Mid Acts Disponsationalism

[Clete]

You lie often enough and you think your salvation is not affected.

Heb 12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

LA

LA,

You think you can out lie the blood of Christ?

You think God would forfeit His Spirit in exchange for 600 murders?

2 Corinthians 1:22 who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee. (NKJV)​

I like the KJV better...

2 Corinthians 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.​

If you've ever bought a piece of property, you know what an earnest payment is and that there is no getting it back.

God swears on His own Spirit that we will be delivered safely to the Day of Redemption. But this is no reason to think, as Paul was also accused, that we preach a license to sin. On the contrary! We simply preach a gospel that has replaced the fear motive with a love motive.

Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.​

"Have we been afraid to really believe God? Have some even been afraid to allow others to really believe Him? We must never forget that "God’s ways are not always man’s ways. To some men constant peril is the only spur to action, and many religions and psychologies are dependent on fear to keep their disciples in line. Fear, too, has a place in Christianity, but God has higher and more effective motivations than fear, and one of these is love. Often fear after a while produces only numbness, but love thrives on love. To promise a man the certainty of his destiny may seem, on the human level, like playing with fire; but this leaves God out of the picture. Those who have the deepest appreciation of grace do not continue in sin. Moreover, fear produces the obedience of slaves; love engenders the obedience of sons" (J. W. Sanderson, Jr.).

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Tambora]

LA,

You think you can out lie the blood of Christ?

You think God would forfeit His Spirit in exchange for 600 murders?

2 Corinthians 1:22 who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee. (NKJV)​

I like the KJV better...

2 Corinthians 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.​

If you've ever bought a piece of property, you know what an earnest payment is and that there is no getting it back.

God swears on His own Spirit that we will be delivered safely to the Day of Redemption. But this is no reason to think, as Paul was also accused, that we preach a license to sin. On the contrary! We simply preach a gospel that has replaced the fear motive with a love motive.

Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.​

"Have we been afraid to really believe God? Have some even been afraid to allow others to really believe Him? We must never forget that "God’s ways are not always man’s ways. To some men constant peril is the only spur to action, and many religions and psychologies are dependent on fear to keep their disciples in line. Fear, too, has a place in Christianity, but God has higher and more effective motivations than fear, and one of these is love. Often fear after a while produces only numbness, but love thrives on love. To promise a man the certainty of his destiny may seem, on the human level, like playing with fire; but this leaves God out of the picture. Those who have the deepest appreciation of grace do not continue in sin. Moreover, fear produces the obedience of slaves; love engenders the obedience of sons" (J. W. Sanderson, Jr.).

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Lazy afternoon]

LA,

You think you can out lie the blood of Christ?

Heb 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:


LA

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Your habitual lying about the sons of God reveal you do not know Jesus Christ at all.

Your approval of John W's speaking lies of Gods sons, speaks volumes about your own darkness of heart.

Heb 12:6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
Heb 12:7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
Heb 12:8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

Luk 17:1 Then said he unto the disciples, It is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come!
Luk 17:2 It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones.

LA

You sure like to judge your fellow posters, don't ya? Probably makes
you feel better about yourself?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

You lie often enough and you think your salvation is not affected.

Heb 12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

LA

You think you're pretty cool, don't ya?

 

[musterion]

Don't lose yer head, Gros...

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Your habitual lying about the sons of God reveal you do not know Jesus Christ at all.

Your approval of John W's speaking lies of Gods sons, speaks volumes about your own darkness of heart.

LA, the great judge of all mankind, posting threats as always.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

You sure like to judge your fellow posters, don't ya? Probably makes
you feel better about yourself?

LA fancies himself super spiritual, a sort of judgmental guru to us carnal TOLers, a modern day prophet, priest, and king.

 

[Clete]

Heb 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:


LA

I'll give you one guess who the book of Hebrews was written too.

Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”​

You have no choice but to attempt to proof text your way to victory in a debate on this topic and so let me make a few predictions...

1. You will quote your proof texts will little or no commentary, rightly believing that they mean what they say and that no commentary is needed or desired.

2. Any text I quote that in any way sounds like it might argue against your position, let's call them your problem texts, you will either ignore completely or else you will spend some considerable effort in explaining why it doesn't mean what it says.

3. I, on the other hand, won't need to explain how any of your proof texts mean anything other than what they say. In effect, all your proof texts are my proof texts too!​

This complete lack of "problem texts" is, in my view, one of the most compelling arguments in favor of Mid-Acts Dispensationalism. You read everything not written by Paul at face value and 'interpret' the Pauline epistles in light of the synoptic Gospels and the writings of Peter, James and John (and others) while I just read the Bible and take it all to mean precisely what it seems to mean while understanding the fact that it wasn't all written to or about me (i.e. I'm mindful of the context).

Galatians 2: 7 But on the contrary, when they saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me, as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter 8 (for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles), 9 and when James, Peter, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.​

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Heb 12:25 See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:


LA

I'll give you one guess who the book of Hebrews was written too.

Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”​

Clete

Ok so you are not in covenant with God, not joined to the House of Israel by the blood of Jesus.

