptism, post-resurrection of Christ, is done "in the name of Jesus Christ".
John's water baptism unto repentance from sin was not done in any name.
The baptism of/in the Holy Ghost is done by God, while the other baptisms, John's and in the name of Jesus Christ, are done by men.
Nah, I am no leader.
But I have been equipt to follow perfectly !
If you see any difference between the two, say on.
"Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?" (Rom 6:16)
Jesus was talking to all who will submit to Him and to His Father.
Peter, through the Holy Ghost, is talking to all who will submit to Jesus and His Father.
He was a Gentile who honored God.
Like the angel said..."And said, Cornelius, thy prayer is heard, and thine alms are had in remembrance in the sight of God." (Acts 10:3)
All who honor God will hear His voice.
Thanks be to God, my love of God, and of His Son, has enabled me to see.
I disagree.
My water baptism was a "immersion" using water in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission for past sins.
As Jesus was "planted" in a tomb, I was "planted" in water.
"For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:"(Rom 6:5)
My baptism "of" the Holy Spirit was done "by" the Holy Spirit.
Wasn't yours?
More Freudian slips?
If I didn't "want" to be in the body of Christ, I would go steal some money, and buy some dope and chase girls.
I can't steal, commit adultery, and defile the temple of God and still be in Christ's body.
I disagree.
I have checked those sites out previously and am just not interested in accommodations for sin.
That would be the truth Jesus said could free us from committing sin...right?
It is written..."And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin."
The truth can free us from committing sin !
Does your doctrine provide that freedom?
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No, you certainly are not.
Where are the grammar police now
My doctrine agrees with the Bible, therefore it's true. Yours does not and is therefore false.
Finally, something we can agree on.
I want a lawyer !
Are you now a non-sinner?
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I am freed from sin, just like Paul says. Unlike your lie of "free from sinning", which appears nowhere in scripture.
It is good to meet another non-sinner.
I forgive you for your accusations.
It is written..."Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;" (1 Peter 4:1)
..."Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:" (2 Peter 1:10)
..."Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless." (2 Peter 3:14)
...“Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.” (1 John 3:4-9)
Now I know you don't think anything written by a Jew, believing or unbelieving, matters to believing Gentile, I will add some of the things the Jew Paul wrote...“Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
For he that is dead is freed from sin.” (Rom. 6:6-7)
"There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." (Rom 8:1)
"Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame." (1 Cor 15:34)
"For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him." (2 Cor 5:21)
"Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you." (2 Cor 13:11)
"And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others." (Eph 2:1-3)
"Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in anything ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you." (Phil 3:15)
"Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:" (Col 1:28)
"Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let everyone that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." (2 Tim 2:19)
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." (2 Tim 3:16-17)