Giving you access to the Bible is like giving a child access to a fully automatic assault rifle. Lots of noise and much damage.
Paul's Glorious Gospel
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
Giving you access to the Bible is like giving a child access to a fully automatic assault rifle. Lots of noise and much damage.
Epoisses
New member
The babe in Christ cries because his reformed gospel is gunned down in the streets. Lutherans are the true heirs of the Reformation, English pop tart. Christ died for all men and all sin whether the Reformed can admit it or not.
I stick close to Paul's Gospel and justification by faith. You seem to be staking every thing on your religious experience.
beloved57
Well-known member
You dont even believe the Death of Christ saved them He died for, so you dont believe the Gospel of Salvation !
Epoisses
New member
All men are saved in Christ but not all men believe it. Christ as the savior of the world is foundational to the gospel and you reject it, goat!
In my case I'd been on a 30 year drunk and the last two years was me drinking myself to death. I was delivered in a most powerful and unmistakable way. My own father didn't recognise me so great was the immediate change. People who knew me were stopping me to ask what had happened. In my local club they took out a book on who could pick the length of time it would last. They closed the book after two years and refunded the bets.
I had no friends from my past who wanted to be seen talking to me, because people would mock them for doing so. I wasn't accepted in churches, because my salvation ran contrary to their religion.
Put it this way Roberto. If all that I have trusted in comes to nothing then I am still up on the deal, because I was dying 17 years ago.
Nanja
Well-known member
All men are not saved! Universalism is NOT the Gospel taught in the scriptures!
This is the Gospel of the Grace of God as taught by the Apostle Paul:
2 Tim. 1:8-9
8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God; 9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began
The "us" which were saved according to God's Purpose and Grace, are those who were Chosen In Union with Christ before the foundation of the World to be holy and without blame before Him in Love Eph. 1:4-11.
That's the World that God so Loved and gave His only begotten Son for John 3:16!
They shall not be condemned with the rest of the world:
1 Cor. 11:32
But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.
Heb. 12:6
For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
Epoisses
New member
All men are saved in Christ. The atonement did away with the sin problem once and for all. To say that Christ dies for one and not the other goes against your own beliefs where all men are under sin. The whole world lies in sin so Christ redeemed the whole world. This redemption does not become mine personally until I hear the good news and then believe the good news. Belief is a requirement for salvation that you do away with by your warped understanding of predestination.
Epoisses
New member
You trust in your reformed understanding and even a casual reading of Romans shows that Paul focused on Christian service and duty. These works play no role in my Salvation but they do show that a genuine conversion has occurred. Works under the gospel are non-meritorious. Works under all false gospels are meritorious. You reject all works and so are left with half the gospel.
Religious worker bees don't like it when you say things like this. But you already knew that.
Eagles Wings
New member
I know quite a few of the LCMS and they do not hate nor mis-represent Calvinism as you do.
What gives?
Most Reformed have very high regard for Luther.
Lon
Well-known member
It is a disagreement over what, when. I don't think you or I, wrong or right, can affect that. The Reformed believe that God wouldn't 'waste' energy after folly (Matthew 7:6), knowing very well, all who will be saved "I have lost none of them." John 6:44 John 14:6 Conversely, you believe anybody can be saved. I believe that as a theoretical possibility, but not what God did. Because the answer is fully within the counsel of God, I think we can have disagreements about it and must ultimately leave the fate of the lost fully in His hands anyway. We are simply trying to gain peace of our own minds over the matter. Some, perhaps you, are also concerned about the lost, but I yet believe it fully in God's hands. It will affect, perhaps your efforts as well as how much you believe the Father will use you to bring another to Him. It is a good concern, but even that has to be individually come to, regarding what we individually do or believe we are responsible for. It seems to me, it is a bit more academic for disagreement so not something that needs to be taken to the mat (sorry for being a bit wordy, I'm trying to meaningfully answer some of your concerns. I wouldn't blame you for a quick proofread rather than in depth once-over).
The Lord's redemptive work can/could save all that call upon the Name. I too believe that He loved the world (whole world) that the ones who call upon Him will be saved. I'm not sure 'potentiality' needs to become a dividing point, even if Open Theists insist on that potentiality as necessary to their theology understanding and stance. Why? Because I can and do believe the potentiality of the Cross. It can save all by sufficiency.
The difference is that I believe 'potentiality' is known to God as 'assuredly.' It has a lot to do with Colossians 1:16-18 John 15:5 regarding HIs Sovereignty and the necessity of these verses to as I understand the extent of God's Sovereignty.
Spoiler
Thanks for taking a moment.
Belief isn't done away with, but rather enabled, if that is the concern. The largest difference, it seems to me, is that God sought us, not we Him. I couldn't seek what was foreign to me.
Romans 10:17 Is it an 'order' or a cause/effect? It is important to our respective theology. Are we 'enabled' to belief? Or is belief our's? The Lord Jesus Christ said He only came for the sick. Was He saying "Everyone is sick!" ? I think He was, but He told the ones who thought they didn't need Him, that they didn't need Him. I think 'the sick' a good point of in depth discussion. Who is sick? Why did the Lord Jesus Christ say the 'well' didn't need Him? -Lon
I have not said that I reject all works. Why do you people insist on putting words into my mouth.
Most people work hard to earn a living. I don't. I'm a consultant and all I do is advise people. I do get paid for it so it must be work, but when anyone asks me what do for a living, I say nothing really I just talk occasionally. Other people (the legal team) do all the work. I spend about 8-10 hours a week at it so is it really work?
Yes, everyone who accepts Jesus as their Lord and Savior with word and deeds will inter into God's kingdom.
I have read much of what Luther wrote and I must admire his stance at the Diet of Worms. When you say heirs do you mean instigators or initiators?
LCMS? please enlighten me.
Epoisses
New member
You sell tea for a living just admit it already.
Epoisses
New member
You can't accept Jesus until your self-righteousness is crucified.
So how do you practice that?
You are not authority to tell anyone who is accepted or not.