Scientific proof the Turin Shroud is real:

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Can you tell us why Jesus looks European instead of Middle Eastern?

He looks Middle Eastern and Jewish to me.

Ray Downing did the imaging of the shroud.

 

[CabinetMaker]

He looks Middle Eastern and Jewish to me.

Ray Downing did the imaging of the shroud.

Of course he does.
He probably looked more like this:
View attachment 26094

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Of course he does.
He probably looked more like this:

Urrr? That is the real face of Jesus as shown in the video in the OP, which is what is being discussed. This is why you should always read and watch OP's before posting. :duh:

 

[jamie]

Again Jamie you need to take the time to watch and understand the information and evidence.

A photo of a dead man doesn't prove he was resurrected.

Why don't you give some thought to what you post?

The shroud is fake news about an unknown cadaver.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

You can use the speed settings to reduce the time, however if you really had a passion for wanting to know more about are Lord and saviour it wouldn't matter how long it was, sorry to sound harsh but I just can't understand your reasoning for dismissing our Lord's burial shroud that tells us so much about his death and what he actually looked like. Why don't you want to see our Lord?

Just because this site and others are riddled with second commandment violations, there is no reason to ask folks to seek violation of the same, as do Romanists.

http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?119524-Christ-s-Color&p=4987989&viewfull=1#post4987989
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?118689-Graven-Images&p=4761144&viewfull=1#post4761144

Spoiler

From the WLC:

Q. 108. What are the duties required in the second commandment?
A. The duties required in the second commandment are, the receiving, observing, and keeping pure and entire, all such religious worship and ordinances as God hath instituted in his Word; particularly prayer and thanksgiving in the name of Christ; the reading, preaching, and hearing of the Word; the administration and receiving of the sacraments; church government and discipline; the ministry and maintenance thereof; religious fasting; swearing by the name of God, and vowing unto him: as also the disapproving, detesting, opposing, all false worship; and, according to each one’s place and calling, removing it, and all monuments of idolatry. Deut. 32:46-47; Matt. 28:20; Acts 2:42; 1 Tim. 6:13-14; Phil. 4:6; Eph. 5:20; Deut. 17:18-19; Acts 15:21; 2 Tim. 4:2; Jas. 1:21-22: Acts 10:33; Matt. 28:19; 1 Cor. 11:23-30; Matt. 18:15-17; Matt. 16:19; 1 Cor. 5:1-13; 1 Cor. 12:28; Eph. 4: 11-12;1 Tim. 5:17-18; 1 Cor. 9:7-15; Joel 2:12-13; 1 Cor. 7:5; Deut. 6:13; Isa. 19: 21; Ps. 76:11; Acts 17:16-17; Ps. 16:4; Deut. 7:5; Isa. 30:22.

Q. 109. What are the sins forbidden in the second commandment?
A. The sins forbidden in the second commandment are, all devising, counselling, commanding, using, and anywise approving, any religious worship not instituted by God himself; tolerating a false religion; the making any representation of God, of all, or of any of the three Persons, either inwardly in our mind, or outwardly in any kind of image or likeness of any creature whatsoever; all worshiping of it, or God in it or by it; the making of any representation of feigned deities, and all worship of them, or service belonging to them; all superstitious devices, corrupting the worship of God, adding to it, or taking from it, whether invented and taken up of ourselves, or received by tradition from others, though under the title of antiquity, custom, devotion, good intent, or any other pretence whatsoever; simony; sacrilege; all neglect, contempt, hindering, and opposing the worship and ordinances which God hath appointed. Num. 15:39; Deut. 13:6-8; Hos. 5:11; Mic. 6:16; 1 Kings 11:33; 1 Kings 12: 33; Deut. 12:30-32; Deut. 13:6-12; Zech. 13:2-3; Rev. 2:2, 14-15, 20; Rev. 17:12, 16-17; Deut. 4:15-19; Acts 17:29; Rom. 1:21-23, 25; Dan. 3:18; Gal. 4:8; Ex. 32: 5; Ex. 32:8; 1 Kings 18:26, 28; Isa. 65:11; Acts 17:22; Col. 2:21-23; Mal. 1:7-8, 14; Deut. 4:2; Ps. 106:39; Matt. 15:9; 1 Pet. 1:18; Jer. 44:17; Isa. 65:3-5; Gal. 1: 13-14; 1 Sam. 13:11-12; 1 Sam. 15:21; Acts 8:18; Rom. 2:22; Mal. 3:8; Ex. 4:24-26; Matt. 22:5; Mal. 1:7, 13; Matt. 23:13; Acts 13:44-45; 1 Thess. 2:15-16.

