Repent and Be Saved

intojoy

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And I doubt anyone's salvation according to the gospel of Paul. The gospel of Jesus yes, it was something else. (Mat. 5:17-19)


Define how the term gospel was used in the first century. It had no religious connotation whatsoever.

It was a military term that was used by a soldier sent back to the city wall to proclaim good news, the enemy has been vanquished and we need not fear any more.

When Yeshua offered the kingdom the news was that it was at hand or within your grasp. If the Jewish people had accepted Yeshua the kingdom would have been instituted then. But the national rejection of the Messiaship of Yeshua based on demon possession (Mt 12) fulfilled this prophecy:

“I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me earnestly.”
**Hosea‬ *5:15‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/hos.5.15.asv
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

I believe onlyrepentance is not enought....Adam broke the covenant and was expeled from gardem and died spiritly and phisicaly as God said...If repentence was enought God could have restore and keep us alive at the moment we repent...

In resume, fixing the covenant is something beyond human abilities, effords or feelings ...Only God can...Jesus did!

God bless!

Yahweh is not like a man to change His mind and, there is no such a thing as "Only repentance" without a change of mind as the Law is concerned. The change and return to the obedience of God's Law is the only true evidence of repentance. God's requirement to observe the covenant made with Adam was to obey by doing the opposite as if in a Catch-22.

The Lord's Catch-22

Ignorance is an abomination in the Lord's sight. When Adam and Eve were forbidden to eat of the tree of knowledge, it was the Lord's catch-22 to rather enhance man's appetite for the tree of knowledge. If the prohibition were to be observed, the fruit of that tree would not have been so enticing and the tree would not have been planted in the center of the garden to call the attention of all. And the Lord would not have employed the services of the serpent to explain that they had misunderstood the command which had been meant to be rather the opposite. As Adam and Eve realized what the Lord really meant, the abomination of ignorance had been neutralized.
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

1 - Define how the term gospel was used in the first century. It had no religious connotation whatsoever.

2 - It was a military term that was used by a soldier sent back to the city wall to proclaim good news, the enemy has been vanquished and we need not fear any more.

3 - When Yeshua offered the kingdom the news was that it was at hand or within your grasp. If the Jewish people had accepted Yeshua the kingdom would have been instituted then. But the national rejection of the Messiaship of Yeshua based on demon possession (Mt 12) fulfilled this prophecy:

4 - “I will go and return to my place, till they acknowledge their offence, and seek my face: in their affliction they will seek me earnestly.”**Hosea‬ *5:15‬ *ASV‬‬

1 - Sorry but I was not around in the First Century. The gospel of Jesus was described in the Tanach, while the gospel of Paul in the NT.

2 - In religious terms, gospel had the connotation of good news of salvation.

3 - There was no such a thing as demon possession as Judaism was concerned.

4 - We could not accept Jesus as the Messiah because the individual is born, lives his span of life and dies. Are we supposed to expect a new Messiah in every generation? Obviously not! The Messiah is not supposed to experience physical death but to remain as a People before the Lord forever. (Jer. 31:35-37) And if you read Prophet Habakkuk 3:13, "The Lord goes forth to save His People; to save His Anointed One. That's what Messiah is, the Anointed One of the Lord aka Israel, the Jewish People. We did accept Jesus for what he really was, the son of Joseph and Mary, a learned Rabbi but as the Messiah, he was not.
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

He could only do it (take our place in His death upon the cross) because He was completely righteous. It is not God lying at all. It is being consistent with what the scriptures reveal, not withholding the truth from you.

The prophets wrote of this and the New Testament shows Jesus prophesying about Himself in this way as well. The event of His death is recorded there. That He brought the new covenant is recorded there as well. Without His death can we say we have the new covenant?

That Jesus brought the New Covenant is not recorded "there." The New Covenant is recorded in Jer. 31:31 with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. Gentiles are not mentioned at all although they are invited to join but according to Isaiah 56:1-8.

Now, please show me which Prophets prophesied about Jesus and you will have made it big with me.

