Should homosexuals be given the death penalty?

[Clete]

Um, I'm not. I do however view the specific laws given to Isreal, as specific laws, given by God to a specific people at a specific time. While the moral principles behind them are certainly valid for all people, as God would never call for the punishment of something that wasn't evil, I see no reason why you would view them as, in detail, binding on all people at all times.

Because the Bible says so, that's why. Ever read the book of Romans?

See, now you're obviously projected other arguments you've had about this subject at other times into this. The issue has nothing to with anything being "antiquated". It has to do with whether the mosaic law represents a universal convenant with all people for all time, or a specific covenant made with the nation of Isreal ending upon the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. My belief is the latter.

I'm projecting nothing. You just said, in so many words, that the criminal justice system given in the Bible is antiquated. :doh:

No more than one would say that Jesus as gone to a shrink and gotten his latent adultery issues resolved before forgiving the adulterous woman brought before him by Pharisees.

Jesus did not abolish the death penalty when He did not condemn the woman caught in adultery. What He did was out smart the Jews who were trying to create a premature conflict between Jesus and the Roman government who didn't allow countries under their authority to execute anyone without their permission.

So then you're ready to institute the whole of the mosiac law?

Only that part of it that has to do with morality. That portion of the Mosaic law that was symbolic or had to do with keeping Israel separated from the rest of the world for religious reasons would not apply.

Ready to re-institute slavery?

The Bible does not support race-based slavery but for those who cannot pay what they owe should be made to work off their debts (for no longer than 7 years).

Ready to repeal all law regulating immigration?

I'm not familiar with what the Bible teaches on this specific issue but sure! God is smarter than me and I trust that He knows what is and is not best for a nation. If the welfare state that exists in this country were ended there would no longer be any reason to be concerned about how many people immigrate as long as they obeyed the law.

Both of those would be requirements to be fully under the mosaic which are never directly repealed in the New Testament. Are you actually ready to take what you're saying to it's logical conclusion or are you merely a hypocrite looking for an excuse to kill people you think are "icky"?

You will find that I am the most intellectually honest person you have ever come across (even if I do say so myself). Taking a position to its logical conclusion is perhaps the best way of determining whether that position is sound or not. If you think you'll be able to shock me with God's unjust laws or some other such nonsense as that and thereby get me to back step from my stated position you are quite wrong. I am not afraid of the word of God. Bring it on, if you dare.

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Granite]

Clete: do you ever get sick of the sound of your own voice? A stuffed shirt like you probably needs to get out more.

As a proponent of slavery, executing homosexuals, and a sometime defender of mutilating women, I'd say you're slightly koo-koo for Cocoa Puffs.

 

[Nineveh]

... do you ever get sick of the sound of your own voice? ...

Same Q to you, granite

 

[Granite]

Same Q to you, granite

Is this gonna be one of those days when you carp around me and circle every post I make like a harpy?

 

[Nineveh]

Is this gonna be one of those days when you carp around me and circle every post I make like a harpy?

If'n ya don't like it, don't bother dishin' it out

 

[Clete]

Yes, and obviously our interpretation thereof, as well as Christ's statement of fulfilling the law, differ considerably.

Right. Mine is the plain reading of the text of Scripture version whereas yours is the be nicer than God so as not to offend the perverts of the world version. It's digusting and it undermines the very gospel you perport to believe and represent.

No, I said it was not binding as it was part of covenant which was fulfilled with the life, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Antiquated implies all sorts of things which I'm not saying.

Antiquated means out dated. It's the same word as antique. We aren't speaking face to face here so you have to go with what the words I use actually mean not what you want to read into them.

So then you're saying he recognized Roman law as superior to and superseding the Mosaic law?