Q. 110. What are the reasons annexed to the second commandment, the more to enforce it?
A. The reasons annexed to the second commandment, the more to enforce it, contained in these words, For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; and showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments; are, besides God’s sovereignty over us, and propriety in us, his fervent zeal for his own worship, and his revengeful indignation against all false worship, as being a spiritual whoredom; accounting the breakers of this commandment such as hate him, and threatening to punish them into divers generations; and esteeming the observers of it such as love him and keep his commandments, and promising mercy to them unto many generations. Ex. 20:5-6; Ps. 45:11; Rev. 15:3-4; Ex. 34:13-14; 1 Cor. 10:20-22; Jer. 7:18-20; Ezek. 16:26-27; Deut. 32:16-20; Hos. 2:2-4; Deut. 5:29.

AMR

 

[CabinetMaker]

Urrr? That is the real face of Jesus as shown in the video in the OP, which is what is being discussed. This is why you should always read and watch OP's before posting. :duh:

Sorry, the picture didn't post. Here it is.
View attachment 26093

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Of course he does.
He probably looked more like this:
View attachment 26094

The image on the shroud was the first photo but in stead of photons making the image it was plasma. This has now been scientifically proven. The video in the OP shows this.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

A photo of a dead man doesn't prove he was resurrected.

Why don't you give some thought to what you post?

The shroud is fake news about an unknown cadaver.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Just because this site and others are riddled with second commandment violations, there is no reason to ask folks to seek violation of the same, as do Romanists.

http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?119524-Christ-s-Color&p=4987989&viewfull=1#post4987989
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?118689-Graven-Images&p=4761144&viewfull=1#post4761144

Spoiler

From the WLC:

Q. 108. What are the duties required in the second commandment?
A. The duties required in the second commandment are, the receiving, observing, and keeping pure and entire, all such religious worship and ordinances as God hath instituted in his Word; particularly prayer and thanksgiving in the name of Christ; the reading, preaching, and hearing of the Word; the administration and receiving of the sacraments; church government and discipline; the ministry and maintenance thereof; religious fasting; swearing by the name of God, and vowing unto him: as also the disapproving, detesting, opposing, all false worship; and, according to each one’s place and calling, removing it, and all monuments of idolatry. Deut. 32:46-47; Matt. 28:20; Acts 2:42; 1 Tim. 6:13-14; Phil. 4:6; Eph. 5:20; Deut. 17:18-19; Acts 15:21; 2 Tim. 4:2; Jas. 1:21-22: Acts 10:33; Matt. 28:19; 1 Cor. 11:23-30; Matt. 18:15-17; Matt. 16:19; 1 Cor. 5:1-13; 1 Cor. 12:28; Eph. 4: 11-12;1 Tim. 5:17-18; 1 Cor. 9:7-15; Joel 2:12-13; 1 Cor. 7:5; Deut. 6:13; Isa. 19: 21; Ps. 76:11; Acts 17:16-17; Ps. 16:4; Deut. 7:5; Isa. 30:22.

Q. 109. What are the sins forbidden in the second commandment?
A. The sins forbidden in the second commandment are, all devising, counselling, commanding, using, and anywise approving, any religious worship not instituted by God himself; tolerating a false religion; the making any representation of God, of all, or of any of the three Persons, either inwardly in our mind, or outwardly in any kind of image or likeness of any creature whatsoever; all worshiping of it, or God in it or by it; the making of any representation of feigned deities, and all worship of them, or service belonging to them; all superstitious devices, corrupting the worship of God, adding to it, or taking from it, whether invented and taken up of ourselves, or received by tradition from others, though under the title of antiquity, custom, devotion, good intent, or any other pretence whatsoever; simony; sacrilege; all neglect, contempt, hindering, and opposing the worship and ordinances which God hath appointed. Num. 15:39; Deut. 13:6-8; Hos. 5:11; Mic. 6:16; 1 Kings 11:33; 1 Kings 12: 33; Deut. 12:30-32; Deut. 13:6-12; Zech. 13:2-3; Rev. 2:2, 14-15, 20; Rev. 17:12, 16-17; Deut. 4:15-19; Acts 17:29; Rom. 1:21-23, 25; Dan. 3:18; Gal. 4:8; Ex. 32: 5; Ex. 32:8; 1 Kings 18:26, 28; Isa. 65:11; Acts 17:22; Col. 2:21-23; Mal. 1:7-8, 14; Deut. 4:2; Ps. 106:39; Matt. 15:9; 1 Pet. 1:18; Jer. 44:17; Isa. 65:3-5; Gal. 1: 13-14; 1 Sam. 13:11-12; 1 Sam. 15:21; Acts 8:18; Rom. 2:22; Mal. 3:8; Ex. 4:24-26; Matt. 22:5; Mal. 1:7, 13; Matt. 23:13; Acts 13:44-45; 1 Thess. 2:15-16.