I am.

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
Eph 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;





2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

LA

 

[Clete]

Ok so you are not in covenant with God, not joined to the House of Israel by the blood of Jesus.

I am.

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
Eph 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;





2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

LA

Unresponsive.

Try to deal with one topic at a time, LA.

At best you've implied a premise here but made no effort to connect it logically to the conversation. I can't read your mind.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

I'll give you one guess who the book of Hebrews was written too.

Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then no place would have been sought for a second. 8 Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 9 not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they did not continue in My covenant, and I disregarded them, says the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”​

Clete

Ok so you are not in covenant with God, not joined to the House of Israel by the blood of Jesus.

I am.

Eph 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
Eph 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;





2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

LA

Unresponsive.

Try to deal with one topic at a time, LA.

At best you've implied a premise here but made no effort to connect it logically to the conversation. I can't read your mind.

You do not connect with the Lord's mind, but you think you do.

You claimed the Hebrew verses do not apply to you, and I showed you with scripture that the true Christian is the extention of the House of elect Israel throughout the world by the blood of Christ of the new covenant since Pentecost outpouring of the Holy Spirit, continuing without interruption to this very day, and that the gathering of the Saints with their new children is the Israel of God from all nations regardless of their ethnicity.

You have never become a Temple of the Holy Spirit or you would understand that.

Instead you trust in your particular religious learnings from man which suit your unrenewed mind.

You are not as bright as you think you are when you feed on the wrong tree.


LA

 

[patrick jane]

You do not connect with the Lord's mind, but you think you do.

You claimed the Hebrew verses do not apply to you, and I showed you with scripture that the true Christian is the extention of the House of elect Israel throughout the world by the blood of Christ of the new covenant since Pentecost outpouring of the Holy Spirit, continuing without interruption to this very day, and that the gathering of the Saints with their new children is the Israel of God from all nations regardless of their ethnicity.

You have never become a Temple of the Holy Spirit or you would understand that.

Instead you trust in your particular religious learnings from man which suit your unrenewed mind.

You are not as bright as you think you are when you feed on the wrong tree.


LA

whoa hey clete, you gonna take that ? thems fightin'words !

 

[Clete]

You do not connect with the Lord's mind, but you think you do.

You claimed the Hebrew verses do not apply to you, and I showed you with scripture that the true Christian is the extention of the House of elect Israel throughout the world by the blood of Christ of the new covenant since Pentecost outpouring of the Holy Spirit, continuing without interruption to this very day, and that the gathering of the Saints with their new children is the Israel of God from all nations regardless of their ethnicity.

You showed no such thing. This is the problem with proof texting. You can make the text agree with anything that you want to bring to it. Reading the Bible without reading anything INTO it is the most difficult thing about theology, by far. The point of the passage is the opposite of that which you claim. Without the temple, with that separation, that veil which was torn from top to bottom, there is no longer a need for a Gentile to become a Jew in order to be near to God because "He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near. For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father."

Don't you see it? It isn't that the Judaism (i.e. the Law) has been preserved, its that its been abolished!! But "the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable" (Romans 11:29) and so those saved under the Dispensation of the Kingdom remained under that dispensation and are still under that dispensation and forever will be. Thus "when they (the Twelve) saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me (Paul), as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter (for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles), and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised." (Galatians 2:7-9). So, those things written by Paul applied to the Gentiles at the time (and now to everyone) and those thing written to Kingdom believers (i.e. Hebrews - Revelation) applied to Kingdom believers at the time and will apply to Kingdom believers during the Millennial Reign of Christ when He returns to Israel.

Romans 11:24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:

“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”

28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30 For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31 even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.​

So then,I have just one question for you that you will not answer...

WHY PAUL?

If things just kept right on going "without interruption" since Pentecost, then why Paul? God had 12 Apostles, all of whom received the Holy Spirit on Pentecost (Acts 1:23 - 2:4). Where's the need for Paul?

There's several other questions that you can't answer based on your theological position but since I seriously doubt you'll even attempt to answer this one with anything but hemming and hawing or personal opinion, I'll hold those for later, in case you surprise me.

You have never become a Temple of the Holy Spirit or you would understand that.

So anyone who can't read your mind and intuitively understand and come to agreement with you without any effort on your part surely must not be saved at all.

You're a lunatic.

Instead you trust in your particular religious learnings from man which suit your unrenewed mind.

You don't know me at all. You have no idea what I believe or why I believe it. You've never one time ever seen me try to support a single claim I've ever made on the basis of who taught it to me.

And you learned from someone too, you mindless lunatic.

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?​

You are not as bright as you think you are when you feed on the wrong tree.

Interesting that you say such a thing. The Law is the continuation of, the fruit of, Adam's partaking of the "wrong tree" in the garden of God...


