ClimateSanity
New member
I admire your politeness in the face of ....never mind...my comment is far from polite. I lack the patience because I'm pretty sure I know where he gets his assertions from.
ECT Is there a TRANSDITION BETWEEN ISRAEL and THE GENTILES ??
- Thread starter DAN P
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I admire your politeness in the face of ....never mind...my comment is far from polite. I lack the patience because I'm pretty sure I know where he gets his assertions from.
Hi and here is a PRAVICATOR saying the the HOly Spirit and Paul , just slippied Eph 4:12 , which says , For the perfecting of the saints , for thwe moinoistry , and for the Edifying of the BODY OF CHRIST !!
I hsvr more , but the Holy Spirit is suspecy , because " all scripture is God breathed , so you do not have a "" GOOD WORKS " and will never BEAR any FRUIT !!
I wonder what bible you use , KJV-ONLY ??
I know a Pentecostal bible ??
dan p
genuineoriginal
New member
The paradigm where all believers in Christ are members of the body of Christ, whether they are Jew or Gentile, which is the point Paul was making in 1 Corinthians 12.
genuineoriginal
New member
You seem to be having problems accepting the truth.
genuineoriginal
New member
You appear to be calling yourself a liar.
I was not so much being polite as attempting to point out a means of a sharper objectivity.
Obviously, I am failing at it.
I am asking the following hoping you think on them a bit more.
By all Believers, do you mean James; Cephas; John; and theirs - and what applied to them?
Passages like...
Matthew 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Matthew 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Acts 3:23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. 3:24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.
There were those Jews "an Israelite indeed" John 1:47, and there were those Jews in the Body.
In other words, there were two different sets of Believing Jews. Those in the Israel of God, and those in the Body of Christ.
In the following, we read of both kinds of Jews.
Acts 21:18 And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present. 21:19 And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry. 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
Here is the other set of Believing Jews.
Acts 21:21 And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs.
And Gentile Body Members with that second set of Jews.
Acts 21:25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication.
Every paradigm has a context marker.
Where its' particular context begins and where it ends or cuts off.
Here those two distinct groups are mentioned once more...
Galatians 2:1 Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also. 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
Galatians 2:6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person: ) for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me: 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter; 2:8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles: ) 2:9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
Galatians 6:16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
Compare those last two sections of passages with Acts 15 and what you find is that...
On a prior trip to Jerusalem, Paul found he had run in vain. That he'd tried relating his Gentile gospel with some at Jerusalem to no avail. While in his return trip he dealt with their leadership, lest he waste his time once more.
You also find that they settled issues that are once more a source of strife between both groups at Galatia, thus; Paul's ending words, there at the end of Galatians 6.
There is a paradigm all this begins to make clear to the eyes of one's understanding that few have yet seen.
Especially anyone who OVER RELIES on the books or writings of men who; it is crystal clear in their writings; failed to see said paradigm...miserably so.
This is why the sound bytes back and fourth is so often a waste of time - one's paradigm automatically shifts in order to embrace or reject what it hears and or reads according to whether or not it conforms with one's paradigm.
UNLESS a HIGHER level Paradigm is in place FIRST.
The Higher Level Three Part Paradigm the following passages describe...
Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. 17:12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.
Take a look at how many on TOL replace those Three Critical Steps with "well the ECF," and or this and that endless stream of books "about" and or one's own ideas.
ClimateSanity
New member
What does it have to do with Cornelius?
genuineoriginal
New member
History describes the believers fleeing Jerusalem to Pella between 66 CE and 70 CE in time to escape the destruction of Jerusalem.
Cephas is mentioned by name in 1 Corinthians, which also mentions the body of Christ, so he is presumed to be part of the body of Christ unless there is any real evidence that he is not.
There is no justification for excluding anyone that believes Jesus is the Messiah from the body of Christ
As I mentioned to Climate "obviously I'm failing at it..." by your hand...
ClimateSanity
New member
That puts Seth and Noah and Moses in the body of Christ. They all currently believe that Jesus is the Messiah.
genuineoriginal
New member
You have been practicing an exclusionary mentality that causes you to reject people from the body of Christ.
Everyone who has faith in Jesus as the Messiah is in the body of Christ.
You have no justification for claiming that they are not.
genuineoriginal
New member
Do you have an objection to including them?
Yeah; all those "thousands of Jews" in Acts 21:20 "which believe; and they are all zealous of the law" the Body is "not under" Rom. 6:14, were in the Body.
:doh:
genuineoriginal
New member
Yes, there were zealous of the Law, no they were not under the Law, yes they were in the body of Christ.
Why do you have a problem with that?
ClimateSanity
New member
For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.” Galatians 3:10.
If these Jews were not relying on the law, why were they zealous for it?
genuineoriginal
New member
1 John 5:2 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. |
Revelation 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. |
Interplanner
Well-known member
I assume you are thinking this is about ceremonial and dietary. It is a very fine line between keeping them to obligate God and keeping them to celebrate God. Please see the end of Rom 11, the doxology. We find him asking 'who has ever given to God, that he owes anyone anything?' If you force another believer to celebrate the way you do, you are trying to obligate God to reward you for how you do. It is not acceptable to do so.