Neither with Jesus' death nor without it, you don't have the New Covenant; you have the NT which is a covenant made with Christians by Paul, not Jesus.
 

egyptianmuslim

New member
No, it is not. If it was important to make sacrifices, Prophet Jeremiah would not have declared that Yahweh never commanded that animal sacrifices be part of the Faith of Israel. (Jer. 7:22) We don't pray to the Lord to repent of our sins. Repentance is an act of freewill. Either we repent or we do not. If the Lord is the one Who causes us to repent, we are acting like a robot and not a human being with Freewill.

Again, I did a sin and I need to repent , how , by praying to God or giving money to poor people to gain repentance /forgiveness of God. what shoud you jews do in the same case?
 

beloved57

Well-known member
That Jesus brought the New Covenant is not recorded "there." The New Covenant is recorded in Jer. 31:31 with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. Gentiles are not mentioned at all although they are invited to join but according to Isaiah 56:1-8.

Now, please show me which Prophets prophesied about Jesus and you will have made it big with me.

Neither with Jesus' death nor without it, you don't have the New Covenant; you have the NT which is a covenant made with Christians by Paul, not Jesus.

What about golden calf worship ? Is that recorded in the scriptures ?
 

Jacob

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Banned
Too bad because, you are again confirming that God was a liar. I have told you already that Jesus was not completely righteous. You either accept that or that Matthew was not telling the truth when he wrote about Jesus as breaking the Golden Rule 15 times only in Mat. 23:13-33. How are you gonna take it as true, that Jesus was a sinner or Matthew was lying?
I have not said God is a liar. You are wanting to think I have done so for some reason. Jesus was completely righteous. When I say this I mean to confirm what the scriptures say.

Isaiah 53:8, 12 NASB - 8 By oppression and judgment He was taken away;And as for His generation, who considered That He was cut off out of the land of the living For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due? ... 12 Therefore, I will allot Him a portion with the great, And He will divide the booty with the strong; Because He poured out Himself to death, And was numbered with the transgressors; Yet He Himself bore the sin of many, And interceded for the transgressors.

Isaiah 53:10 NASB - 10 But the LORD was pleased To crush Him, putting Him to grief; If He would render Himself as a guilt offering, He will see His offspring, He will prolong His days, And the good pleasure of the LORD will prosper in His hand.

Hebrews 4:15 NASB - 15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.

1 Peter 3:18 NASB - 18 For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;
That Jesus brought the New Covenant is not recorded "there." The New Covenant is recorded in Jer. 31:31 with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. Gentiles are not mentioned at all although they are invited to join but according to Isaiah 56:1-8.

Now, please show me which Prophets prophesied about Jesus and you will have made it big with me.

Neither with Jesus' death nor without it, you don't have the New Covenant; you have the NT which is a covenant made with Christians by Paul, not Jesus.
Psalm 22:16-18 NASB - 16 For dogs have surrounded me; A band of evildoers has encompassed me; They pierced my hands and my feet. 17 I can count all my bones.They look, they stare at me; 18 They divide my garments among them, And for my clothing they cast lots.

Jeremiah 31:31 NASB - 31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,

Luke 22:20 NASB - 20 And in the same way He took the cup after they had eaten, saying, "This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in My blood.
 

oatmeal

Well-known member
Repent and Be Saved

I was told by a Christian the other day that repentance was by necessity vital to the achievement of salvation. I spent some time chewing that cud till the Lord sent me a revelation in terms of a definition. Now, go back to the Christian that made you chew that cud and let him know that repentance is true and necessary but not as sacrifice is concerned.

Repentance is a clear evidence that Jesus did not sacrifice himself so that the sinner should take salvation for granted. If Jesus had sacrificed himself with that purpose, no one would need to repent of sins that had already been forgiven by the sacrifice of Jesus. IOW, to teach repentance in spite of Jesus' sacrifice would be a contradictory move.

Since no one is allowed to sacrifice himself for the sins of another, repentance is back by necessity because responsibility is back with the sinner. (Jer. 31:30; Ezek. 18:20)

To repent is to have a change of heart.

If you are happy with all your past sins and decide you like sin and decide to continue to sin, then although your sins were paid for, the as Hebrews says, you crucify Christ afresh.

