REPORT: Coming Out of the Closet - By Bob Enyart

[Zakath]

Beanieboy,

You're wasting your time. We've been around about that idiot Cameron any number of times here on TOL and, no matter what factual information you present, Enyart's disciples cannot accept anything that disagrees with their master's worldview.

Keep up the effort if you're writing to the lurkers. Just don't expect an Enyartian to change their stripes. I think they only recruit single-minded individuals incapable of entertaining original thought. They get focused on some point or other and they cease to be able to carry on rational conversations.

Oh well. They never said it'd be easy talking to religionists...

 

[Atheist_Divine]

...would like to meet one of these avidly recruiting homosexuals....never seen one yet....

Hmmmm I remember when I was at school, I had one PE (Physical Education, dunno what Americans call it) who was gay, and one who was not. The one who was gay never did a thing and was perfectly nice, the straight one used to touch us all up in swimming lessons.

Not that that particularly proves anything, being as it is just the example of one person (me) with two teachers, but...

~AD~

 

[Projill]

TopJack Here!,
It seems to me that the liberals "squirm" when they are confronted with the sheer utter TRUTH!. Fact: Hebrews 9:27 states: "And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgement,".
I stand with Bob Enyart homosexuals sicken me!. They need our precious Lord and Saviour badly. Because if they don't find His awesome love and forgiveness, they will face a Holy God on judgement day!.
This is your "Final Warning" turn to Jesus Christ before it is too late for you.
That's right! You need a "Final Warning", because it may already be too late for you.

Hahahahaha!

*runs off to join her GLBT buds and share this new little piece of "wisdom"*

 

[Projill]

So anyone that is against Homos is a nazi? The founders of this country and the states made being a homo a crime for a long time are they all nazi?

No, his Big Brother lack of interest in free thought makes him a Nazi. And where in the Constitution does it say "being a homo is a crime"? I missed that part of the Constitution...even when I visited it in D.C.

 

[Projill]

Actually the founders and their peers generally considered sodomy (the sexual act) a crime, not homosexuality.

How about showing us a couple of citations of laws banning homosexuality penned by the founders...

This I've got to see!

No kidding.

 

[Projill]

Beanieboy,

You're wasting your time. We've been around about that idiot Cameron any number of times here on TOL and, no matter what factual information you present, Enyart's disciples cannot accept anything that disagrees with their master's worldview.

Keep up the effort if you're writing to the lurkers. Just don't expect an Enyartian to change their stripes. I think they only recruit single-minded individuals incapable of entertaining original thought. They get focused on some point or other and they cease to be able to carry on rational conversations.

Oh well. They never said it'd be easy talking to religionists...

The Enyartians are forever reminding me of the Borg collective riding around space in a cube.

 

[Projill]

...would like to meet one of these avidly recruiting homosexuals....never seen one yet....

Hmmmm I remember when I was at school, I had one PE (Physical Education, dunno what Americans call it) who was gay, and one who was not. The one who was gay never did a thing and was perfectly nice, the straight one used to touch us all up in swimming lessons.

Not that that particularly proves anything, being as it is just the example of one person (me) with two teachers, but...

~AD~

We have PE here too. I'm fully of the opinion that my PE teacher was a lesbian. She never handled me inappropriately.

 

[KurtPh]

TopJack Here!,
It seems to me that the liberals "squirm" when they are confronted with the sheer utter TRUTH!. Fact: Hebrews 9:27 states: "And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgement,".
I stand with Bob Enyart homosexuals sicken me!. They need our precious Lord and Saviour badly. Because if they don't find His awesome love and forgiveness, they will face a Holy God on judgement day!.
This is your "Final Warning" turn to Jesus Christ before it is too late for you.
That's right! You need a "Final Warning", because it may already be too late for you.

Sorry Kurt but I had to edit out your profane comment - Knight

I do find it interesting that many of those Mr. Enyart accused of being homosexual child molesters also happened to molest girls as well. What, are the male victims more important than the female ones? And before I'm asked to provide examples, I'll admit upfront that I can't recall any specific ones (I haven't listened to Enyart since he left WHRI). One I remember involved a priest in, if my memory serves me, Boston. This guy molested dozens of children over a number of decades. Enyart used him as an example of "dangerous homos." I did a little of my own research, and found that he had molested girls as well. He didn't discriminate between sexes; he targeted children with whom he had contact with.