Q. 110. What are the reasons annexed to the second commandment, the more to enforce it?
A. The reasons annexed to the second commandment, the more to enforce it, contained in these words, For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; and showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments; are, besides God’s sovereignty over us, and propriety in us, his fervent zeal for his own worship, and his revengeful indignation against all false worship, as being a spiritual whoredom; accounting the breakers of this commandment such as hate him, and threatening to punish them into divers generations; and esteeming the observers of it such as love him and keep his commandments, and promising mercy to them unto many generations. Ex. 20:5-6; Ps. 45:11; Rev. 15:3-4; Ex. 34:13-14; 1 Cor. 10:20-22; Jer. 7:18-20; Ezek. 16:26-27; Deut. 32:16-20; Hos. 2:2-4; Deut. 5:29.

AMR

The image was not made by man but by God, this is why it does not violate the second commandment. Just watch the video and then comment.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

The image was not made by man but by God, this is why it does not violate the second commandment. Just watch the video and then comment.

You presume too much here. You tend to swallow quite a bit of things as "facts", then wonder why everyone does not see it your way to the extreme point of declaring anyone who does not agree with you as lacking in discernment. This Turin shroud business is but one example. You are overcome with itching ears.

AMR

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

You presume too much here. You tend to swallow quite a bit of things as "facts", then wonder why everyone does not see it your way to the extreme point of declaring anyone who does not agree with you as lacking in discernment. This Turin shroud business is but one example. You are overcome with itching ears.

AMR

You on the other hand refuse to look at the salient facts of the OP yet believe you can make considered comments and believe that I am the only only who believes in the facts presented in the OP (which you have not looked at) when there are of course the people who made the video who obviously believe it (because they have looked at the facts, unlike you have). And the many millions who also believe as I do, (because they too have looked at the facts, unlike you; again) but you blindly ignore all of them too?

 

[jamie]

You have no idea what you are talking about.

I have seen pictures of the man on the shroud. He does not look like a man who bled to death.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

I have seen pictures of the man on the shroud. He does not look like a man who bled to death.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Watch the video.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

And the many millions who also believe as I do, (because they too have looked at the facts, unlike you; again) but you blindly ignore all of them too?

Millions? Romanists, notwithstanding, of course. :AMR:

AMR

 

[CabinetMaker]

You on the other hand refuse to look at the salient facts of the OP yet believe you can make considered comments and believe that I am the only only who believes in the facts presented in the OP (which you have not looked at) when there are of course the people who made the video who obviously believe it (because they have looked at the facts, unlike you have). And the many millions who also believe as I do, (because they too have looked at the facts, unlike you; again) but you blindly ignore all of them too?

Many millions believe the Earth is flat. They are not correct either.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Millions? Romanists, notwithstanding, of course. :AMR:

AMR

Science has proven the image was made by a powerful burst of plasma energy.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

Many millions believe the Earth is flat. They are not correct either.

Science has proven the image was made by a powerful burst of plasma energy.

 

[CabinetMaker]

Science has proven the image was made by a powerful burst of plasma energy.

I found this article describing how a new plasma based technique could be used to more accurately date the shroud. I haven't found anything that claims the image was definitively caused by a plasma discharge.

 

[WatchmanOnTheWall]

I found this article describing how a new plasma based technique could be used to more accurately date the shroud. I haven't found anything that claims the image was definitively caused by a plasma discharge.

That because you have not watched the video in the OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4c4812XA9A watch from 37:50 (or better still watch all of it).

 

[CabinetMaker]

That because you have not watched the video in the OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4c4812XA9A watch from 37:50 (or better still watch all of it).

The video puts forth a working hypothesis but does not provide proof that coronal discharge is the actual method. It took 24 hours at something like 100kV to produce an image. He stated that the 96-98 range over 24 hours was the only one that worked. Aside from that, the next step is to determine what caused the coronal discharge at the time of Christ. Keep in mind that you are stating that this is scientific proof. TO reach that level you MUST answer all the possible questions about the shroud using science. That means you must prove the coronal discharge happened in the time of Christ.

Now, if this is actually a point of faith for you and not scientific explanation, well, that is entirely different. Do you accept the shroud is the image of Christ based on faith or incomplete science?