The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil

1. The Tree is the ministry of death. Gen 2:17
2. Do not partake of the Tree. Gen. 2:17
3. In the day you partake of the Tree, you will die. Gen. 2:17
4. By the Tree is the knowledge of sin. Gen. 3:22
5. The Tree brought the offense. Rom. 5:17
6. The Tree’s curse died on the cross. Rom 5:18-19
7. The Tree of Life is in the new heaven, but not the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. Ezek. 31:15; Rev. 22:14

The Law

1. The law is the ministry of death. 2 Cor. 3:7
2. Do not partake of the law. Rom. 7:6; 10:4
3. In the day you partake of the law, you will die. Rom. 7:9
4. By the law is the knowledge of sin. Rom. 3:20; 7:7
5. The law made the offense abound. Rom. 5:20
6. The law was nailed to the cross. Col. 2:13-14, 16
7. The Law of the Spirit is in the new heaven, but not the Law of Death. Rom. 8:2; 7:6

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

LA fancies himself super spiritual, a sort of judgmental guru to us carnal TOLers, a modern day prophet, priest, and king.

Yeah. He's that kind of guy.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

You showed no such thing. This is the problem with proof texting. You can make the text agree with anything that you want to bring to it. Reading the Bible without reading anything INTO it is the most difficult thing about theology, by far. The point of the passage is the opposite of that which you claim. Without the temple, with that separation, that veil which was torn from top to bottom, there is no longer a need for a Gentile to become a Jew in order to be near to God because "He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near. For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father."

Don't you see it? It isn't that the Judaism (i.e. the Law) has been preserved, its that its been abolished!! But "the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable" (Romans 11:29) and so those saved under the Dispensation of the Kingdom remained under that dispensation and are still under that dispensation and forever will be. Thus "when they (the Twelve) saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me (Paul), as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter (for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles), and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised." (Galatians 2:7-9). So, those things written by Paul applied to the Gentiles at the time (and now to everyone) and those thing written to Kingdom believers (i.e. Hebrews - Revelation) applied to Kingdom believers at the time and will apply to Kingdom believers during the Millennial Reign of Christ when He returns to Israel.

Romans 11:24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:

“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”

28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30 For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31 even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.​

So then,I have just one question for you that you will not answer...

WHY PAUL?

If things just kept right on going "without interruption" since Pentecost, then why Paul? God had 12 Apostles, all of whom received the Holy Spirit on Pentecost (Acts 1:23 - 2:4). Where's the need for Paul?

There's several other questions that you can't answer based on your theological position but since I seriously doubt you'll even attempt to answer this one with anything but hemming and hawing or personal opinion, I'll hold those for later, in case you surprise me.


So anyone who can't read your mind and intuitively understand and come to agreement with you without any effort on your part surely must not be saved at all.

You're a lunatic.


You don't know me at all. You have no idea what I believe or why I believe it. You've never one time ever seen me try to support a single claim I've ever made on the basis of who taught it to me.

And you learned from someone too, you mindless lunatic.

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?​

Interesting that you say such a thing. The Law is the continuation of, the fruit of, Adam's partaking of the "wrong tree" in the garden of God...


The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil

1. The Tree is the ministry of death. Gen 2:17
2. Do not partake of the Tree. Gen. 2:17
3. In the day you partake of the Tree, you will die. Gen. 2:17
4. By the Tree is the knowledge of sin. Gen. 3:22
5. The Tree brought the offense. Rom. 5:17
6. The Tree’s curse died on the cross. Rom 5:18-19
7. The Tree of Life is in the new heaven, but not the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. Ezek. 31:15; Rev. 22:14

The Law

1. The law is the ministry of death. 2 Cor. 3:7
2. Do not partake of the law. Rom. 7:6; 10:4
3. In the day you partake of the law, you will die. Rom. 7:9
4. By the law is the knowledge of sin. Rom. 3:20; 7:7
5. The law made the offense abound. Rom. 5:20
6. The law was nailed to the cross. Col. 2:13-14, 16
7. The Law of the Spirit is in the new heaven, but not the Law of Death. Rom. 8:2; 7:6

Resting in Him,
Clete

You just confirmed everything I said about you.

I replied to you in kind, as you do, and look at the dribble you came up with.

You declare that you have no covenant with God, because the only new covenant in existence is the one the disciples entered into from the beginning since Pentecost, and you reject it on the basis of your flesh not being of Jewish origin.

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

by Clete--

Don't you see it? It isn't that the Judaism (i.e. the Law) has been preserved, its that its been abolished!! But "the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable" (Romans 11:29) and so those saved under the Dispensation of the Kingdom remained under that dispensation and are still under that dispensation and forever will be. Thus "when they (the Twelve) saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me (Paul), as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter (for He who worked effectively in Peter for the apostleship to the circumcised also worked effectively in me toward the Gentiles), and when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that had been given to me, they gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we should go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised." (Galatians 2:7-9). So, those things written by Paul applied to the Gentiles at the time (and now to everyone) and those thing written to Kingdom believers (i.e. Hebrews - Revelation) applied to Kingdom believers at the time and will apply to Kingdom believers during the Millennial Reign of Christ when He returns to Israel.

You made all that up.

LA

 

[Bright Raven]

by Clete--



You made all that up.

LA

Give scripture that shows it is made up.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Give scripture that shows it is made up.

Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

 

[Clete]

LA,

You are officially a lunatic.

You just made my ignore list.

Clete