iouae
Well-known member
Nice post.
I quite like talking scripture with them.
If you know your Bible, you have nothing to fear.
I always wear them out to the point they don't come back.
Which is a pity because they seem such nice folks.
Standing Up To Jehovah's Witnesses
- Thread starter WeberHome
- Start date
Nice post.
I quite like talking scripture with them.
If you know your Bible, you have nothing to fear.
I always wear them out to the point they don't come back.
Which is a pity because they seem such nice folks.
WeberHome
New member
-
"YOU are in harmony, not with the flesh, but with the spirit, if God’s spirit
truly dwells in YOU. (Rom 8:9, NWT)
That passage informs the Watch Tower Society's elite class of 144,000
anointed Witnesses that they are in harmony with the spirit; seeing as how
the anointed class has God's sprit truly dwelling in them.
At the same time; Rom 8:5-8 tells the non-anointed class of Witnesses that
they are in harmony, not with the spirit, but with the flesh; thus: they are
Jehovah's adversaries; unwilling to either please Him or comply with His
wishes. If John and Jane Doe non-anointed Witness don't know this; then all
I can say is: they've got some catching up to do.
There's more.
"And as for YOU, the anointing that YOU received from him remains in YOU,
and YOU do not need anyone to be teaching YOU; but, as the anointing from
him is teaching YOU about all things, and is true and is no lie, and just as it
has taught YOU, remain in union with him. (1John 2:27, NWT)
In a nutshell: the anointed class is able to remain in union with Christ on
their own by means of the one-on-one spiritual guidance that the anointing
provides them. Seeing as how the non-anointed class doesn't have access to
either the anointing or the anointing's one-on-one spiritual guidance; they
therefore are incapable of remaining in union with Christ on their own.
That, coupled with their resistance to God as per Rom 8:5-9, leaves John
and Jane Doe non-anointed Witness in a precarious spiritual condition; vz:
they are susceptible to deception by means of clever sophistry, semantic
double speak, and humanistic reasoning.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"YOU are in harmony, not with the flesh, but with the spirit, if God’s spirit
truly dwells in YOU. (Rom 8:9, NWT)
That passage informs the Watch Tower Society's elite class of 144,000
anointed Witnesses that they are in harmony with the spirit; seeing as how
the anointed class has God's sprit truly dwelling in them.
At the same time; Rom 8:5-8 tells the non-anointed class of Witnesses that
they are in harmony, not with the spirit, but with the flesh; thus: they are
Jehovah's adversaries; unwilling to either please Him or comply with His
wishes. If John and Jane Doe non-anointed Witness don't know this; then all
I can say is: they've got some catching up to do.
There's more.
"And as for YOU, the anointing that YOU received from him remains in YOU,
and YOU do not need anyone to be teaching YOU; but, as the anointing from
him is teaching YOU about all things, and is true and is no lie, and just as it
has taught YOU, remain in union with him. (1John 2:27, NWT)
In a nutshell: the anointed class is able to remain in union with Christ on
their own by means of the one-on-one spiritual guidance that the anointing
provides them. Seeing as how the non-anointed class doesn't have access to
either the anointing or the anointing's one-on-one spiritual guidance; they
therefore are incapable of remaining in union with Christ on their own.
That, coupled with their resistance to God as per Rom 8:5-9, leaves John
and Jane Doe non-anointed Witness in a precarious spiritual condition; vz:
they are susceptible to deception by means of clever sophistry, semantic
double speak, and humanistic reasoning.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
heir
TOL Subscriber
What is the gospel of your salvation that you will show them by the scriptures is the gospel of their salvation?
ROFL!
glorydaz
Well-known member
:first:
JonahofAkron
New member
:rotfl: :cheers:
JonahofAkron
New member
Excellent post. I agree. My grandfather is a JW and I have very frank and loving conversations about his beliefs-he does live 1800 miles away so the conversations on the phone are a little harder to do, but I still agree with the way you handle these conversations. That's awesome.
