Public Schools Aren't Broken. Destroying Children is what they were designed to do.

Crucible

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The problem with public schools is the hypocrisy therein. People say religion and such shouldn't be in schools, but the same people also slip politically correct, liberal bias under the table. And also, that 'Common Core' crap. Give me a break :rolleyes:

People are way too concerned about other people's children, that's all I have to say. If I'm able to afford it, I won't have my children in the public school system.
 

Angel4Truth

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The problem with public schools is the hypocrisy therein. People say religion and such shouldn't be in schools, but the same people also slip politically correct, liberal bias under the table. And also, that 'Common Core' crap. Give me a break :rolleyes:

People are way too concerned about other people's children, that's all I have to say. If I'm able to afford it, I won't have my children in the public school system.

Because of some of the things youve said about either a wife being forced to have sex, or having a brick shoved in her face, i would be concerned about your children also.
 

Crucible

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Because of some of the things youve said about either a wife being forced to have sex, or having a brick shoved in her face, i would be concerned about your children also.

Oh, whatever. My opinions are based in a reason and logic only a real man can deliver. I don't buy into you and others run of the mill mope fests, jumping on the bandwagon of this whistle blowing, reactionary society we live in.

What kind of person who claims to be Christian and enjoys the fruits of spirit sit there with pompousness and disdain alongside the rest of Godless society..
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
Except that wasn't our Founding Fathers original intent. But if we get to talking about the Founding Fathers you and your fellow secular humanists will start using words like "deists" and "slave owners", i.e. displaying your ignorance our of nation's Christian forefathers.

On cue, secular humanist jgarden gives us a lesson in secular humanist history:

Many of the Founding Fathers were not Christians but deists - in an age where the Church was closely aligned with the State why is there no mention of religion in the Constitution?

The founding documents prior to the Constitution already established where our rights come from: God

The Constitution itself is formatted on Biblical doctrine, so much for your knowledge of American history.
Once again "a CultureWarrior" is inventing his own "self-serving" myths - this time about American education!

(How come jgarden always refers to me in the 3rd person? My dad taught me to look a man straight in the eye when addressing him).

One of the strengths of America has been its access to a public education system whereby every citizen has an opportunity to be literate, and come to their own conclusions,...

And be indoctrinated by a secular humanist agenda.
 

jgarden

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“Religious controversies are always productive of more acrimony and irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause. Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by the difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought most to be depreciated. I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age, would at least have reconciled Christians of every denomination so far that we should never again see the religious disputes carried to such a pitch as to endanger the peace of society.”
- George Washington

“Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise.”
- James Madison — Letter to Wm. Bradford, April 1, 1774

“The civil government functions with complete success by the total separation of the Church from the State.”
- Founding Father James Madison, 1819, Writings, 8:432,

This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it.”
- John Adams

“The Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”
- 1797 Treaty of Tripoli signed by Founding Father John Adams

“Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, then that of blindfolded fear.”
- Founding Father Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr, August 10, 1787

“The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries.”
James Madison — 1803 letter objecting use of gov. land for churches

”I am for freedom of religion and against all maneuvers to bring about a legal ascendancy of one sect over another.”
- Founding Father Thomas Jefferson — letter to Elbridge Gerry, January 26, 1799

“I have generally been denominated a Deist, the reality of which I never disputed, being conscious I am no Christian, except mere infant baptism makes me one; and as to being a Deist, I know not strictly speaking, whether I am one or not.”
- Ethan Allen, Revolutionary War Hero — preface, Reason the Only Oracle of Man

“Of all the tyrannies that affect mankind, tyranny in religion is the worst.”
- Thomas Paine

“There is not one redeeming feature in our superstition of Christianity. It has made one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites.”
- Thomas Jefferson

“I looked around for God’s judgments, but saw no signs of them.”
- Ben Franklin

“It is the fable of Jesus Christ, as told in the New Testament, and the wild and visionary doctrine raised thereon, against which I contend. The story, taking it as it is told, is blasphemously obscene.”
- Thomas Paine

http://www.liberalamerica.org/2014/...-quotes-that-will-enrage-the-religious-right/
 
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aCultureWarrior

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88 out of context quotes vs 1,062 pages of documented US History.

BKH-5708.jpg


When we take back our public schools jgarden (and believe me, we will), the above book will be required reading.
 

jgarden

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The fact remains that the separation of Church and State has always been a basic principle in America - so how does "aCultureWarrior's" "1,062 pages of documented US History" explain this anomaly if the majority of the Founding Fathers were opposed?

But as we all know, "aCultureWarrior" has no interest in the facts.
 

aCultureWarrior

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The fact remains that the separation of Church and State has always been a basic principle in America - so how does "aCultureWarrior's" "1,062 pages of documented US History" explain this anomaly if the majority of the Founding Fathers were opposed?

But as we all know, "aCultureWarrior" has no interest in the facts.

I'd be very much interested in going one on one with you* over the topic of our nation's Christian heritage.

*You can bring along the godless ACLU attorney of your choice for backup.

And that's a fact.
 

jgarden

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I'd be very much interested in going one on one with you* over the topic of our nation's Christian heritage.

*You can bring along the godless ACLU attorney of your choice for backup.

And that's a fact.
What is interesting is that "äCultureWarrior" has no answer to reconcile why the Founding Fathers established the principle of separation of Church and State, if they were as he contends, all motivated by Christian beliefs!

