Is elohiym an idiot?

[SaulToPaul 2]

Don't be to sure of that. Is that what you do with the brother you disagree with? Write them off?

How do we know that Elohiym is a brother?

He has told me that he doesn't believe that Jesus Christ died for his sins. He said that Jesus only died for the sins under the Old Covenant and he was never under the Old Covenant.

This is a direct denial of the gospel, 1 Cor 15:1-4 KJV, as far as I can tell.

 

[jeremysdemo]

How do we know that Elohiym is a brother?

He has told me that he doesn't believe that Jesus Christ died for his sins. He said that Jesus only died for the sins under the Old Covenant and he was never under the Old Covenant.

This is a direct denial of the gospel, 1 Cor 15:1-4 KJV, as far as I can tell.

I agree that the blood atonement is an essential part of the Gospel no matter which gospel one is adhering to.
For Yeshua's it is mentioned by John the Baptist at the beginning of John,
Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sins of the world!
as well as in the Eucharist of Matthew:
28For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Notice Yeshua says this is my blood of the NEW testament.

With Yeshua's gospel it is much like the Old Covenant where repentance needed to be given with the sacrifice or it had no savor to the Lord.

I understand if Elo does not accept this tenement from the Eucharist because if one does research it this line is not in the other accounts of that saying of Yeshua, neither is the line of John the Baptist in the other earlier accounts of that event.
So an a academic level and from a purely non Christian perspective it is easy to write that off (although it is also mentioned in Peters Epistle which is harder to cast aside by way of comparison since there is none). But a level of "faith" must come into play when reading these things and we must have "faith" the the Lord preserved His words and gave us what was necessary for salvation.

keep shinin'

jerm

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Are you claiming that they interpret it as you do, then claim that they can do those things and be righteous at the same time? :dizzy:

elohiym, have you ever read the chapter? (1 Corinthians 5 and 6)

It doesn't appear that you have.

Let's review.... elohiym is claiming that Paul is speaking to unbelievers when he wrote...

1 Corinthians 6:15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take the members of Christ and make them members of a harlot? Certainly not!

1 Corinthians 6:18 Flee sexual immorality. Every sin that a man does is outside the body, but he who commits sexual immorality sins against his own body. ​

Which of course is ridiculous based on "Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ?"

Now let's slam the door shut even harder. If we jump back a few verses lets read the setup to all of this...

Paul writes....

1Corinthians 5:1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you​

Among who??? Who is he talking about? Believers or unbelievers? It sure sounds like believers based on verses 2 thru 8, but lets find out for sure...

Paul continues...

1Corinthians 5:9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people.​

Who is he talking about? Believers or unbelievers? According to elohiym Paul MUST be referring to unbelievers because according to elohiym a believer CANNOT be sexually immoral.

Yet Paul says otherwise....

1Corinthians 5:10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world.​

That should just about do it. Case closed, end of story, Paul is obviously referring to the sexual immoral within the Body and NOT of those of the "world".

Paul doesn't stop there....

1Corinthians 5:11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner — not even to eat with such a person.​

Maybe elohiym will claim Paul is saying those are sexually immoral that are merely named brothers but are not really brothers?

Nope! Paul clarifies beyond any doubt who he is referring to....

1Corinthians 5:12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore “put away from yourselves the evil person.” 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unrighteous, and not before the saints? ​

Paul is saying that these sexual immoral people are INSIDE THE BODY!


Will elohiym change and accept that he has been proven wrong? :think:

 

[Lighthouse]

Either do.... or don't.

[Yoda]There is no try.[/Yoda]

 

[Lighthouse]

elohiym-
If someone who claims to be a Christian gets involved in a committed, monogamous homosexual relationship, are they truly a Christian, or is that not a sin?

 

[PKevman]

elohiym-
If someone who claims to be a Christian gets involved in a committed, monogamous homosexual relationship, are they truly a Christian, or is that not a sin?

Someone who claims that they never fail and never slip up, and then in the same breath says:

I will always look at pretty women and be aroused by them;

Will pretty much excuse just about anything if they can just give it a redefinition. No it's not sin anymore, so I'm ok to ALWAYS look at pretty women and be aroused by them. So he would probably say that same thing about homo relationships.

 

[elected4ever]

How do we know that Elohiym is a brother?

He has told me that he doesn't believe that Jesus Christ died for his sins. He said that Jesus only died for the sins under the Old Covenant and he was never under the Old Covenant.

This is a direct denial of the gospel, 1 Cor 15:1-4 KJV, as far as I can tell.

because i believe he has been victimized by bad teaching as we all were to some degree. Has faith in Christ is authentic. He is teachable and he has made himself accountable to the brethren. Aren't you glad that it is Jesus who is the author and finisher of our faith instead of you and me.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

because i believe he has been victimized by bad teaching as we all were to some degree. Has faith in Christ is authentic. He is teachable and he has made himself accountable to the brethren. Aren't you glad that it is Jesus who is the author and finisher of our faith instead of you and me.

Lots of people believe in Christ or have faith in Christ, but many don't believe the gospel. You cannot be in the Body of Christ without believing the gospel.