WeberHome
New member
-
Perhaps you could start a thread for that topic because the topic of this
thread is not evangelizing Jehovah's Witness; but rather: standing up to
them.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Perhaps you could start a thread for that topic because the topic of this
thread is not evangelizing Jehovah's Witness; but rather: standing up to
them.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
heir
TOL Subscriber
You can't stand up to them unless there is a gospel by which you stand! If you're not set for the defence of the gospel, you are wasting their time and yours! Don't you want to help them the only way you can with the power of God?
keypurr
Well-known member
Amen, they stop by hear once a month. We chat, they scratch there head, and keep returning trying to help me. They are pleasant folks. Most are more knowledgeable than most mainstreamers. They have been trying to convert me for at least forty years.
Well, I usually add a "have a magical day" to tone it down a little
iouae
Well-known member
The JW's come to your home with a pat argument.
The moment YOU get them talking about aspects of the Bible away from their sales pitch, they are vulnerable.
For instance if you start emphasising that ALL who believe in Jesus are His, so why do I need to join the JW's? They will then begin to list things exclusive to their beliefs which make them better than other churches. And these things will be ridiculous. I cannot remember from past meetings with them what these unique beliefs are, but they are generally quite easy to disprove.
I don't think it is hard to get rid of them if you don't want to talk. Just be pleasant and tell them you already know Jesus, so they would be better off going to your neighbours.
The moment YOU get them talking about aspects of the Bible away from their sales pitch, they are vulnerable.
For instance if you start emphasising that ALL who believe in Jesus are His, so why do I need to join the JW's? They will then begin to list things exclusive to their beliefs which make them better than other churches. And these things will be ridiculous. I cannot remember from past meetings with them what these unique beliefs are, but they are generally quite easy to disprove.
I don't think it is hard to get rid of them if you don't want to talk. Just be pleasant and tell them you already know Jesus, so they would be better off going to your neighbours.
musterion
Well-known member
They're not hearing the saving Gospel from you. That's why they keep coming back.
heir
TOL Subscriber
This says a lot about you. If you were testifying the gospel of the grace of God with them, they would mark you and never return.
heir
TOL Subscriber
"Exactamundo!"~Bro. SaulToPaul
WeberHome
New member
-
†. 1 John 4:2-3 . . By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that
confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God; and every
spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; and this is the spirit of
the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is
already in the world.
According to Watch Tower Society doctrine, it was not Jesus Christ who
came in the flesh, rather, it was an angel named Michael; which is an
interesting tale.
In Watch Tower Society theology, an angel named Michael volunteered to
come to the earth to die for humanity's sins. But the Society insists it is
impossible for someone to exist as a human being and a spirit being
simultaneously. So then, in order for Michael to come to the earth as a
human being, his existence as an angel had to be terminated.
However, according to the Society, Michael's life force survived his death;
and was transferred to Mary's womb where Michael was re-born as a human
being.
"the transferal of the life of his firstborn Son from the spirit realm to earth.
Only in this way could the child eventually born have retained identity as the
same person who had resided in heaven as the Word." (Aid to Bible
Understanding, 1971, p.920)
"He had to become a perfect man and yet not lose his continuity of life. His
life-force was not to be extinguished but would be transferred to the ovum
of the virgin girl, Mary." (Watch Tower magazine, 2-15-82, p.7)
NOTE: The Watch Tower magazine speaks for itself as a trustworthy source
of Watch Tower Society theology. "Those who are convinced that The
Watchtower is publishing the opinion or expression of a man should not
waste time in looking at it at all. Those who believe that God uses The
Watchtower as a means of communicating to his people, or of calling
attention to his prophecies, should study The Watchtower." (Watchtower,
Jan 1, 1942, page 5)
I am unaware at this time as to the Society's disposition of Michael's angel
corpse during the years on earth when he was existing as a human being.
But Michael's existence as a human being was only temporary. When God
"raised" Jesus from the dead, it was not actually Jesus who got raised from
the dead; it was Michael. Seeing as how Michael the angel had gone
completely out of existence when he became Jesus the human being; God
had to re-create Michael the angel from memory; in other words: in Society
theology, Michael the angel has undergone creation twice.
Bottom line: According to the Society; Jesus Christ's crucified body is still
dead; and his remains are squirreled away somewhere on earth in a
condition and a location known only to God.
The Society insists it was essential that Christ's crucified body not revive.
Their explanation is given on page 237 of the April 15, 1963 issue of the
Watch Tower magazine; where it's stated: "If Jesus were to take his body of
flesh, blood, and bones to heaven and enjoy them there, what would this
mean? It would mean that there would be no resurrection of the dead for
anybody. Why not? Because Jesus would be taking his sacrifice off God's
altar."