If Enyart wants to promote his particular agenda, he has obviously learned that the whole truth rarely serves his purposes.

 

[Projill]

Sorry Kurt but I had to edit out your profane comment - Knight

I do find it interesting that many of those Mr. Enyart accused of being homosexual child molesters also happened to molest girls as well. What, are the male victims more important than the female ones? And before I'm asked to provide examples, I'll admit upfront that I can't recall any specific ones (I haven't listened to Enyart since he left WHRI). One I remember involved a priest in, if my memory serves me, Boston. This guy molested dozens of children over a number of decades. Enyart used him as an example of "dangerous homos." I did a little of my own research, and found that he had molested girls as well. He didn't discriminate between sexes; he targeted children with whom he had contact with.

If Enyart wants to promote his particular agenda, he has obviously learned that the whole truth rarely serves his purposes.

*nods* All good charlatans know the score.

 

[firechyld]

Jill: Does it ever bother you how much "GLBT" sounds like a sandwich?

*muses*

 

[denversurvivor]

Actually the founders and their peers generally considered sodomy (the sexual act) a crime, not homosexuality.

How about showing us a couple of citations of laws banning homosexuality penned by the founders...

This I've got to see!

I don't have to quote them some are still on the books and you know it.

When you ban sodomy you ban homos. The same as if you make abortion illegal you make abortionists illegal.

 

[denversurvivor]

Denversurvivor quoth



You misunderstand me, ALL of it is asinine drivel, not only is it self-righteous and homophobic, it very clearly tells us that the webmaster's mind has not yet returned from the holidays!

Kiwimac

Thanks for narrowing it down for me.

 

[denversurvivor]

Re: Re: Coming Out of the Closet

Re: Re: Coming Out of the Closet

Bob Enyart-Homo activists admit that these boys are almost all molested by men. But they absurdly maintain that a man who penetrates a boy is not necessarily committing an act of homosexual molestation.

Beanieboy-Cameron's findings are based on his assumption that all male-male molestations were committed by homosexuals.

I'll leave it up to the reader to figure out the statment that makes more sense.

 

[firechyld]

I don't have to quote them some are still on the books and you know it.

When you ban sodomy you ban homos. The same as if you make abortion illegal you make abortionists illegal.

Not necessarily.

In certain parts of India, it is illegal to engage in anal sex, oral sex or masturbation of another person. Now THERE is somewhere where it's difficult to engage in homosexual activity... although it doesn't necessarily stop one being homosexual.

Many gay men do not engage in "sodomy", in the definition that is widely accepted. The state-to-state US variations on the definitions ban a lot more than anal sex... including a wide range of heterosexual activities.

Homosexuals do not always engage in sodomy. Heterosexuals sometimes do. Banning sodomy does not equate to banning homosexuality.

firechyld

 

[firechyld]

Re: Re: Re: Coming Out of the Closet

Re: Re: Re: Coming Out of the Closet

I'll leave it up to the reader to figure out the statment that makes more sense.

I believe what beanie was trying to convey is that a man who sexually assaults another man is not necessarily homosexual. He is certainly engaging in (for want of a better word... there should be no parallels between consenual sex and an attack) homosexual activity, but that doesn't make him a homosexual.

firechyld

 

[denversurvivor]

Re: Re: Coming Out of the Closet

Re: Re: Coming Out of the Closet

Fine, Denver, if you are too much of a lazy slacker, here:

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_molestation.html

In a 1985 article published in Psychological Reports, Paul Cameron purported to review published data to answer the question, "Do those who commit homosexual acts disproportionately incorporate children into their sexual practices?" (p. 1227). He concluded that "at least one-third of the sexual attacks upon youth are homosexual" (p. 1228) and that "those who are bi- to homosexual are proportionately much more apt to molest youth" than are heterosexuals (p. 1231).

Cameron's findings are based on his assumption that all male-male molestations were committed by homosexuals. Moreover, a careful reading of Cameron's paper reveals several false statements about the literature he claimed to have reviewed.

