Shooting at SC Church During Bible Study - Suspect still at large

[aikido7]

A lifetime of paid accommodation and entertainment? Yep, that's injustice.

Maybe you do not understand what is happening in our "prison industry." I teach a volunteer class at a prison every month.

To be blunt, these people no longer have their freedom. A complaint is that they have no freedom to read because the TV is often on 24/7. They are behind bars with all of the horrible sights, smells, noise and violence that this entails.

They no longer have freedom. And just think of those who are put into solitary confinement. Prison affects most offenders' mental processes and damages their dignity. And believe me, that is punishment.

I see God revealed in the historical figure of Jesus--not the bloodthirsty tyrant who will kill the unbelievers until their blood reaches to the level of his horse's bridle for 200 miles as Revelation tells us. The gospel meant to "free the captives" as well. Those of us who are captive by our sins.

You seem to favor a God of justice who demands the spilling of blood. Following Jesus (and John the Baptizer), I see a God of mercy.

"I desire mercy, not sacrifice."

Costs too much and does nothing but bring more of the same and worse. Rocks are the answer. :up:

Systemic violence and war merely produce anger, revenge fantasies and retaliation with the same kind of violence on the other side!

The lessons of history are important.

Nope. You're a liar.

If you are serious about communicating with others, it's more helpful not to call names or affix labels. It just provokes defensiveness and anger.

It would have been more honest and accountable for you to simply say "Aikido7, I don't believe you. And this is why, etc."

You advocate killing babies whose fathers are criminals.
You think this guy's intentions were good going into a church with a weapon?

I do not advocate killing babies. This is nonsense. You need to start communicating in a more mature manner. Why don't you ask me what I advocate instead of guessing at my thoughts?

Seriously?

lain:

Absolutely. The man/boy was wearing an Apartheid patch on his clothing. He attacked blacks because he was clearly afraid of them and was a racist because of that fear.

His positive intention was to alleviate that fear but he chose a violent way to satisfy the intention. And based on my first post in this forum, he is probably mentally ill.

Reality shows that your ideals have led us to where we are today. It is your system of removing guns, removing the death penalty and focussing on "feelings" that has led to the epidemic of crime we see.

Yet you want to press on; insisting that salvation is just over the hill.

I believe you are confusing effects with causes. There are many, many ideals and causes in such a complicated manner. Instead of seeing things from a single perspective (think of FOX "News") we need to realize reality is nuanced and complex.

Salvation is all about this life. Jesus offered and granted salvation to many long before he was killed in Jerusalem.

Bible Study is actually "Studying the Bible!"

 

[GuySmiley]

First responders need to have guns.

Cops aren't first responders.

 

[aikido7]

First responders need to have guns.

Cops aren't first responders.

The data and research I have seen reveal that average people carrying guns does not solve the problem of violence.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-weisser/gun-owners-impulsive-angry-behavior_b_7054146.html

Here's something I ran into on this same website...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/18/fox-news-charleston-shooting_n_7614126.html

FOX "News" letting ideology get in the way of common sense.

 

[GuySmiley]

The data and research I have seen reveal that average people carrying guns does not solve the problem of violence.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mike-weisser/gun-owners-impulsive-angry-behavior_b_7054146.html

Here's something I ran into on this same website...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/18/fox-news-charleston-shooting_n_7614126.html

FOX "News" letting ideology get in the way of common sense.

Free speech can cause problems too. Self defense is a human right.

 

[aikido7]

Free speech can cause problems too. Self defense is a human right.

What about nonviolent self-defense?

My personal experience and my studies tell me it works.

 

[aikido7]

Free speech can cause problems too. Self defense is a human right.

Nonviolence in action in response to a school shooting:


http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/21/us/georgia-school-gunshots/

 

[The Berean]

Wow. :jawdrop:

http://www.ijreview.com/2015/06/347...tm_term=conservativedaily&utm_campaign=Terror

 

[Alate_One]

Wow. :jawdrop:

http://www.ijreview.com/2015/06/347...tm_term=conservativedaily&utm_campaign=Terror

In case people are too lazy to click over.

And I'll just repeat the top comment, that is what real Christians do. They reach out in love.

 

[Stripe]

And I'll just repeat the top comment, that is what real Christians do. They reach out in love.

A real man would have shot him repeatedly in the torso and head.

 

[Stripe]

Maybe you do not understand what is happening in our "prison industry..." These people no longer have their freedom.

Thank you, Captain Obvious.

A complaint is that they have no freedom to read because the TV is often on 24/7. They are behind bars with all of the horrible sights, smells, noise and violence that this entails.

