Citation for "Most serious problems with vaccines really begin to show up a year or more after vaccination."
Is there a risk of death from the covid vaccine?
- Thread starter marke
- Start date
Do you ever actually respond to what was said to you or do you only ever find ways to repeat your position as though nothing has been said to refute it.
You have no reason to be scared of this vaccine. There is no scientific basis for your fear whatsoever, as has been demonstrated over and over against without substantive response from your throughout this entire thread. I'm done repeating it all. You know your position is ridiculous because you've seen the evidence against it and cannot refute any of it (if you could, wild horses couldn't drag you away from your computer before you did so). If the sort of "caution" you speak of was reasonable, you'd scream in terror if anyone ever suggested that you get into a car.
Clete
P.S. Derf, I just realized that you wrote that post and not marke. Sorry! I should have paid closer attention. That's what I get for trying to do this without sufficient time.
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At least you're honest enough to say outloud that your decision isn't because of anything related to science. I don't blame you for not trusting the government. They've clearly earned everyone's distrust but there is still the fact that hundreds of millions of doses have been administered with statistically insignificant numbers of serious problems. Then there's also the results. The pandemic is effectively over here in the U.S. where the vaccine is easily available and has been widely distributed while other parts of the world are still on lock down, precisely because they do not have the access to the vaccine that we've had here.
Derf
Well-known member
I always respond to what was said, when it makes any sense to do so. But if there’s nothing substantive…(I was debating whether to respond to yours this time, but I’ll lower my standards this once.)
Not scared of the vaccine.
I am not looking for scientific basis for fear, but the same argument, if it could be called such, should be applied to the need for the vaccine as much or more than the vaccine itself.
Thank goodness for that! (But why do I not believe you? Maybe it’s like how the WHO and CDC and MSM have been repeating the mantra about the virus, while hiding important information. They have destroyed their integrity, if they had any left.
Not scared of the vaccine, or cars. I am a little frightened of the drivers in both cases, however. And what are the drivers for the vaccine that require doctors to be silenced in their opposition? That require doctors not to treat patients according to their own wisdom and knowledge? That require a puppet president to be set up to further the “cause”? It’s bigger than just the vaccine, Clete.
No problem—this takes more time than I have to give, sometimes.
Derf
I dunno. Logic and reason are related to science and that's what I'm basing my decision on.
And to say that there won't be a statistically significant number of problems can't be known for some time.
And to say there are places that don't have the vaccine showing significant differences with places that do can't be based on lockdowns. Do you have the charts that show the numbers?
You surely could not have misunderstood my point.
Everything related to scientific iquirey into this vaccine supports its safety and effectiveness.
Your decision, based on your previous post, is based on political considerations, not scientific ones.
Yes, actually, it can. We know how long the vaccine stays in your body (about a month) and we are already have a reasonable expectation for how long the resulting immunity will last.
Did you seriously just suggest that lockdowns work? The lock downs did not do a thing to stop this virus and neither did wearing those ridiculous masks!
I'm done with showing people numbers. The numbers are EASY to find for anyone who wants to look for them and I have no confidence that a mountain of numbers would convince you of anything anyway. I mean, are you not living in this country right now? Have you not just lived your own life through all these waste of time lock downs, masks and social distancing that didn't do a single thing? Sheesh!
You certainly weren't clear at best. And to say I'm not basing my decision on science is more rhetoric than discussion.
I'm definitely basing my decision on science.
On the short term. It can't be based on the long term, which is *important*, because a long term DOESN'T EXIST.
And since you admit we can't trust the government numbers, add least be wise enough to wait for independent numbers.
My post does not in any way imply that my decision is political. What politics are you talking about?
Not according to one of the founders of the mRNA methods. How the spike protein affects humans in the long term has already shown unexpected results.
It's you that won't look at any counter science. It's politics, right?
YOU are the one that said lockdowns show if vaccine works or not. Here is your quote: "The pandemic is effectively over here in the U.S. where the vaccine is easily available and has been widely distributed while other parts of the world are still on lock down, precisely because they do not have the access to the vaccine that we've had here."
