Jews And Gentiles Same Goal
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glorydaz
Well-known member
The baptism of repentance was a rite, Jerry, to show the one baptised believed Jesus Christ was the Messiah, the Son of God.
Yep, that's what the baptism of repentance was for. Going under the water was a sign they accepted Jesus as their Messiah, the Christ.
No, the baptism didn't change a person at all. The only thing that changes a person's way of living is believing in the Lord Jesus Christ...that change of mind which filled the Eunuch with joy.
Acts 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.
The baptism of repentance was for the Jews and those who aligned themselves with them.
Acts 8:27 And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship, 28 Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet.
glorydaz
Well-known member
You are certainly hung up on sin. This is why the Jews were told to repent.
John 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
The baptism of repentance had nothing to do with transgression of the law, but with rejecting the Lord as Messiah.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
The baptism of repentance was in regard to the Jews having a change of mind in regard to their sinful life style in order "make ready a people prepared for the Lord" so that they "might serve Him...in holiness and righteousness" (Lk.1:17,74-75).
Ananias said the following to Paul after he was converted:
"And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord" (Acts 22:16).
In his commentary on this verse Sir Robert Anderson writes, "The Apostle records the words which Ananias addressed to him (Paul) at his conversion: 'Arise and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord'...His meaning is clear: 'Arise and be baptized, and turn away from your evil courses, calling on His name'" (Anderson, The Bible or the Church? [London: Pickering & Inglis, Second Edition], 230-231).
That is the meaning of the words "ye washed yourselves" and "cleanse ourselves" in the following verses:
"And such were some of you: but ye washed yourselves, but ye were sanctified, but ye were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God " (1 Cor.6:11; RV, Marginal Note).
"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God " (2 Cor.7:1).
When anyone submitted to the rite of water baptism he was pledging to change his life for the better. That is why John the Baptist said the following to the Pharisees and Sadducees:
"O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come? Bring forth therefore fruits befitting repentance" (Mt.3:7-8).
John the Baptist was telling them that since they were pledging to change their way of living then they should exhibit a real change in their lives. Here the Greek word translated "repentance" means "the change of mind of those who have begun to abhor their errors and misdeeds, and have determined to enter upon a better course of life, so that it embraces both a recognition of sin and sorrow for it and hearty amendment, the tokens and effects which are good deeds...Mt. iii. 8" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).
Therefore we can understand that those who were baptized with water were to have a change of mind in regard to their sinful lifestyle and were pledging to change their life so that they could serve the Lord in holiness and righteousness.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
You are so uninformed that you say that when Peter told the Jews to "repent and be baptized" that wasn't a baptism of repentance.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Why would you say that having a heart prepared for the Lord could be accomplished by their own efforts? Has righteousness ever come through the law or man's efforts to keep it?
Ananias was a Jew who wanted to show Paul was not an idolater as was being claimed. He, of course, followed what the law would require. Ezekiel 36:25 Cleansing him had nothing to do with his future course of behaviour.
glorydaz
Well-known member
Jerry, you keep missing the point.
Rosen thinks repentance is from sins. You think repentance is for living a holy life. :doh:
Rosenritter
New member
My my, do you ever try to read what is written without inserting your own personal bias into the verse?lain:
Did you ever consider it's the "convert" part that causes their sins to be blotted out?
Did you ever consider that "repent" is referring to their change of mind concerning their Messiah (whom they had crucified)? Being sorry for your sins will not cause them to be blotted out.
So humanity's universal need to repent of sin is "my own personal bias?" Regardless, true repentance requires a change of heart, bringing about a change in the individual (Luke 3:8). A mere "change of mind" or "being sorry" that you speak of isn't the repentance unto salvation that Paul speaks of.
Rosenritter
New member
Acts 2:38 KJV
(38) Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 3:19 KJV
(19) Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Matthew 9:13 KJV
(13) But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Mark 1:4 KJV
(4) John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Luke 15:7 KJV
(7) I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.
Luke 15:10 KJV
(10) Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.
Acts 5:31 KJV
(31) Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
2 Corinthians 12:21 KJV
(21) And lest, when I come again, my God will humble me among you, and that I shall bewail many which have sinned already, and have not repented of the uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness which they have committed.
Whomever would think that one must have repentance from sin? I cannot imagine why anyone would think that was biblical...
glorydaz
Well-known member
Humanity's universal need is to repent of sin? What world do you live in?
