Poll: Do you agree with this picture?

[musterion]

Yes, it was. You then asked if she even knew what she made fun of. She said something like "Nope, surely don't."

But I do not see that it was sister Heir and I know for a FACT that she would never make fun of such. She doesn't make fun of most things, matter of fact.

 

[musterion]

Sorry, didn't see your apology. Ignore that.

Gonna go watch the Brexit fail, sadly.

 

[heir]

What is the Gospel

Gospel equals good news. The gospel of YOUR salvation is the word of truth (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV). It is the means by which we are saved as Paul declared and upon trusting the Lord believing it, sealed too(Ephesians 1:13-14 KJV)! Are you saved and sealed?

 

[heir]

Yes, you are a lunatic if you call yourself a dispensationalist and think that the gospel is not in Romans 10

Where in Romans 10:9-10 KJV do we see "that Christ died for our sins"? It's not there because Paul was not addressing the Body of Christ there. Romans chapters 9, 10 and 11 are a microcosm of Israel's past, present and future. It was all about Israel there and not the gospel of Christ that Paul declared in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV

or that there is some weird third gospel that Paul taught in Romans separate and apart from what he taught elsewhere

The gospel of Christ was the gospel that Paul preached to the Romans as the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek (Romans 1:16 KJV) for therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith:...(Romans 1:17 KJV). There was no "weird third gospel" preached to the Romans by Paul.

or that there is any disagreement or any other sort of disconnect or conflict between anything written in Romans vs anything written by Paul anywhere else in the bible, Corinthians or otherwise.

I'm not sure what you are talking about here as all scripture is given by inspiration of God (2 Timothy 3:16 KJV).

Ephesians 4:4 There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.​

The seven fold unity of the Spirit. What of it?

And you're a flat out liar if you suggest, imply or insinuate that Bob Enyart or any member of his congregation would disagree with the notion that Christ died for our sins and was buried and rose again the third day.

If you would get your emotions in check, you would go back and see what I actually stated (which is not what you said above); and that is, that Bob doesn't preach the gospel of Christ as the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...this-picture&p=4739068&viewfull=1#post4739068

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...this-picture&p=4739705&viewfull=1#post4739705

And yes, I noticed that you failed to respond to my argument. Not that I'm surprised.

I responded to plenty with sound doctrine that you will not endure (2 Timothy 4:3 KJV).

 

[heir]

You are a lunatic and a liar. The futher this goes the less I believe you ever once attended his church.

Bob doesn't preach that Christ died for our sins as the good news of our salvation anymore than he preaches 2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV.

Paul teaches it, therefore Bob teaches it. Paul only states it explicitly. It's not even debatable.

What a ridiculous thing to say. Paul was writing to Gentiles he had never met nor preached his mystery gospel to and yet he states that they "wert graffed in". These Roman Gentiles ("called a Jew") were already in a standing in the olive tree by faith, but not yet members of the Body of Christ at the writing of the letter having never heard Paul's gospel before! I cited much scripture showing you how much Paul longed to see them and why. Chapter 1 alone is grounds for pause and deep study!

I have no problem. The text means what it says.

Neither do I and yes it does.

Paul explicity says that even though Israel was cut off, it didn't include the believers! - Duh!

Paul is writing to the Romans who were already graffed in to a now fallen Israel, that they still had hope by continuing in the goodness of God. He would provoke to emulation them which were his flesh through these Gentiles' salvation and save some of them (Jews).

Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

Romans 11:14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

That's your doctrine, not the text.

My doctrine is steeped in Paul's!

Lunatic stupidity.

lame refutation

JUST READ THE TEXT!!! There's no need to jump through so many hoops because you're afraid that it might be teaching that Christians can lose their salvation, which it isn't even teaching in the first place, WHICH IT STATES AS PLAIN AS DAY!!!!

It is saying to the Romans "if thou continue in His goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off" and it means what it says. It contributes to the fact that these Romans were not yet saved and in need of hearing the gospel of Christ (Romans 1:15-17 KJV)!

I don't believe you. I think you have some stupid axe to grind with Bob. You're probably a public school teacher who got offended by something he said from the pulpit (or the equivalent) and now want to disparage him and his ministry by pulling at any convoluted straw you can think to conjure up.

The proof, as far as I'm concerned, is this feigned allegiance to the "gospel of the grace of God and make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery" which Bob Enyart is responsible for disseminating more effectively than perhaps any single other person in the last 100 years and yet you wish to discredit him and his ministry in defense of "no other doctrine".

At worst you're liar and at best, a fool. Either way, you're aren't worth another second of my time.