No you haven't shown the numbers. There are no clear numbers, or charts, showing the rates of infection (and the method they used to determine infection) and the rates of death based on whether a location has or not had the vaccine. I for one would certainly change my mind based on the numbers but what we have so far supports my decision.
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How can we know no serious side effects from the vaccine will not arise two or three years down the road? That fact has certainly not been established by scientific observation.
Research vaccine development. There's a reason that it has historically taken one to two decades to develop a vaccine. If you're this ignorant of vaccine development you've no right to speak to anything about vaccines.
Clete's post to you illustrates his utter ignorance. The very people who push vaccines on us are the same people who push masks and lockdowns. That he doesn't realize this more than a year after masks and lockdowns began being pushed on us says he's ignorant of the entire narrative of the pandemic.
We are talking past one another and I no longer care about COVID enough to debate it any longer.
As for the above quote, I wasn't suggesting that other countries were still on lock down because lock downs work but because they don't have the vaccine. In other words, the vaccine obviously works. All you have to do is look at the numbers in the US which are down over 90%. The vaccine is the only thing that was ever going to work and it works beautifully and all one has to do is spend maybe 30 seconds to find the numbers to prove it. Those who don't believe it, don't want to believe it and won't ever believe it no matter what. Those countries that don't have the vaccine are still scared out of their rational minds over COVID and so they have to do something and the natural tendency of the left is command and control, therefore, lock downs are still in place in spite of an entire globe's worth of absolute proof that they did exactly nothing at all to help prevent the spread of the disease.
Right, Clete.
This is why Fauci and company are still promoting masks, lockdowns, and vaccines all at the same time. Seems the only people you will believe are those who have a financial conflict of interest where vaccines are concerned. Fauci is so conflicted he stands to make millions, hundreds of millions, of dollars from his associations with vaccine producers.
Ok genius, let's put your claims to the test. Give us your numbers. If these vaccines are so dangerous, how many people do you expect to fall seriously ill or die from these coronavirus vaccines in, say, the next year?
Give us a percentage. What percentage of those who received the vaccine will become seriously ill, and what percentage of people will die, as a direct consequence of Trump's vaccines?
Estimate deaths for a year? You once again show your ignorance. Safety testing of vaccines normally runs over a 4 year period. Unfortunately for you no animal/safety studies of mrna vaccines have ever been completed successfully. It's how we know no safety testing was done by Phizer or Moderna. And this technology is not all that new. It was patented back in 1989 by Dr. Robert Malone while working at the Salk Institute. That means in 30+ years no one has ever successfully gotten FDA approval for an mrna vaccine. They've been attempted, but none ever got past animal testing. That's why animal testing was not done by Phizer or Moderna. Why do what they knew would fail? And the FDA allowed them to bypass testing. Why? Why drop all safety/animal testing when no attempted mrna vaccine ever made it past animal testing? Why turn the entire world into one massive test of an experimental mrna vaccine?
The problem? Oh, the mrna vaccines developed antibodies and the animals survived that. What they didn't survive is being challenged with the virus they were being vaccinated against. After vaccination the animals had to have the vaccine tested against the virus. Just like anyone in real life would be tested against the disease. The virus when introduced to the animals brought on massive cytokine storms and the animal's own immune system killed them. They didn't use the spike protein in previous attempts. What we already know is that the spike proteins used in the current vaccines circulate throughout the body. They settle into the reproductive organs, the heart, the lungs, and one more place I can't remember off the top of my head. That why we have women having miscarriages at highly elevated rates as well as problems with their periods. And how many females will be sterilized? We have no idea but little girls are already exhibiting bleeding issues. It's why we have problems with blood clots, inflammation of the heart, heart attacks, as well as breathing problems, etc.... And I haven't even touched on the damage spike proteins do to the blood-brain barrier.
Also, the only reasons hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin were attacked so viciously is because the only path to getting an EUA is to have no available treatment. That's why drugs that have been around for decades were suddenly declared to be dangerous after being known for decades to be among the safest drugs on the market.
Whatever the 4 year death and severe adverse effect total will be it will be very large. It will be the largest catastrophy ever unleashed on the human race.