1 Cor 15:1-4 KJV.

 

[elected4ever]

elohiym-
If someone who claims to be a Christian gets involved in a committed, monogamous homosexual relationship, are they truly a Christian, or is that not a sin?

How much of your fleshly nature is dead? All of it, part of it most of it or none of it? How much sin is covered , All of it part of it or just the part that existed before your birth in Christ? Aren't we responsible to our brother? There is only one thing that you should be thankful for Lighthouse. That is that Jesus is the judge and not me. Now I suppose you wont to start the inquisitions again.:shocked:

 

[elected4ever]

Lots of people believe in Christ or have faith in Christ, but many don't believe the gospel. You cannot be in the Body of Christ without believing the gospel.

1 Cor 15:1-4 KJV.

1 Corinthians 15:1 ¶Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Yes , Elohiym, does believe the gospel just as the scripture says but his expression of it is lacking. That does not make him a non believer in Christ. To me, you have some weird beliefs also. Like believing in two gospels. :shocked:

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

1 Corinthians 15:1 ¶Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Yes , Elohiym, does believe the gospel just as the scripture says but his expression of it is lacking. That does not make him a not believer in Christ. To me, you have some weird beliefs also. Like believing in two gospels. :shocked:

He told me that he doesn't believe verse 3.

 

[elected4ever]

He told me that he doesn't believe verse 3.

he may not the same way you do. But he does, believe it because it is the same gospel delivered to all the saints both Jew and gentile. We have all been made to drink of the same cup. We are all one in Christ which you refuse to admit.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

he may not the same way you do. But he does, believe it because it is the same gospel delivered to all the saints both Jew and gentile. We have all been made to drink of the same cup. We are all one in Christ which you refuse to admit.

We are all one in Christ which you refuse to admit.

Untrue. I believe we are all one in Christ, NOW. Not so, in TIME PAST.

 

[Lighthouse]

Someone who claims that they never fail and never slip up, and then in the same breath says: Will pretty much excuse just about anything if they can just give it a redefinition. No it's not sin anymore, so I'm ok to ALWAYS look at pretty women and be aroused by them. So he would probably say that same thing about homo relationships.

Actually, elohiym doesn't believe homosexuality is a sin, for anyone, Christian or not. But he does believe that promiscuity is a sin. So I'll move on to that next...

How much of your fleshly nature is dead? All of it, part of it most of it or none of it? How much sin is covered , All of it part of it or just the part that existed before your birth in Christ? Aren't we responsible to our brother? There is only one thing that you should be thankful for Lighthouse. That is that Jesus is the judge and not me. Now I suppose you wont to start the inquisitions again.:shocked:

You're an idiot, old man.

 

[Lighthouse]

he may not the same way you do. But he does, believe it because it is the same gospel delivered to all the saints both Jew and gentile. We have all been made to drink of the same cup. We are all one in Christ which you refuse to admit.

Just because elohiym believes in God that does not make him a brother. He is not a brother. Therefore he is not one in Christ with us. He does not believe the gospel that was delivered to us.

 

[elected4ever]

Just because elohiym believes in God that does not make him a brother. He is not a brother. Therefore he is not one in Christ with us. He does not believe the gospel that was delivered to us.

yes he does, he just doesn't have a good understanding or can't communicate it well. God looks at the thoughts and intent of the heart and not how we sometimes communicate those things poorly. Sometimes it is very hard to say one thing and then being understood to say something else.

 

[drbrumley]

yes he does, he just doesn't have a good understanding or can't communicate it well. God looks at the thoughts and intent of the heart and not how we sometimes communicate those things poorly. Sometimes it is very hard to say one thing and then being understood to say something else.

And hence the most prevailing problem on this board. Just because it is a bulletin board online, most here, including myself at times, thinks this gives those license to treat the other badly. And they do this knowing the person your speaking to can't knock the crap out of em.

 

[elected4ever]

And hence the most prevailing problem on this board. Just because it is a bulletin board online, most here, including myself at times, thinks this gives those license to treat the other badly. And they do this knowing the person your speaking to can't knock the crap out of em.

Who? Me? I am an :angel:

 

[PKevman]

Who? Me? I am an :angel:

E4E, I want to say that I am impressed with your recent attitude and approach. I hope it continues. :up:

 

[kmoney]

It is a term used as a straw man argument against the Grace message by atheists and many covenantal believers who deny salvation through grace and teach works-based doctrines.

I take the term to mean that we are condoning sin, and saying just because someone is saved by faith alone and not any works, then we are saying it's ok to sin. That is the context in which it is often used.

Further it is used by those who deny eternal security and teach that Christians can lose their salvation. Cultists use the term often as well to say "Oh you believe Christians cannot lose their salvation, so you teach that Christians can do anything they want and God won't take away their salvation." I have had this very tactic used in discussing the Bible with cultists more times than I can count. Including when my own little brother was sucked into a mind control cult- "The International Church of Christ" for over two years of his life.

In a nutshell that is the short version of my view of the term "License to sin". If you go back and read the context it is being used in this discussion, you will find it to be along

Do you believe there are any spiritual consequences for sin?