No, humanity's universal need is to believe in God. To trust in Him.
Only because you say so.
You're the one who tries to claim it's being sorry for sins....I certainly don't say that. I'm not sure why you keep falsely accusing me of things YOU do.
Perhaps you don't understand what that change of mind entails.
It's a change of mind from unbelief to belief.
When that happens it is repentance towards God...NOT from sin. Sin is left behind and forgotten by God. Why do you insist on looking back like Lot's wife did?
Acts 20:21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.
glorydaz
Well-known member
You're still doing the same thing. You're claiming the result of being forgiven of sin is caused by repentance from sin. The result of being forgiven of sin comes from turning from unbelief to belief...a change of mind.
Here's a little challenge for you. Replace each word "repent" in those verses with the word "believe".
Rosenritter
New member
Romans 3:23 KJV
(23) For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Add that to the previously cited passages demonstrating that sinners need repent, and that sins must be repented of. I have no idea why anyone would argue that mankind has no need to repent of their sins.... but then again, I never anticipated that anyone would argue that "Love God" and "Love thy neighbor" were "works of the flesh" either.
Rosenritter
New member
1 John 1:8-9 KJV
(8) If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
(9) If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
Is John speaking to people who have not yet believed? Yet they still need forgiveness of sins. .
My my, do you ever try to read what is written without inserting your own personal bias into the verse?
Did you ever consider it's the "convert" part that causes their sins to be blotted out?
Did you ever consider that "repent" is referring to their change of mind concerning their Messiah (whom they had crucified)? Being sorry for your sins will not cause them to be blotted out.
Poor Rosenritter has NOT advanced into the 'Gospel of the grace of God,' as preached by the Apostle Paul, but believes he is living as a member of the 'House of Israel.' As you and I realize, the Lord Jesus and His Disciples were preaching the 'Kingdom Gospel' to the House of Israel, while the Apostle Paul was preaching the 'Gospel of the grace of God' to the Jew first (they rejected it) and subsequently Paul went to the Gentiles and became the 'Apostle to the Gentiles.'
I said
lol That is the craziest thing I have ever heard. If we could just change the word to make us forgiven, the Lord would have used the other word. Repentance of a sin is our acknowledgment of the sin and our regret of committing the sin. That is how we confess our sins.
CONFESS YOUR SINS
James 5:16
16 Confess your trespasses to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The effective, fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.
I Jn 1:9
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
Matt 10:32-36
32 "Therefore whoever confesses Me before men, him I will also confess before My Father who is in heaven.
33 "But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven.
34 "Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword.
35 "For I have come to 'set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law';
36 "and 'a man's enemies will be those of his own household.'
Rom 3:3-4
3 For what if some did not believe? Will their unbelief make the faithfulness of God without effect?
4 Certainly not! Indeed, let God be true but every man a liar. As it is written: "That You may be justified in Your words, and may overcome when You are judged."
Matt 12:36-37
36 "But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment.
37 "For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned."
Matt 12:34-36
34 "Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
35 "A good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth good things, and an evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth evil things.
36 "But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment.
[1Jo 1:5-6, 8-10
[5] This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. [6] If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. ...
[8] If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
[9] If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
[10] If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
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Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
I never said that. I said that before they were baptized with water they had to believe (Acts 8:36-37).
Then they were to submit to the "baptism of repentance."
So by the time Peter told them to repent and to be baptized they had already believed and were already saved. So the "repentance" Peter spoke of at Acts 2:38 was not in regard to believing since they had already done that. Instead, they were to have a change of mind in regard to their sinful lifestyle so that they could serve the Lord Jesus in holiness and righteousness.
Tell me in what way Paul was to wash away his sins?:
"And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord" (Acts 22:16).
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Right Divider
Body part
Not to be a nitpicker, but the Bible never describes anyone as "going under the water" in regards to any water baptism.
I know that many have the belief that baptism is dunking. But this idea cannot be supported from the Bible.
Right Divider
Body part
Yes, like many others, Rosenritter thinks that the word repentance can only mean turning from sins.
Wrongly defining a word always leads to confusion.
Right Divider
Body part
Once AGAIN... not every use of the word repent in the Bible refers to "humanity's universal need to repent of sin". This is just YOU over-generalizing.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Tell me in what way Paul was to wash away his sins?:
"And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord" (Acts 22:16).