We are not to confess our sins but the savior from sin we are no longer to be lord of our lives but

as Romans 10:9-10 states "confess with your mouth the lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead"

that is repentance, a change of heart.

For before that you were lord of your life and you did not believe that God raised him from the dead. That is what it takes to receive the gift of salvation.

Just like holding out two hands to receive a gift you did not earn, there are two conditions to receive the gift of salvation you did not earn, nor could ever earn
 

sfontel

New member
Yahweh is not like a man to change His mind and, there is no such a thing as "Only repentance" without a change of mind as the Law is concerned. The change and return to the obedience of God's Law is the only true evidence of repentance. God's requirement to observe the covenant made with Adam was to obey by doing the opposite as if in a Catch-22.

The Lord's Catch-22

Ignorance is an abomination in the Lord's sight. When Adam and Eve were forbidden to eat of the tree of knowledge, it was the Lord's catch-22 to rather enhance man's appetite for the tree of knowledge. If the prohibition were to be observed, the fruit of that tree would not have been so enticing and the tree would not have been planted in the center of the garden to call the attention of all. And the Lord would not have employed the services of the serpent to explain that they had misunderstood the command which had been meant to be rather the opposite. As Adam and Eve realized what the Lord really meant, the abomination of ignorance had been neutralized.
For me the tree is more simple, just a way to estabilish free will...

I believe the law only appers at Moses time according to the scriputure...

So if the if repentence is based on the law, how did Job, Noah...and many others repent with out the law? Or how they were saved?

I think you may have to do some more thinking!

God bless and merry Christimas!
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

Again, I did a sin and I need to repent , how , by praying to God or giving money to poor people to gain repentance /forgiveness of God. what shoud you jews do in the same case?

Repentance is not a reward granted to the sinner but an act of Freewill. If we sin and trust that the Lord will grant us with repentance, we will get so addicted to sin and we will never repent. The urge to set things right with Yahweh so that our sins from scarlet red become as white as snow, it must arise in our own hearts. We are not to expect that the Lord will do it for us. He did His already when He granted us with the attribute of Freewill.
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

1 - I have not said God is a liar. You are wanting to think I have done so for some reason.

2 - Jesus was completely righteous. When I say this I mean to confirm what the scriptures say.

3 - Isaiah 53:8, 12 NASB - 8 By oppression and judgment He was taken away;And as for His generation, who considered That He was cut off out of the land of the living For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due? ... 12 Therefore, I will allot Him a portion with the great, And He will divide the booty with the strong; Because He poured out Himself to death, And was numbered with the transgressors;

4 - Yet He Himself bore the sin of many, And interceded for the transgressors.

5 - Isaiah 53:10 NASB - 10 But the LORD was pleased To crush Him, putting Him to grief; If He would render Himself as a guilt offering, He will see His offspring, He will prolong His days, And the good pleasure of the LORD will prosper in His hand.

6 - Hebrews 4:15 NASB - 15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.

7 - 1 Peter 3:18 NASB - 18 For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;
Psalm 22:16-18 NASB - 16 For dogs have surrounded me; A band of evildoers has encompassed me; They pierced my hands and my feet. 17 I can count all my bones.They look, they stare at me; 18 They divide my garments among them, And for my clothing they cast lots.

8 - Jeremiah 31:31 NASB - 31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,

9 - Luke 22:20 NASB - 20 And in the same way He took the cup after they had eaten, saying, "This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in My blood.

1 - You have implied based on Christian preconceived notions.

2 - What the Scriptures say is that, "There has never been a man upon earth to have done only good and never sinned." Jesus was a man upon earth. Was the writer of Ecclesiastes lying?

3 - Isaiah was from the city of Tecoa in Judah. A Judahite therefore. His people was the People of Judah. He was reporting about Israel who had been cut off from the Land of Israel for the sins of Isaiah's People aka Judah for whom the stroke was due. The stroke of Divine rejection if you read Psalm 78:67-70.

4 - Yet, he aka Israel, bore the sins of many aka Judah, and not of the whole world which Christians claim Jesus did.