Resting in Him,
Clete

:AMR:

 

[heir]

The proof, as far as I'm concerned, is this feigned allegiance to the "gospel of the grace of God and make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery" which Bob Enyart is responsible for disseminating more effectively than perhaps any single other person in the last 100 years and yet you wish to discredit him and his ministry in defense of "no other doctrine".

I'm not ashamed of the testimony of our Lord nor of His prisoner Paul and (2 Timothy 1:7-10 KJV). I don't care that you think it's insincere or what you concoct as my alleged motive, I'll keep on keeping on

1 Timothy 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.


...


2 Timothy 4:5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

 

[intojoy]

You're the one making a claim, you prove it. That my whole point!

No body gives a rip what your personal opinion is! You think that showing up here and stating that the Olive Tree isn't Israel means that you're right by virtue of the fact that you made the claim? What a fat waste of time it was for you to even bother typing it!

MAKE THE ARGUMENT!

Besides, the "Cultivated Olive Tree" in Romans 11 cannot be anything other than Israel. It's so plain and obvious, any third grader can read it and understand it.

Done


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[intojoy]

“And now, O inhabitants of Jerusalem and men of Judah, judge, I pray you, betwixt me and my vineyard.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:3‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.3.asv

“What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?”
**Isaiah‬ *5:4‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.4.asv

“And now I will tell you what I will do to my vineyard: I will take away the hedge thereof, and it shall be eaten up; I will break down the wall thereof, and it shall be trodden down:

For the vineyard of Jehovah of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for justice, but, behold, oppression; for righteousness, but, behold, a cry.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:5, 7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.5,7.asv

“And now I will tell you what I will do to my vineyard: I will take away the hedge thereof, and it shall be eaten up; I will break down the wall thereof, and it shall be trodden down:

For the vineyard of Jehovah of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for justice, but, behold, oppression; for righteousness, but, behold, a cry.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:5, 7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.5,7.asv

“For the vineyard of Jehovah of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for justice, but, behold, oppression; for righteousness, but, behold, a cry.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.7.asv

“Yet I had planted thee a noble vine, wholly a right seed: how then art thou turned into the degenerate branches of a foreign vine unto me?”
**Jeremiah‬ *2:21‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/jer.2.21.asv

“Hear another parable: There was a man that was a householder, who planted a vineyard, and set a hedge about it, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into another country.”
**Matthew‬ *21:33‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/mat.21.33.asv


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[Clete]

Bob doesn't preach that Christ died for our sins as the good news of our salvation anymore than he preaches 2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV.

I read your entire post but this single line is all that needed to be read.

You need to stop even mentioning Bob Enyart. This statement is nothing at all but a bald faced lie! That's all it is and nothing more.

You make claims about having attended his church but statements like this make that all but impossible to believe. I have no idea what your motivations are and I really don't care. The bottom line is that I do not discuss doctrine with liars. There is simply no point in doing so.

 

[Clete]

“And now, O inhabitants of Jerusalem and men of Judah, judge, I pray you, betwixt me and my vineyard.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:3‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.3.asv

“What could have been done more to my vineyard, that I have not done in it? wherefore, when I looked that it should bring forth grapes, brought it forth wild grapes?”
**Isaiah‬ *5:4‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.4.asv

“And now I will tell you what I will do to my vineyard: I will take away the hedge thereof, and it shall be eaten up; I will break down the wall thereof, and it shall be trodden down:

For the vineyard of Jehovah of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for justice, but, behold, oppression; for righteousness, but, behold, a cry.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:5, 7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.5,7.asv

“And now I will tell you what I will do to my vineyard: I will take away the hedge thereof, and it shall be eaten up; I will break down the wall thereof, and it shall be trodden down:

For the vineyard of Jehovah of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for justice, but, behold, oppression; for righteousness, but, behold, a cry.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:5, 7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.5,7.asv

“For the vineyard of Jehovah of hosts is the house of Israel, and the men of Judah his pleasant plant: and he looked for justice, but, behold, oppression; for righteousness, but, behold, a cry.”
**Isaiah‬ *5:7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.5.7.asv

“Yet I had planted thee a noble vine, wholly a right seed: how then art thou turned into the degenerate branches of a foreign vine unto me?”
**Jeremiah‬ *2:21‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/jer.2.21.asv

“Hear another parable: There was a man that was a householder, who planted a vineyard, and set a hedge about it, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into another country.”
**Matthew‬ *21:33‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/mat.21.33.asv


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

Okay, so what?

You really don't know how to make an argument do you?

Israel is likened very often to a grape vine.

There's no disputing that!

Are you suggesting that because Israel is likened to a grape vine that they cannot therefore be likened elsewhere to an Olive Tree?