Q: What about Jesus' alleged post resurrection appearances?
A: In order to show his friends that their savior was back from death,
Michael is alleged to have materialized a human body that was in all
respects just as physical, and just as functional as a real human body;
which we know from modern movie technology as an avatar. Michael never
once let on to his friends that he was an angel in disguise. He led them to
believe that the Jesus they all knew prior to his execution was back.
In most people's book that is nothing less than impersonation; which can be
defined as assuming a fake identity. In other words: pretending to be
someone you're not-- the crime of fraud, which in some jurisdictions is a
felony punishable by serving time in a state prison. If the Society is correct
about Michael, then the avatar wasn't an expedient, no, it was a deliberate
forgery.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
†. 1 John 4:2-3 . . By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that
confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God; and every
spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; and this is the spirit of
the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is
already in the world.
According to Watch Tower Society doctrine, it was not Jesus Christ who
came in the flesh, rather, it was an angel named Michael; which is an
interesting tale.
In Watch Tower Society theology, an angel named Michael volunteered to
come to the earth to die for humanity's sins. But the Society insists it is
impossible for someone to exist as a human being and a spirit being
simultaneously. So then, in order for Michael to come to the earth as a
human being, his existence as an angel had to be terminated.
However, according to the Society, Michael's life force survived his death;
and was transferred to Mary's womb where Michael was re-born as a human
being.
"the transferal of the life of his firstborn Son from the spirit realm to earth.
Only in this way could the child eventually born have retained identity as the
same person who had resided in heaven as the Word." (Aid to Bible
Understanding, 1971, p.920)
"He had to become a perfect man and yet not lose his continuity of life. His
life-force was not to be extinguished but would be transferred to the ovum
of the virgin girl, Mary." (Watch Tower magazine, 2-15-82, p.7)
NOTE: The Watch Tower magazine speaks for itself as a trustworthy source
of Watch Tower Society theology. "Those who are convinced that The
Watchtower is publishing the opinion or expression of a man should not
waste time in looking at it at all. Those who believe that God uses The
Watchtower as a means of communicating to his people, or of calling
attention to his prophecies, should study The Watchtower." (Watchtower,
Jan 1, 1942, page 5)
I am unaware at this time as to the Society's disposition of Michael's angel
corpse during the years on earth when he was existing as a human being.
But Michael's existence as a human being was only temporary. When God
"raised" Jesus from the dead, it was not actually Jesus who got raised from
the dead; it was Michael. Seeing as how Michael the angel had gone
completely out of existence when he became Jesus the human being; God
had to re-create Michael the angel from memory; in other words: in Society
theology, Michael the angel has undergone creation twice.
Bottom line: According to the Society; Jesus Christ's crucified body is still
dead; and his remains are squirreled away somewhere on earth in a
condition and a location known only to God.
The Society insists it was essential that Christ's crucified body not revive.
Their explanation is given on page 237 of the April 15, 1963 issue of the
Watch Tower magazine; where it's stated: "If Jesus were to take his body of
flesh, blood, and bones to heaven and enjoy them there, what would this
mean? It would mean that there would be no resurrection of the dead for
anybody. Why not? Because Jesus would be taking his sacrifice off God's
altar."
Q: What about Jesus' alleged post resurrection appearances?
A: In order to show his friends that their savior was back from death,
Michael is alleged to have materialized a human body that was in all
respects just as physical, and just as functional as a real human body;
which we know from modern movie technology as an avatar. Michael never
once let on to his friends that he was an angel in disguise. He led them to
believe that the Jesus they all knew prior to his execution was back.
In most people's book that is nothing less than impersonation; which can be
defined as assuming a fake identity. In other words: pretending to be
someone you're not-- the crime of fraud, which in some jurisdictions is a
felony punishable by serving time in a state prison. If the Society is correct
about Michael, then the avatar wasn't an expedient, no, it was a deliberate
forgery.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
keypurr
Well-known member
I want them to return so I can learn and share. Maybe they will accept my thoughts.
Ben Masada
New member
Hit and Caught Before Running
Hit and Caught Before Running
Hit and Caught Before Running
Last week I met in the street with a couple from the Christian faction of "Jehovah's Witnesses" who, after giving me a pamphlet from the Watch Tower, the following dialogue took place:
"J'W" - Do you know that the Jewish Divine election has been replaced by the "Jehovah's Witnesses."
Jew - I don't think so but, where is it written?
"J'W" - Isaiah 43:10.
Jew - Take the zero off and read Isaiah 43:1 and see who are the real Jehovah's Witnesses. The whole chapter is about Israel.
"J'W" - Better yet hear what John 3:16 says about Jesus: "Jehovah so loved the world as to give His only begotten son that whoever believes in him is saved." Notice that he said, "Only begotten son" which means that there is no other.
Jew - How about Exodus 4:23? Jehovah Himself said that, "Israel is My son; let My son go that he may serve Me."
"J'W" - Alas, that's Israel the people who has been replaced by us. But listen, although we have replaced you, Jews are very important to us. Here is our address; would you come to visit us at 1pm today and gave me their address.
Jew - Sorry but we are not supposed to be found within a non-Jewish house of worship.
"J'W" - What's the matter, are you afraid?
Jew - No it is not fear but a matter of Jewish culture.
"J'W" - Where is it written that you are not supposed to enter a non-Jewish house of worship ?
Jew - Naaman was the commander of the king of Aram and he was a leper. He had a Jewess servant who suggested to him to seek cure from Elisha in Israel. He came to Elisha and was told to immerse 7 times in the Jordan River, he did as he was bid and got cured. He converted to Judaism and asked Elisha to plead God to forgive him every time he had to help his master the king to enter the temple of Rimmon to worship. It is from this event that Jews acquired the custom not to enter a non-Jewish house of worship. That's in II Kings 5:1-18.
Conclusion - That was the end of the dialogue as they would neither speak nor remove their eyes from me. I had to say good bye and leave
Hit and Caught Before Running
Hit and Caught Before Running
Last week I met in the street with a couple from the Christian faction of "Jehovah's Witnesses" who, after giving me a pamphlet from the Watch Tower, the following dialogue took place:
"J'W" - Do you know that the Jewish Divine election has been replaced by the "Jehovah's Witnesses."
Jew - I don't think so but, where is it written?
"J'W" - Isaiah 43:10.
Jew - Take the zero off and read Isaiah 43:1 and see who are the real Jehovah's Witnesses. The whole chapter is about Israel.
"J'W" - Better yet hear what John 3:16 says about Jesus: "Jehovah so loved the world as to give His only begotten son that whoever believes in him is saved." Notice that he said, "Only begotten son" which means that there is no other.
Jew - How about Exodus 4:23? Jehovah Himself said that, "Israel is My son; let My son go that he may serve Me."
"J'W" - Alas, that's Israel the people who has been replaced by us. But listen, although we have replaced you, Jews are very important to us. Here is our address; would you come to visit us at 1pm today and gave me their address.
Jew - Sorry but we are not supposed to be found within a non-Jewish house of worship.
"J'W" - What's the matter, are you afraid?
Jew - No it is not fear but a matter of Jewish culture.
"J'W" - Where is it written that you are not supposed to enter a non-Jewish house of worship ?
Jew - Naaman was the commander of the king of Aram and he was a leper. He had a Jewess servant who suggested to him to seek cure from Elisha in Israel. He came to Elisha and was told to immerse 7 times in the Jordan River, he did as he was bid and got cured. He converted to Judaism and asked Elisha to plead God to forgive him every time he had to help his master the king to enter the temple of Rimmon to worship. It is from this event that Jews acquired the custom not to enter a non-Jewish house of worship. That's in II Kings 5:1-18.
Conclusion - That was the end of the dialogue as they would neither speak nor remove their eyes from me. I had to say good bye and leave
Full marks for your perseverance, I have only had them knocking on my door for around ten years now. We have some good chats, I doubt if either of us will budge. My thoughts are towards Christian Unity and interfaith relations. As part of our local Street Pastor team, I regularly pray with Christians from several denominations, before we go out on the streets together. I have been inviting our JW friend along, but they don't do unity.
Thats exactly right, we used to have JWS and Mormons knock at our doors a lot, once we invited a couple of them in (from each group as they came) and shared the truth with them including the gospel of salvation, they have never returned, not even different ones - weve yet to have another visit from either group.