5 - The Lord pleased to crush Israel because by crushing Israel, Judah would remain forever as a single People in Jerusalem before the Lord. (Psalm 78:67-70)

6 - What does it mean, that we don't need to repent of our sins? If we don't need to repent of our sins, Jesus had no need to get sacrificed for our sins.

7 - This is a doctrine from the gospel of Paul. Peter could not write books. (Acts 4:13)

8 - And Gentiles are welcome to join the New Covenant if they want.

9 - And this was written by a Greek man disciple of Paul. Therefore, not Jewish.
 

Jacob

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Banned
1 - You have implied based on Christian preconceived notions.

2 - What the Scriptures say is that, "There has never been a man upon earth to have done only good and never sinned." Jesus was a man upon earth. Was the writer of Ecclesiastes lying?

3 - Isaiah was from the city of Tecoa in Judah. A Judahite therefore. His people was the People of Judah cut off from the Land of Israel for the sins of my People aka Judah for whom the stroke was due. The stroke of Divine rejection if you read Psalm 78:67-70.

4 - Yet, he aka Israel, bore the sins of many aka Judah, and not of the whole world which Christians claim Jesus did.

5 - The Lord pleased to crush Israel because by crushing Israel, Judah would remain forever as a single People in Jerusalem before the Lord forever. (Psalm 78:67-70)

6 - What does it mean, that we don't need to repent of our sins? And, if we don't need to repent of our sins, Jesus had no need to get sacrifices for our sins.

7 - This is a doctrine from the gospel of Paul. Peter could not write books.

8 - And Gentiles are welcome to join the New Covenant if they want.

9 - And this was written by a Greek man disciple of Paul. Therefore, not Jewish.

1, I am Jewish and Christian both by choice. I have not implied that God is a liar.

2, It was true when it was written of all who had lived up to that point in time.

3, Here is what the verses you refer to say.

Psalm 78
67 He also rejected the tent of Joseph,
And did not choose the tribe of Ephraim,
68 But chose the tribe of Judah,
Mount Zion which He loved.
69 And He built His sanctuary like the heights,
Like the earth which He has founded forever.
70 He also chose David His servant
And took him from the sheepfolds;

4, John 1
29 The next day he saw Jesus coming to him and said, “Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

Acts 5
31 “He is the one whom God exalted to His right hand as a Prince and a Savior, to grant repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Acts 11
18 When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, “Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life.”

2 Timothy 2
25 with gentleness correcting those who are in opposition, if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth,

5, This is a Jewish interpretation, but not the only one.

6, Each and every one of us needs to repent of our sins. If you have confessed your sin your sin will be forgiven. See 1 John 1.

7, Peter and Paul are not the only NT authors.

8, This can only be true of the new covenant that has already come to be in Jesus Christ.

9, The NT is entirely Jewish. You can read it for yourself. There is no crime against God in doing so. Any person may need to understand the old testament or the old covenant first.

John 5
39 “You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;

2 Corinthians 3
15 But to this day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies over their heart;
16 but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

Luke 16
29 “But Abraham *said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’
30 “But he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent!’
31 “But he said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’”

Luke 24
27 Then beginning with Moses and with all the prophets, He explained to them the things concerning Himself in all the Scriptures.

John 1
45 Philip found Nathanael and said to him, “We have found Him of whom Moses in the Law and also the Prophets wrote—Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.”

John 5
45 “ Do not think that I will accuse you before the Father; the one who accuses you is Moses, in whom you have set your hope.
46 “For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me, for he wrote about Me.
47 “But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?”
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Forgiveness is for past sins;
That's not true! THINK! All of our sins were in the future when Christ died for them (Romans 4:25 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV)/ when we were forgiven ALL trespasses (Colossians 2:13 KJV)!

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
That's not true! THINK! All of our sins were in the future when Christ died for them (Romans 4:25 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV)/ when we were forgiven ALL trespasses (Colossians 2:13 KJV)!

2 Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

False teaching, many people are under God's condemnation and wrath John Jn 3:18,36 so they are not reconciled to God !
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

1 - To repent is to have a change of heart.

2 - If you are happy with all your past sins and decide you like sin and decide to continue to sin, then although your sins were paid for, the as Hebrews says, you crucify Christ afresh.