For example, he cited the Groth and Birnbaum (1978) study mentioned previously as evidencing a 3:2 ratio of "heterosexual" (i.e., female victim) to "homosexual" (i.e., male victim) molestations, and he noted that "54% of all the molestations in this study were performed by bisexual or homosexual practitioners" (p. 1231). However, Groth and Birnbaum reported that none of the men in their sample had an exclusively homosexual adult sexual orientation, and that none of the 22 bisexual men were more attracted to adult males than to adult females. Cameron's 54% statistic does not appear anywhere in the Groth and Birnbaum (1978) article, nor does Cameron explain its derivation.

It also is noteworthy that, although Cameron assumed that all male-male molestations were committed by homosexuals, he assumed that not all male-female molestations were committed by heterosexuals. He incorporated a "bisexual correction" into his data manipulations to increase further his estimate of the risk posed to children by homosexual/bisexual men.

In the latter half of his paper, Cameron considered whether "homosexual teachers have more frequent sexual interaction with their pupils" (p. 1231). Based on 30 instances of sexual contact between a teacher and pupil reported in ten different sources published between 1920 and 1982, Cameron concluded that "a pupil would appear about 90 times more likely to be sexually assaulted by a homosexual practitioner" (p. 1232); the ratio rose to 100 times when Cameron added his bisexual correction.

This ratio is meaningless because no data were obtained concerning the actual sexual orientation of the teachers involved; as before, Cameron assumed that male-male contacts were perpetrated by homosexuals. Furthermore, Cameron's rationale for selecting particular sources appears to have been completely arbitrary. He described no systematic method for reviewing the literature, and apparently never reviewed the voluminous literature on the sexual development of children and adolescents. His final choice of sources appears to have slanted his findings toward what Cameron described as "the relative absence in the scientific literature of heterosexual teacher-pupil sexual events coupled with persistent, albeit infrequent, homosexual teacher-pupil sexual interactions" (p. 1232).

A subsequent paper by Cameron and others (Cameron, Proctor, Coburn, Forde, Larson, & Cameron, 1986) described data collected in a door-to-door survey in seven U.S. cities and towns, and generally repeated the conclusions reached in Cameron (1985). As before, male-male sexual assaults were referred to as "homosexual" molestations (e.g., Abstract, p.327) and the perpetrators' sexual orientation apparently was not assessed. This study also suffers from severe methodological problems (Brown & Cole, 1985). These problems are discussed in detail elsewhere on this site.

In summary, the findings reported in the papers by Cameron et al. cannot be considered valid. The work is too methodologically flawed.

I really don't have time to read posts that are this long. If that means I lose the debate and I can't respond to the effort you put into the response then I'm sorry.

 

[denversurvivor]

Don't homosexuals recruit children and seduce naive adults?
The idea of recruitment is utterly without scientific foundation (Weinberg, 1977) .

I veiwed a videotape of a gay pride parade in DC in which the crowd chanted, "Ten percent is not enough recruit recruit recruit!".

This video was put out by a right wing organization but the crowd was clearly doing this of their own free will. The audio was not overdubbed like a kung-fu movie. The parade goers were saying that.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Firechyld states…

I believe what beanie was trying to convey is that a man who sexually assaults another man is not necessarily homosexual. He is certainly engaging in (for want of a better word... there should be no parallels between consenual sex and an attack) homosexual activity, but that doesn't make him a homosexual.

Well, in my book if a guy engages in a homosexual act, he is a homo!

No matter how you slice it the guy is a sick pervert.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

So far the only real argument being made by the lefties is that not all homosexuals are strict homosexuals and sometimes they prefer both genders. Is that the best argument you can make???

As long as we can agree that all pedophiles should be put to a swift and painful death I would be happy!

Can we at least agree on that????

 

[denversurvivor]

(D)on't expect an Enyartian to change their stripes. I think they only recruit single-minded individuals incapable of entertaining original thought.

The ideas that Bob promotes are certainly not mainstream. Right? So If I agree with an idea waaaay outside the mainstream doesn't that mean I entertain original thought? That doesn't mean he or I are right but it certainly shows I can entertain a thought that is not commonly held.

You also mentioned a resistance to change my mind on an issue. Before I saw Bob's materials I thought very differently. So on some issues I have changed my mind. You could chalk this up to brain washing but the fact remains that I have changed my mind. I still don't believe 100% of what Bob preaches but I think he makes sense on a lot of moral and biblical issues.