ECT Request for Clarity about Judaism and D'ism

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Interplanner

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Jamie wrote:
If Jesus was sitting on David's throne in Zion why does Paul reference Satan as the god of this age?




Jn 12:30:
Now is the time for judgement on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven out. But I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself.

I believe he was saying that the proclamation of his Gospel as the act of judgement of God that justifies sinners at the same time 'drives out Satan.' God is just and justifier, Rom 3. But this has to be proclaimed to the world to have any effect. That is why other messages are powerless, and pose no risk to the person spreading them. The world likes to hear about 'improving your life' etc.

I don't know why it would make any difference to sit on a throne in Jerusalem; what matters is that he is proclaimed as Lord of the universe, resurrected because of what he accomplished, and enthroned in that resurrection.
 
steko

steko

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Interplanner said:
He is enthroned now and it is our job to proclaim to all creation. Acts 2, Eph 1, Col 1. That's what Luke's passages were about.
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The Lord Jesus has been exalted to the right hand of GOD in the Father's throne.

He will sit on His glorious throne, the throne promised to Him, the throne of David at His second coming, as He plainly says:

Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory


As Peter says in Acts 2, He was raised 'to sit' on that throne, the throne of David....Zion/Jerusalem, just as the prophets declare.
 
I

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steko said:
The Lord Jesus has been exalted to the right hand of GOD in the Father's throne.

He will sit on His glorious throne, the throne promised to Him, the throne of David at His second coming, as He plainly says:

Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory


As Peter says in Acts 2, He was raised 'to sit' on that throne, the throne of David....Zion/Jerusalem, just as the prophets declare.
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Yes, he is already seated on it, and Eph 1 is the solid parallel to that. There is nothing futurist about it. Acts 2's message ends with the trimphant '...made Lord and Christ.' There's nothing else to add.
 
SaulToPaul 2

SaulToPaul 2

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Interplanner said:
Yes, he is already seated on it, and Eph 1 is the solid parallel to that. There is nothing futurist about it. Acts 2's message ends with the trimphant '...made Lord and Christ.' There's nothing else to add.
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Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory


Put down the commentaries, believe the Bible.
 
I

Interplanner

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As Rom 1:4 says, Christ was declared with power by the resurrection to be the Son of God. So the resurrection itself has yet another feature in addition to the others in the "core" list.

1:2 says this gospel was promised and known beforehand to the prophets in the Scriptures. This is further indication that it was IT post-exile Judaism that did not know this, even though it was known to the prophets.
 
SaulToPaul 2

SaulToPaul 2

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Interplanner said:
As Rom 1:4 says, Christ was declared with power by the resurrection to be the Son of God. So the resurrection itself has yet another feature in addition to the others in the "core" list.

1:2 says this gospel was promised and known beforehand to the prophets in the Scriptures. This is further indication that it was IT post-exile Judaism that did not know this, even though it was known to the prophets.
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God can promise something in the prophets, and keep it hidden until he is ready to reveal it.
Put down your commentaries.
 
I

Interplanner

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Right Divider said:
The LORD Jesus Christ is NOT sitting on the throne of His father David.

Luke 1:31-33 (AKJV/PCE)​
(1:31) And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. (1:32) He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: (1:33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. ​

Isa 9:7 (AKJV/PCE)​
(9:7) Of the increase of [his] government and peace [there shall be] no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this. ​

He WILL!
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There's not several thrones up there! He is seated and reigning.

Crown him with many crowns! The Lamb upon the throne.

D'ism is grotesquely mistaken, and evaporates the most powerful reason for preaching Christian truth.
 
I

Interplanner

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"God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, thrh faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forebearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished--he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the justifier of him who has faith in Jesus."
--Rom 3

That is the proclamation that is our job. That is the permanent establishment of justice in Christ.
 
SaulToPaul 2

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
"God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, thrh faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forebearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished--he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the justifier of him who has faith in Jesus."
--Rom 3

That is the proclamation that is our job. That is the permanent establishment of justice in Christ.
Click to expand...

Ok. It does not sound like the Great Commission though, does it?
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
Jamie wrote:
If Jesus was sitting on David's throne in Zion why does Paul reference Satan as the god of this age?




Jn 12:30:
Now is the time for judgement on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven out. But I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself.

I believe he was saying that the proclamation of his Gospel as the act of judgement of God that justifies sinners at the same time 'drives out Satan.' God is just and justifier, Rom 3. But this has to be proclaimed to the world to have any effect. That is why other messages are powerless, and pose no risk to the person spreading them. The world likes to hear about 'improving your life' etc.

I don't know why it would make any difference to sit on a throne in Jerusalem; what matters is that he is proclaimed as Lord of the universe, resurrected because of what he accomplished, and enthroned in that resurrection.
Click to expand...




So the Lord of the universe, the judge of all, about whom we see that 'heaven is his throne, and the earth is his footstool,'--this Lord "needs" Jerusalem in Judea to do business?
 
D

Danoh

New member
SaulToPaul said:
And?
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Clearly, he is reading a thing into that passage it is not saying.

At the same time, there is a connection between what Stephen says here...

Acts 7:44 Our fathers had the tabernacle of witness in the wilderness, as he had appointed, speaking unto Moses, that he should make it according to the fashion that he had seen. 7:45 Which also our fathers that came after brought in with Jesus into the possession of the Gentiles, whom God drave out before the face of our fathers, unto the days of David; 7:46 Who found favour before God, and desired to find a tabernacle for the God of Jacob. 7:47 But Solomon built him an house. 7:48 Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, 7:49 Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? 7:50 Hath not my hand made all these things?

And what he then says here...

7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. 7:52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers: 7:53 Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.

What is your take - or anyone else's for that matter - on what that connection is?

For it's not like passages in Scripture each function within their own vaccum, or independently of what their surrounding passages contribute towards better revealing said any one passage's intended meaning.

Nevertheless, Rom. 5:8
 
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