3 - We are not to confess our sins but the savior from sin we are no longer to be lord of our lives but as Romans 10:9-10 states "confess with your mouth the lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead" that is repentance, a change of heart.

4 - For before that you were lord of your life and you did not believe that God raised him from the dead. That is what it takes to receive the gift of salvation.

5 - Just like holding out two hands to receive a gift you did not earn, there are two conditions to receive the gift of salvation you did not earn, nor could ever earn

1 - I couldn't agree with you more.

2 - That reminds me of Paul who grew up amoral; he got so addicted to immorality that, when he became familiar with the Law, what seemed not to be sinful, wrought all manner of concupiscence in him that he felt as someone condemned to death. (Rom. 7:8,9)

3 - We confess our sins when we acknowledge that we have sinned. And we set things right with God when we commit ourselves to change our behave by returning to the obedience of God's Law. (Isa. 1:18,19) Believing a doctrine which was not according to the Faith of Jesus, means nothing as repentance is concerned.

4 - What takes to received the gift of salvation comes from the Jews and not from adding a doctrine that goes against the Word of God. (John 4:22)

5 - Nothing is free except for universal salvation. To enjoy personal salvation, we must work for it through obedience of the laws. No one can do it for us. (Jeremiah 31:30 and Ezekiel 18:20)
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

1 - For me the tree is more simple, just a way to estabilish free will...

2 - I believe the law only appers at Moses time according to the scriputure...

3 - So if the if repentence is based on the law, how did Job, Noah...and many others repent with out the law? Or how they were saved?

4 - I think you may have to do some more thinking!

God bless and merry Christimas!

1 - For me too. Nothing is literal about the Genesis account of Creation.

2 - Now, you are mistaken because, according to Jesus in his parable of the Richman and Lazarus, he implied that the only way to escape hell-fire is by listening to "Moses" aka the Law.(Luke 16:29-31)

3 - The Law is in existence from the beginning before man was formed from the earth only waiting to be revealed by the saints of the Most High.

4 - I almost can't do any thing else but.
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

I am Jewish and Christian both by choice. I have not implied that God is a liar.

There is no such a thing as a hyphenated Jew. One is either a Jew or a Christian. A Jewish-Christian or a Christian Jew; "Jews-for-Jesus" or a "Messianic-Jew" are all akin to the "Jews-for-Baal of the time of Elijah always straddling the issue between Yahweh and Baal. (I Kings 18:21)
 
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Jacob

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Banned
There is no such a thing as a hyphenated Jew. One is either a Jew or a Christian. A Jewish-Christian or a Christian Jew; "Jews-for-Jesus" or a "Messianic-Jew" are all akin to the "Jews-for-Baal of the time of Elijah simply straddling the issue between Yahweh and Baal. (I Kings 18:21)
I was born neither a Jew nor a Christian. I became a Christian before I came to identify as Jewish. I don't identify with Jews for Jesus. I am not a Messianic Jew as I was not born a Jew. I don't think there is such a thing as a Messianic Gentile. I do believe Yeshua to be the Messiah. I am circumcised, I observe the Ten Commandments and the Holy Days of Torah and other Jewish things in addition to maintaining a Biblically kosher diet.
 

Ben Masada

New member
Repent and Be Saved.

Repent and Be Saved.

I was born neither a Jew nor a Christian. I became a Christian before I came to identify as Jewish. I don't identify with Jews for Jesus. I am not a Messianic Jew as I was not born a Jew. I don't think there is such a thing as a Messianic Gentile. I do believe Yeshua to be the Messiah. I am circumcised, I observe the Ten Commandments and the Holy Days of Torah and other Jewish things in addition to maintaining a Biblically kosher diet.

The definition of Messiah in Greek is "Christ". If you believe Jesus was the Messiah, you are a Christian. Circumcision is not what makes a Jew out of a man but conviction and commitment. If you observed the Ten Commandments, you would not be a disciple of Paul who said that his disciples were released from the Law. (Rom. 7:6) And mind you, the Law of the Ten Commandments aka the Decalogue.
 
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