Don't be silly. I told you what He was doing. He was simply avoiding a conflict with the Romans that would have been premature. There was a specific time that He had in mind to be executed in order to fulfill prophecy and was smart enough to know what to say and how to say it so as to keep His own timetable intact.
Further, Jesus actually kept in perfect keeping with the Mosaic Law in that passage. The execution of criminals can only be done upon the testimony of two or three witnesses. All the witnesses had been silenced and had left and so there were no legal grounds upon which to condemn her to death in either the Roman system or the Jewish one.

Actually, the seven year limitation would only apply to those within the convenant, at the time the Isrealites, those outside the convenant could be held in slavery indefinitely.

Can you establish this Biblically? I don't think you can. 7 years was the max unless one willingly became a bondservant of another.

Good, then I can certainly respect your position even though I disagree with it.

:thumb:

Hold on there. Don't put words in my mouth. I never said a single one of those laws were unjust, as to say that would make God unjust. However, I feel the covenant which they were a part of has ended and are therefore they are no longer binding in a legal sense.

It wasn't my intention to put words in your mouth but if the execution of homos was just at one time (and by extension unjust not to execute them) why would that have changed? The laws against homoism are moral in nature not symbolic or religious and so if it was wrong then it is wrong now and if it was just to execute them then, then it is still unjust to keep them alive now.

Ezekiel 13:19 You have profaned me among my people for a few handfuls of barley and scraps of bread. By lying to my people, who listen to lies, you have killed those who should not have died and have spared those who should not live.​

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[`Love.]

I openly advocate the execution of adulterers and in fact did so just a few posts before this one that I'm responding too (don't worry, I don't read a lot of these mindless posts either .)
You are at least partially correct however; some of the laws given by Moses were about Israel. There were laws that had to do with morality and others that had to do with symbolism and religious practice and separating Israel from the rest of the world. For some of the laws it is more difficult to tell which category they fit in than it is for others but one of the major ways to tell is to see if one law could conflict with another. Take observing the Sabbath and Circumcision for example, circumcision was considered a work of the flesh and was to be performed on the eighth day of a newborn’s life. Ever wonder what happened if the eighth day fell on Saturday or some other Sabbath day? Do you see how they can conflict with one another? The answer is that the baby would be circumcised because circumcision to precedence over the Sabbath but that really isn't the point. The point is that you can know that these are not moral laws but rather symbolic ones because no moral laws ever conflict with one another. No one will ever have to commit adultery in order to keep from murdering them or rob someone's house in order to keep from raping their children. Thus moral laws are absolute and applied to more than just Israel (thus the just destruction of cities like Sodom and Nineveh).

It seems clear that you are rendering little more than your own personal opinion in these matters. If you're interested in actually knowing what the Bible teaches concerning such things I recommend going to www.kgov.com and getting Bob Enyart's "Focus on the Strategy" video and/or his "God and the Death Penalty" video and/or his audio series on God's criminal justice system. These will keep you from saying things like,
"I have a feeling we would be missing 90% of our population."

and

"This really sounds like one of those, OT, NT things."

Such comments display a great deal of Biblical ignorance that, while completely typical is, in my view, inexcusable in the law term. I'm not trying to insult you so please don't take it that way but it's just that you sound like Granite for crying out loud! No Christian should ever sound anything at all like Granite. :nono:

Resting in Him,
Clete

TRUE! I've actually said that before. But, I will note personal opinion is how Bob Enyart got his views as well. There's nothing wrong or ignorant with using personal opinion.

But, just to clarify, that IS the only verse that says that? Correct?

(We would lose 90% of our population if we killed everyone who worked had on the Sabbath. )

 

[`Love.]