Trump ordered the FDA to bypass testing, oh thick one. You're forgetting that these coronavirus vaccines are Trump's babies. He willingly owns them himself, in his speeches. Why do you hate Trump so much?
It would appear that you are lying:
"COVID-19 vaccines underwent preclinical testing in animals and clinical trials in tens of thousands of people, which established their safety and efficacy. Such testing is also a prerequisite for receiving emergency use authorization by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration. While deaths have occurred among vaccinated people, it is important to remember that more than 157 million people in the U.S. have been vaccinated, and that the rate of deaths among vaccinated people isn’t higher than that of unvaccinated people. This indicates that COVID-19 vaccines aren’t the cause of these deaths."
COVID-19 vaccines were tested in animals and clinical trials before receiving authorization; vaccinated people aren’t dying at a higher rate than unvaccinated people
COVID-19 vaccines underwent preclinical testing in animals and clinical trials in tens of thousands of people, which established their safety and efficacy. Such testing is also a prerequisite for receiving emergency use authorization by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration. While deaths have...
healthfeedback.org
I have executed several searches on your assertion and can find no evidence this ever happened, That you post no evidence for your assertion tells me you have none.
You mustn't have looked very hard and are rather clueless. Here are a couple of references:
"US President Trump has told US drug regulators to accelerate emergency authorization of the BioNTech-Pfizer vaccine..."
Trump pressures FDA to approve COVID vaccine fast – DW – 12/12/2020
US President Trump has told US drug regulators to accelerate emergency authorization of the BioNTech-Pfizer vaccine. President-elect Joe Biden has said the vaccine needs to be evaluated "free from political influence."
"President Trump lashed out anew at the Food and Drug Administration in a Friday morning tweet, attacking the agency’s commissioner, Dr. Stephen M. Hahn, by name for not approving a Covid-19 vaccine faster."
And here is a recent quote directly from Trump during his recent political rally in Ohio:
"When the virus arrived, we produced three vaccines in record time, they said it would take three years to five years. We got it done in less than nine months. Record, record, record time...Remember when they wouldn’t report that the vaccine was effective before the election? Right after the election, oh, the big vaccine story, it was the greatest thing ever. But before, they wouldn’t report it, they wouldn’t report it..."
Donald Trump Wellington, Ohio Rally Speech Transcript: First Rally Since Leaving Office | Rev
Donald Trump held a rally in Wellington, Ohio on June 26, 2021. It was his first rally since being president. Read the full speech transcript from his rally here.
It would appear that you are lying:
"COVID-19 vaccines underwent preclinical testing in animals and clinical trials in tens of thousands of people, which established their safety and efficacy. Such testing is also a prerequisite for receiving emergency use authorization by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration. While deaths have occurred among vaccinated people, it is important to remember that more than 157 million people in the U.S. have been vaccinated, and that the rate of deaths among vaccinated people isn’t higher than that of unvaccinated people. This indicates that COVID-19 vaccines aren’t the cause of these deaths."
COVID-19 vaccines were tested in animals and clinical trials before receiving authorization; vaccinated people aren’t dying at a higher rate than unvaccinated people
COVID-19 vaccines underwent preclinical testing in animals and clinical trials in tens of thousands of people, which established their safety and efficacy. Such testing is also a prerequisite for receiving emergency use authorization by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration. While deaths have...
LOL. Show the timeline for animal testing. I've debunked claims like this before. There is too much evidence that no animal testing was done. The vaccine development corporations have so much power they easily corrupt the press because the press relies on their advertising dollars.
Remember animal testing, to do it right, takes 4 years. So, in a vaccine released in less than a year just how long was spent in animal testing? Just how fast was the "safety and efficacy" of the mrna vaccines established? How many shortcuts were taken? You have no idea and neither do I. We just know from vaccine development history it normally takes 4 years to do it anywhere close to right.
Remember, developing vaccines is a 10 to 15 year process. How many of the normal processes were shortened and by how much?
Animal testing skipped:
Researchers fast-track coronavirus vaccine by skipping key animal testing first
Animal tests normally constitute a critical step in vaccine development.