You see, when you're making an argument, you're not supposed to leave it up to the audience to guess at what you point is. The whole idea of making an argument is to state your whole thought process out in explicit terms so that no one has to read your mind or attempt to guess at what you're getting at.

So, lets start again with the following question. Persuming that I've guessed correctly and that your point is that since Israel is the grape vine, that can't possibly be the olive tree, do you also reject, on the same basis, the notion that Israel is likened to a fig tree, like in Matthew 24 (and elsewhere)? If not, then on what basis do you reject Israel as being the olive tree in Romans 11?

Resting in Him,
Clete


P.S. Remember now! WHOLE thought process - EXPLICIT terms!

 

[heir]

I read your entire post but this single line is all that needed to be read.

You need to stop even mentioning Bob Enyart. This statement is nothing at all but a bald faced lie! That's all it is and nothing more.

You make claims about have attended his church but statements like this make that all but impossible to believe. I have no idea what your motivations are and I really don't care. The bottom line is that I do not discuss doctrine with liars.

It's a true statement as is my testimony of attending there.

Please show where Bob preaches 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV as the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth and/or 2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV. It shouldn't be any problem since you say:

The proof, as far as I'm concerned, is this feigned allegiance to the "gospel of the grace of God and make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery" which Bob Enyart is responsible for disseminating more effectively than perhaps any single other person in the last 100 years and yet you wish to discredit him and his ministry in defense of "no other doctrine".

I asked you to produce this earlier and you ignored it.

Is 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV cited in "The Plot"? If so, is it presented as the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth? If so, which page?

 

[musterion]

It is more muddled than it could be, imo. The content of 1 Cor 15:1-4 is referenced obliquely, but not stated clearly.

http://kgov.com/the-gospel

 

[Clete]

It is more muddled than it could be, imo. The content of 1 Cor 15:1-4 is referenced obliquely, but not stated clearly.

http://kgov.com/the-gospel

It isn't muddled!

There is NO NEED to make the distinction because there is NO DIFFERENCE!

Heir and it seems you as well are making a distinction where none exists and then using the fact that someone doesn't make the nonexistent distinction as evidence that they're preaching a false gospel!

That isn't the way doctrine is supposed to be done. There is one gospel that Paul preached to one body of Christ. To preach Romans is to preach Corinthians as well as the rest of Paul's epistles.

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Danoh]

heir, by your own standard, Clete can easily say that "you are being devisive."

For when I used to rib you and STP that your views are "ALMOST Acts 28" you would right off cry the sense of indignant foul that I was "being devisive!" :chuckle:

The :chuckle: is because you will also take this wrong.

I find such easily offended individuals amusing.

Always have.

One has no right to take offence at what one brings on oneself.

But a person long since having grown not only stagnant in their ability to continue to grow in understanding free of prior blinders, but intolerant of any view but their own, will always take easy offence they then do not allow in another.

Stand your ground until you believe otherwise, applies to both sides.

 

[heir]

It is more muddled than it could be, imo. The content of 1 Cor 15:1-4 is referenced obliquely, but not stated clearly.

http://kgov.com/the-gospel

Romans 10:9-10 is not the gospel of Christ.

The why of the cross is not preached as the gospel that is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth!

The WOTM is still on there too :vomit:

 

[heir]

It isn't muddled!

It's quite clear that Bob believes "the gospel" is Romans 10:9-10 KJV. It's not.

 

[musterion]

Rom 10:9-10, if used with the lost, cannot be a stand alone verse any more than John 3:16 can. It has to be prefaced with 1 Cor 15.

 

[heir]

It's a true statement as is my testimony of attending there.

Please show where Bob preaches 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV as the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth and/or 2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV. It shouldn't be any problem since you say:

I asked you to produce this earlier and you ignored it.

 

[heir]

Rom 10:9-10, if used with the lost, cannot be a stand alone verse any more than John 3:16 can. It has to be prefaced with 1 Cor 15.

Romans 10:9-10 KJV is not a formula for salvation. It is believing the WHO of Jesus Christ and that God raised Him from the dead (the gospel of God Romans 1:1-4 KJV) which is the faith the Romans had BTW (Romans 1:8 KJV) and were STILL IN NEED of salvation! It is not trusting the Lord after hearing and believing the word of truth, the gospel of our salvation (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Ephesians 1:13-14 KJV).

 

[musterion]

Romans 10:9-10 KJV is not a formula for salvation.

I never said that it is. I didn't reference it the other day when I shared Christ with a young man on my doorstep. I did reference 1st Corinthians 15.

What I mean is, IF someone is going to use that verse (most evangelicals do), they cannot isolate it from the actual content of the Gospel that we're to believe.

But you know as well as I that many today do exactly that.