“Congress has no power to make any religious establishments.”
- Roger Sherman, Congress, August 19, 1789

“The civil government functions with complete success by the total separation of the Church from the State.”
- James Madison, 1819, Writings, 8:432, quoted from Gene Garman, Essays In Addition to America’s Real Religion?

“And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.”
- James Madison — letter to Edward Livingston, July 10, 1822

“The Government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”
- 1797 Treaty of Tripoli signed by Founding Father John Adams

“Every new and successful example of a perfect separation between ecclesiastical and civil matters is of importance.
- James Madison — letter, 1822
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
I'd be very much interested in going one on one with you* over the topic of our nation's Christian heritage.

*You can bring along the godless ACLU attorney of your choice for backup.

And that's a fact.


What is interesting is that "äCultureWarrior" has no answer to reconcile why the Founding Fathers established the principle of separation of Church and State, if they were as he contends, all motivated by Christian beliefs!

Private message me when you're ready to go one on one on.

Oh and jgarden, I don't take prisoners ;) .
 

aCultureWarrior

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Would it make you feel better if it was said that those that control the school are doing exactly what they want to do?

What would really make me feel better Nick would be if Christians, instead of fighting over doctrinal differences between the various denominations out there, would get involved in the political process and amongst other things take back our once great public school system. And yes, I said once great, because at one time it was the very best in the world.
 

zoo22

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What would really make me feel better Nick would be if Christians, instead of fighting over doctrinal differences between the various denominations out there, would get involved in the political process and amongst other things take back our once great public school system. And yes, I said once great, because at one time it was the very best in the world.

aCW is consumed by the "oh woe, back in the the good old days" delusion.

But the idea that the United States once was a world leader in elementary and secondary education, while a compelling part of our belief system, is false. We never ranked #1. We can’t get back to the head of the class because we never were the head of the class.

In fact, we always have scored at, or near, the bottom of the rankings.

Full article: Why U.S. can’t get back to head of the class (because it was never there)
 

aCultureWarrior

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Quote:
Originally Posted by aCultureWarrior
What would really make me feel better Nick would be if Christians, instead of fighting over doctrinal differences between the various denominations out there, would get involved in the political process and amongst other things take back our once great public school system. And yes, I said once great, because at one time it was the very best in the world.


aCW is consumed by the "oh woe, back in the the good old days" delusion.

You know zoo, back in the good ole days before 58 million unborn babies were murdered in the womb. Back in the good ole days before children were getting genital mutilation surgery to pretend that they're of the opposite sex. You know zoo, those "good ole days".

Regarding your biased article from that left wing smut rag the Washington Post:

Fragmented evidence suggests that American schools demanded much more of their students in the 19th Century and early in the 20th Century. Examine, for example, these historic New York State Regents exams in mathematics. But we have no systematic comparative data about what other countries were requiring in those earlier eras.

So the God-hating liberals at the WA Post acknowledge that American schools excelled, but since there is no systematic comparative data, it really didn't.

The God-hating liberals at the WA PO go onto say:

In 1965, the Association for the Evaluation of Educational Achievement (IEA) conducted a study of mathematical achievement in 12 countries...

The IEA conducted an international assessment of mathematics during the 1981-82 school year...

The decline started AFTER God/prayer was removed from public schools:

Madalyn Murray O'Hair was an outspoken advocate of atheism and the founder of the organization American Atheists.

In 1960 O'Hair gained notoriety when she sued Baltimore public schools for requiring students to read from the Bible and to recite the Lord's Prayer at school exercises. Bible reading and prayer recitation were common in schools across the nation, and children were excused from the practice if they supplied a note from their parents. But O'Hair argued that the practice violated the First Amendment rights of her and her son as professed atheists "in that it threatens their religious liberty by placing a premium on belief as against non-belief and subjects their freedom of conscience to the rule of the majority; it pronounces belief in God as the source of all moral and spiritual values, equating these values with religious values, and thereby renders sinister, alien and suspect the beliefs and ideals of your Petitioners, promoting doubt and question of their morality, good citizenship and good faith."

The case reached the Supreme Court where it was joined to another similar case and tried as Abington School District v. Schempp. In 1963, the court ruled 8-1 in favor of the plaintiffs. The decision effectively ended Bible reading and prayer recitation in public schools.
http://www.pbs.org/godinamerica/people/madalyn-murray-ohair.html

Oh and zoo: thank your fellow God-haters at the Washington Post for proving my point.
 
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jgarden

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The invitation is extended to all secular humanists (you, WizardofOz, jgarden, whoever wants to expose their ignorance) who seem to think they know about our Founding Fathers and their beliefs.

Oh and Jonahdog, if you should take me up on my invitation:

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/Take+No+Prisoners
I am not, and never was, a secular humanist but I am aware of "a CultureWarrior's" not so subtle attempts to stereotype his opposition, divert attention and/or change the subject when he is "cornered" and exhausted his library of tired "stock phrases!"

I have no interest in a private debate with "äCultureWarrior" who has little or no regard for the facts - if I were to engage in such a discussion I would choose an open forum where he can exercise his "I don't take prisoners" to a wider audience!
 

jgarden

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Would it make you feel better if it was said that those that control the school are doing exactly what they want to do?
"Nick M" will only be satisfied with a school system that "molds" its students to think just like him - graduating class after class of Nick M "clones!"
 
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