Redskins

[Catholic Crusader]

Because it reflects an assumption of privilege by other white people to define other groups for them. I don't want to live in a society made up of white men looking out at the world and imposing their view of everyone else, which is why every time Daniel Snyder describes how he sees the name of the team that he runs, it bothers me.

What color are YOU ??

Pinkish.

I'm actually just about as white as is possible. I've had tests done.

Its fascinating that white people in America like you are the only people who attack their own race, lay the blame of everything on their own race, and almost seem to be embarrassed of their own race. Every other race celebrates their race, has special clubs and celebrations and groups for their race... ...only whites like you seem to loathe themselves. Its pathetic.

 

[rexlunae]

Its fascinating that white people in America like you are the only people who attack their own race, lay the blame of everything on their own race, and almost seem to be embarrassed of their own race.

We are the dominant race in this country at the moment.

Every other race celebrates their race, has special clubs and celebrations and groups for their race... ...only whites like you seem to loathe themselves. Its pathetic.

I don't loathe the white race, that's the overlay you place on my words. I am repulsed when members of the white race (or any race, really, but see above) reduce the members of another race to a caricature, such as this:

“Washington Redskins is more than a name we have called our football team for over eight decades. It is a symbol of everything we stand for: strength, courage, pride, and respect -- the same values we know guide Native Americans and which are embedded throughout their rich history as the original Americans.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...670ba0-30fe-11e3-8627-c5d7de0a046b_story.html

This places a white man, along with the organization he runs, in the position of telling the world what it means to be a "Redskin", and in so-doing, dilutes their own self-identification. And if we are honest with ourselves, I think we would admit that it is a little bit self-serving. The history of white men in this country is not one of honoring those supposedly positive aspects of Native Americans, so it rings a little hollow now to say that that is what we are doing with the word. Isn't it really true that sports teams like to use these references because it connotes in many minds a savagery that they would like to borrow from in the context of games of physical prowess, but we aren't allowed to acknowledge that because it would be tantamount to admitting the racism underlying the name? (See also, "Fighting" Irish, Vikings)

 

[Catholic Crusader]

^ I'll bet you're one of those people who thinks that if black students want to have a black student union that's okay, and if hispanic students want to have a hispanic student union that's okay, and if white students want to have a white student union that's racist.

Am I right?

 

[resurrected]

Because it reflects an assumption of privilege by other white people to define other groups for them. I don't want to live in a society made up of white men looking out at the world and imposing their view of everyone else, which is why every time Daniel Snyder describes how he sees the name of the team that he runs, it bothers me .

so be bothered :idunno:


but why expect anybody to care about your silly feelings?

 

[Town Heretic]

Do you think howls would go up if The team proposed changing its name to the Washington Blacks?

I don't think that's on the same page. The Washington Spear Chuckers, the Washington Spics, Dagos, etc. Those would be of a kind.

Sticks and stones may break my bones, but for pansies just use words.

And kids run to attempts at emasculation when challenged by a point that merits substantive response. He made a decent point. It shouldn't pain you to note it and respond.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

.......It shouldn't pain you to note it and respond.

Here's mine:

This thread is stupid,
this subject is stupid,
people who snivel and cry about the team name are stupid,
and liberals are stupid.

There ya' go.

 

[Town Heretic]

Here's mine:
This thread is stupid,
this subject is stupid,
people who snivel and cry about the team name are stupid,
and liberals are stupid.

Nothing quite says "I get what's going on here" quite like negaively dismissing and stereotyping a minority.

Thanks for illustrating the problem.

 

[resurrected]

Do you think howls would go up if The team proposed changing its name to the Washington Blacks?

I don't think that's on the same page.

that's because you're a retard

The Washington Spear Chuckers, the Washington Spics, Dagos, etc. Those would be of a kind.

only if you can find african-american teams or hispanic teams using those names


otherwise, the "kind" they're of is retarded


like you


kind of retarded

 

[Eeset]

I vote that they change the team name to Washington lobbyists. Maybe then they can buy a few wins.

 

[rexlunae]

^ I'll bet you're one of those people who thinks that if black students want to have a black student union that's okay, and if hispanic students want to have a hispanic student union that's okay, and if white students want to have a white student union that's racist.

Am I right?

I think that there's a stronger case to make in the US for a black student union or a hispanic student union than there is for a white student union. People who are excluded from full access to the benefits of society often need a safe space apart from the dominant group that is dedicated to their interests. Whereas if the dominant group, white males in the case of the US, sets up an exclusionary organization, it only serves to reinforce the structural injustice of the society.

But no, I don't see any of these as productive presently. My ideal society has no such things, nor a need for them.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

^ I'll bet you're one of those people who thinks that if black students want to have a black student union that's okay, and if hispanic students want to have a hispanic student union that's okay, and if white students want to have a white student union that's racist.

Am I right?

I think that there's a stronger case to make in the US for a black student union or a hispanic student union than there is for a white student union............

Case? Case Shmase. Its about kids of like background wanting to have their own group.

You are the exact thing you complain about: A Racist. Except in your case you are racist against your own race. But you are racist all the same because you are cool with racism with some groups and angry about it with others. That makes you a racist AND a hypocrite.

 

[rexlunae]

Case? Case Shmase. Its about kids of like background wanting to have their own group.

You are the exact thing you complain about: A Racist. Except in your case you are racist against your own race. But you are racist all the same because you are cool with racism with some groups and angry about it with others. That makes you a racist AND a hypocrite.

Nice dodge. It sure is easy to dismiss an argument when you snip its main body.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

Here's mine:

This thread is stupid,
this subject is stupid,
people who snivel and cry about the team name are stupid,
and liberals are stupid.

There ya' go.

Nothing quite says "I get what's going on here" quite like negaively dismissing and stereotyping a minority.

Thanks for illustrating the problem.

And nothing says "I'm a liberal" like you taking my words and twisting them into me being negative about a minority.

I like Indians, I have no problem with them, and most of them have no problem with the team's name. So the real question is, what's your beef?

You know, I am half Italian and half Irish and I have heard every joke and name in the book and I laugh it off. You know why? Because that stuff does not identify who and what I am , and also because I'm not a sniveler. You have to be a real small insecure person to worry about petty crap like that.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

^ I'll bet you're one of those people who thinks that if black students want to have a black student union that's okay, and if hispanic students want to have a hispanic student union that's okay, and if white students want to have a white student union that's racist.

Am I right?

I think that there's a stronger case to make in the US for a black student union or a hispanic student union than there is for a white student union............

Case? Case Shmase. Its about kids of like background wanting to have their own group.

You are the exact thing you complain about: A Racist. Except in your case you are racist against your own race. But you are racist all the same because you are cool with racism with some groups and angry about it with others. That makes you a racist AND a hypocrite.

Nice dodge. It sure is easy to dismiss an argument when you snip its main body.

What dodge. I didn't dodge anything. I called you out for exactly what you are. Any intelligent person can read the string of quotes I have quoted and see that I told it like it is, plain and simple.

You are cool with racism against whites but not cool with racism from whites. If you were really against racism you'd be against ALL racism. But your not, which means all the crap you have been posting is worthless.

 

[rexlunae]

What dodge. I didn't dodge anything.

You dodged the explanation of why it is more reasonable to have an organization dedicated to the interests of a disadvantaged minority group than it is to have one dedicated to the majority group. If you ignore that, you won't ever understand.

I called you out for exactly what you are. Any intelligent person can read the string of quotes I have quoted and see that I told it like it is, plain and simple.

How would you know what any intelligent person could do?

Tell me this: Why do you think the NAACP was founded, and what purpose does it serve?

You are cool with racism against whites but not cool with racism from whites. If you were really against racism you'd be against ALL racism. But your not, which means all the crap you have been posting is worthless.

Organizing to guard the interests of a disadvantaged group is not racism. It is a too-often-necessary response to racism. You glossed over the fact that I said that I preferred a society that has no need of such organizations.

 

[Catholic Crusader]

You dodged the explanation of why it is more reasonable to have an organization dedicated to the interests of a disadvantaged minority group than it is to have one dedicated to the majority group..................

Thats ridiculous. Kids make groups to make groups. When I was in high school, do you think black kids had a black student union to "have an organization dedicated to the interests of a disadvantaged minority group"? Or did they have one to hang with their own kind and their own friends..

Good grief man, the question was stupid, that's why I didn't answer it.

 

[rexlunae]

Thats ridiculous. Kids make groups to make groups. When I was in high school, do you think black kids had a black student union to "have an organization dedicated to the interests of a disadvantaged minority group"?

We aren't talking about how kids pick who they play with on the playground here.

Or did they have one to hang with their own kind and their own friends..

Your desire to avoid pointed questions is understandable, but inexcusable. What do you think the purpose of the NAACP was and is?

Good grief man, the question was stupid, that's why I didn't answer it.

I'm sure that's why you dodged very clear, very specific questions, despite the fact that I humored you and answered your ridiculous question earlier.

 

[shagster01]

And kids run to attempts at emasculation when challenged by a point that merits substantive response. He made a decent point. It shouldn't pain you to note it and respond.

You said 1 in 10 Native Americans are offended. He said those who are offended want the word to disappear.

1/10th of 2% of the population wanting a word to disappear is not a decent point.

 

[shagster01]

I find the term "Native American" to be offensive. I am a native of America, yet not referred to as such simply because of the color of my skin. If they are going to categorize me for the color of my skin then I suggest I be called a whiteskin and they be called redskins to eliminate confusion as to where I am from.

After all their ancestors migrated here at some point same as mine.

 

[resurrected]

i'm a native american

i was born and raised in america

as were my parents

and their parents

and their parents

and their parents

etc