I have the perfect solution. :up:

I see God revealed in the historical figure of Jesus--not the bloodthirsty tyrant who will kill the unbelievers until their blood reaches to the level of his horse's bridle for 200 miles as Revelation tells us. The gospel meant to "free the captives" as well. Those of us who are captive by our sins.

You hate the word of God and have no idea who Jesus is.

"I desire mercy, not sacrifice."

Why is there a need for mercy? :think:

If you are serious about communicating with others, it's more helpful not to call names or affix labels. It just provokes defensiveness and anger.

You advocate the extermination of unborn babies whose fathers are criminals.

What about nonviolent self-defense?

My personal experience and my studies tell me it works.

Right, you would have totally talked your way out of the church unscathed.

 

[TomO]

What about nonviolent self-defense?

My personal experience and my studies tell me it works.

lain: What about nonviolent self-defense and I'll keep my .38 as something to fall back on if my nonviolent self-defense doesn't quite cut it.

My personal experience and my studies tell me that works better.

 

[Stripe]

"Walk softly and carry an armored-tank division, I always say."

 

[Granite]

lain: What about nonviolent self-defense and I'll keep my .38 as something to fall back on if my nonviolent self-defense doesn't quite cut it.

My personal experience and my studies tell me that works better.

So how many people have you shot in self-defense?

 

[bybee]

So how many people have you shot in self-defense?

That is a specious comment on your part. Especially to someone like TomO who has displayed great decency, restraint and intelligence in his posts on TOL.
Rather he is advocating "BE PREPARED" because we live in a dangerous world wherein many people do not respect the rights of others.
I agree with him.

 

[Granite]

That is a specious comment on your part. Especially to someone like TomO who has displayed great decency, restraint and intelligence in his posts on TOL.
Rather he is advocating "BE PREPARED" because we live in a dangerous world wherein many people do not respect the rights of others.
I agree with him.

Preparation's one thing. Prep is fine. I'm a gun owner. But I don't like or much trust the starring-in-my-own-movie mentality I see from a lot of gun owners who think "freedom" and "liberty" mean strapping on a carbine while eating a burger or buying diapers. There's an awful lot of tough, foolish talk on TOL (and elsewhere) whenever a massacre takes place. What exactly does that tell you?

That said, I don't think Tom's part of the problem. But I do think it's ridiculous to keep falling back on the same tropes, the same cliches, the same little talking points, all in the name of some specious notion of "liberty," whenever another batch of our countrymen are shot to death by yet another lunatic.

 

[TomO]

So how many people have you shot in self-defense?

lain: One...It's not something that I will discuss in detail for my own best interests. I don't know how it turned out for the recipient, neither do I care, but it's doubtful it killed him.

That is a specious comment on your part. Especially to someone like TomO who has displayed great decency, restraint and intelligence in his posts on TOL.
Rather he is advocating "BE PREPARED" because we live in a dangerous world wherein many people do not respect the rights of others.
I agree with him.

No, I appreciate your standing by me here but since I did cite experience it is a valid question.
You are, of course, correct regarding the main point of my statement though. :e4e:

 

[TomO]

Preparation's one thing. Prep is fine. I'm a gun owner. But I don't like or much trust the starring-in-my-own-movie mentality I see from a lot of gun owners who think "freedom" and "liberty" mean strapping on a carbine while eating a burger or buying diapers. There's an awful lot of tough, foolish talk on TOL (and elsewhere) whenever a massacre takes place. What exactly does that tell you?

Personally, I consider the "open carry" of long guns a foolish and counter-productive action...but nobody asks me about these things.

That said, I don't think Tom's part of the problem. But I do think it's ridiculous to keep falling back on the same tropes, the same cliches, the same little talking points, all in the name of some specious notion of "liberty," whenever another batch of our countrymen are shot to death by yet another lunatic.

:e4e: Thanks....I try not to be. The fact remains though the same cliche's always come out from the other side of the argument as well.

I think we've had this discussion before. :think:

 

[Granite]

Personally, I consider the "open carry" of long guns a foolish and counter-productive action...but nobody asks me about these things.

On this we absolutely agree.

The fact remains though the same cliche's always come out from the other side of the argument as well.

I think the other side of the argument (if we understand each other) makes more and more sense each time there's yet another all-American bloodbath. But I'm pretty sure nothing is going to change any time soon.

 

[Rusha]

I think the other side of the argument (if we understand each other) makes more and more sense each time there's yet another all-American bloodbath. But I'm pretty sure nothing is going to change any time soon.

The problem with the other side of the argument is they wish to remove ALL guns from law abiding citizens and do not have a satisfactory answer in regards to keeping them out of the hands of criminals.

 

[bybee]

The problem with the other side of the argument is they wish to remove ALL guns from law abiding citizens and do not have a satisfactory answer in regards to keeping them out of the hands of criminals.

You nailed it Sister!