Well, I think Urizen has it, so I'll just wander off. :sheep:

 

[Vera Carp]

The question is NOT whether homosexuals should be given the death penalty,

The question is NOT whether homosexuals should be given the death penalty,

the question is, "What is the most efficient way of rounding up all known or suspected homosexuals, removing them from society, and then eliminating them?"

the question is, "How should we go about the process of disposing of their property and belongings once they have been removed from our midst?"

the question is, "How do we go about identifying homosexuals so that we NORMAL people will be able to readily identify who they are?"

the question is, "How can we round up the pro-sodomite supporters of homosexuals, be they homosexual or heterosexual, and remove them from our midst as well because they, too, deserve the due penalty of their error (death)."

the question is, "How do we remake society according to GOD'S WORD, THE BIBLE, so that ALL of our laws are in line with GOD'S LAW -- and how do we go about removing from society those people who have decided they are not subject to GOD'S LAW?"

GOD'S LAW IS CLEAR -- THE PENALTY SEVERE!!!
​

 

[Granite]

Looks like house frau Betty Crocker spends time ironing brown shirts.

Lady, you're a loon. :loser:

 

[erinmarie]

the question is, "What is the most efficient way of rounding up all known or suspected homosexuals, removing them from society, and then eliminating them?"

the question is, "How should we go about the process of disposing of their property and belongings once they have been removed from our midst?"

the question is, "How do we go about identifying homosexuals so that we NORMAL people will be able to readily identify who they are?"

the question is, "How can we round up the pro-sodomite supporters of homosexuals, be they homosexual or heterosexual, and remove them from our midst as well because they, too, deserve the due penalty of their error (death)."

the question is, "How do we remake society according to GOD'S WORD, THE BIBLE, so that ALL of our laws are in line with GOD'S LAW -- and how do we go about removing from society those people who have decided they are not subject to GOD'S LAW?"

GOD'S LAW IS CLEAR -- THE PENALTY SEVERE!!!
​

Wow. Just wait till Granite sees this. He's going to throw a little mini fit. It will be funny, a little bit cute, and mostly annoying.

 

[Granite]

Way ahead of ya. :devil:

 

[Vera Carp]

TRUE! I've actually said that before. But, I will note personal opinion is how Bob Enyart got his views as well. There's nothing wrong or ignorant with using personal opinion.

But, just to clarify, that IS the only verse that says that? Correct?

(We would lose 90% of our population if we killed everyone who worked had on the Sabbath. )

Then maybe God demands that we get rid of 90 percent of our population.

Have you ever thought about THAT?

GOD'S LAW IS CLEAR -- THE PENALTY SEVERE!!!​

 

[Granite]

Is this piece of work nuts and serious or a troll with tongue in cheek?

 

[erinmarie]

Is this piece of work nuts and serious or a troll with tongue in cheek?

I think she's very serious. And I think we should back away slowly from this thread, and never look back.

 

[Vera Carp]

Looks like house frau Betty Crocker spends time ironing brown shirts.

Lady, you're a loon. :loser:

I'd rather follow GOD'S LAW than man's political correctness.

At least ONE of us won't spend eternity burning in HELL.

GOD'S LAW IS CLEAR -- THE PENALTY SEVERE!!!​

 

[Granite]

Actually I'm interested in what Frau Vera has to say.

Free entertainment, anyway.

So...where you at, you ridiculous wingnut?:devil:

 

[`Love.]

Then maybe God demands that we get rid of 90 percent of our population.

Have you ever thought about THAT?

Um, have you ever worked on the Sabbath? :Shimei:

 

[Vera Carp]

I think she's very serious. And I think we should back away slowly from this thread, and never look back.

How about this: we should do what GOD'S WORD demands that we do -- and stop equivocating about it.

There is NO PLACE in society -- or on this planet -- for a homosexual.

GOD HAS GIVEN THEM UP.

GOD'S LAW IS CLEAR -- THE PENALTY SEVERE!!!​

 

[`Love.]

Actually I'm interested in what Frau Vera has to say.

Free entertainment, anyway.

So...where you at, you ridiculous wingnut?:devil:

HOLY FUDGECRACKERS! I'M AGREEING WITH GRANITE!!!

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!! MY BRAIN IS COLLAPSING ON ITSELF!!! :noway: