ECT If your not OSAS then your not saved ,true or false?

[musterion]

good question

And I had a hunch she'd refuse to answer it.

 

[way 2 go]

Actually, she claims she was saved because she obeyed. That she was accepted because of her obedience to the commandments.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

GT must walk on, "eggshells" every moment of her existence. Else, she
lose, her kind of salvation.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

If you go by GTs belief system, you never know where you stand with God?
I mean, how much obedience is enough?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Looks like she ran away?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Perhaps she ran off to report somebody?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

GT and Meshak, are similar in many numerous ways.

 

[musterion]

If you go by GTs belief system, you never know where you stand with God?
I mean, how much obedience is enough?

That's the horror and the beauty of it. Fear is the drive, and flesh tries to outdo flesh to reach the goal of earning what no one can know they've earned. So work piles upon work, which eventuates in pride. It could not be more appealing to the self-righteous when the cross is reduced to an ornament or a totem...anything but the instrument of YOUR co-death with Christ.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

That's the horror and the beauty of it. Fear is the drive, and flesh tries to outdo flesh to reach the goal of earning what no one can know they've earned. So work piles upon work, which eventuates in pride. It could not be more appealing to the self-righteous when the cross is reduced to an ornament or a totem...anything but the instrument of YOUR co-death with Christ.

True. Well put.

 

[glorydaz]

True, but several posts back she says Christ saved her because He chose to save her and make her obey Him. It's...muddled.

Yep, He chose to save her because she obeyed. When you put all her posts together, you'll see she is more than muddled. Danoh called it rightly with his tossed salad analogy.

First, she lies and claims those with assurance speak against obedience. That's a lie right out of the pit. Satan's goal is to blind people to the obedience of faith (believing unto righteousness) by using preachers like GuTruth to insist we have to obey the commandments to be saved and to stay saved. What better to make Satan jump for joy than to turn people from God's grace to their own works? She's evil.....as evil as they come. She is a very diligent worker for the dark side.

Second, she claims she obeys "everything" Jesus says, which has been proven to be a lie by her picking and choosing which of Jesus's saying she has to obey.

Third, she is without excuse. She has heard the gospel of salvation and has rejected it time and time again.

Fourth, she destroys every single thread she can with her never ending posts parroting the same lie over and over again. It's a shame everyone doesn't just put her on ignore. We just give her a platform. :nono:

 

[musterion]

Also consider why the idea of unconditional eternal security in Christ is so hateful to them: it removes all works of righteousness from the equation. Only the self-righteous would be bothered by that.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Yep, He chose to save her because she obeyed. When you put all her posts together, you'll see she is more than muddled. Danoh called it rightly with his tossed salad analogy.

First, she lies and claims those with assurance speak against obedience. That's a lie right out of the pit. Satan's goal is to blind people to the obedience of faith (believing unto righteousness) by using preachers like GuTruth to insist we have to obey the commandments to be saved and to stay saved. What better to make Satan jump for joy than to turn people from God's grace to their own works? She's evil.....as evil as they come. She is a very diligent worker for the dark side.

Second, she claims she obeys "everything" Jesus says, which has been proven to be a lie by her picking and choosing which of Jesus's saying she has to obey.

Third, she is without excuse. She has heard the gospel of salvation and has rejected it time and time again.

Fourth, she destroys every single thread she can with her never ending posts parroting the same lie over and over again. It's a shame everyone doesn't just put her on ignore. We just give her a platform. :nono:

Yep

 

[oatmeal]

So, on the other thread why did you chastise me when I said to believe is to be fully persuaded? You called it a work. You can't have it both ways, Oats.

I am sorry, I am not sure I know what you are referring to.

If I could see what that post was in reference to, perhaps I could clarify the issue.

However, believing is work because it takes work for a person to fully persuade himself. For some issues it may come easy, for others it may take hard work, for some it maybe simple, for others it may be complicated.

However, in regards to salvation it takes our believing to receive the gift of salvation, therefore it is work to receive salvation.

But, unless we distinguish between the free gift, which costs us nothing but cost God His son, (it took a huge work on the part of God and His son to earn that salvation for us) and the small work it takes to receive that gift, (doing Romans 10:9-10) we will end up in confusion.

If someone works nights and weekends to buy you a very nice gift, say a new car, it still takes work for you to hold out you hand and receive the keys and title to it. Does your work even compare to the works it might have taken to purchase that gift for you?

To receive anything from God, we must believe the word of God, that takes work, however, it is God that does the providing, not us.

Maybe that will help

 

[glorydaz]

Also consider why the idea of unconditional eternal security in Christ is so hateful to them: it removes all works of righteousness from the equation. Only the self-righteous would be bothered by that.

It's why I think they have never believed in their heart that Jesus Christ is Lord. They believe in their hearts that THEY are lord. They trust in themselves.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

There isn't two or more ways too God. Only one in this, "Dispensation of Grace."
Yet, GT, Meshak, and others choose to live by the law. They reject the Grace
Gospel and adhere to the law, as if they were Hebrews living at the time
Jesus and His Apostles walked planet earth?

 

[musterion]

Yep, He chose to save her because she obeyed. When you put all her posts together, you'll see she is more than muddled. Danoh called it rightly with his tossed salad analogy.

First, she lies and claims those with assurance speak against obedience. That's a lie right out of the pit. Satan's goal is to blind people to the obedience of faith (believing unto righteousness) by using preachers like GuTruth to insist we have to obey the commandments to be saved and to stay saved. What better to make Satan jump for joy than to turn people from God's grace to their own works? She's evil.....as evil as they come. She is a very diligent worker for the dark side.

Second, she claims she obeys "everything" Jesus says, which has been proven to be a lie by her picking and choosing which of Jesus's saying she has to obey.

Third, she is without excuse. She has heard the gospel of salvation and has rejected it time and time again.

Fourth, she destroys every single thread she can with her never ending posts parroting the same lie over and over again. It's a shame everyone doesn't just put her on ignore. We just give her a platform. :nono:

POTD right there.

 

[musterion]

It's why I think they have never believed in their heart that Jesus Christ is Lord. They believe in their hearts that THEY are lord. They trust in themselves.

They're co-Lord/co-Savior, which is still the same thing.

 

[God's Truth]

I've trusted Christ alone to save me, and not any degree of my own works.

It is not our works we have to obey, it is God's works. Jesus did God's works, and we must do what Jesus tells us to do.

I obey Him out of love, which He wants me to do, but not to stay saved.

To want to stay saved is not an evil thing.

You will not even be loved by God and saved if you do not love Him.

You say you have trusted Christ to save you, and you also trust your own works of obedience to keep you saved because if you don't do them, He warns you that you'll be lost.

Again, I do not do my works I do God's works. Jesus warns EVERYONE.

Is it possible we both can be saved, even though the gospels we believe contradict each other?

I am trying to help you know God better, not condemn you.

 

[musterion]

It is not our works we have to obey, it is God's works. Jesus did God's works, and we must do what Jesus tells us to do.

Nice dodge. Sometimes I think Meshak is your sock puppet, you sound exactly alike.

To want to stay saved is not an evil thing.

You're right, it isn't. But to think you can and must help Christ keep you saved is exactly what Satan wants you to believe.

You will not even be loved by God and saved if you do not love Him.

So John 3:16 and Romans 5:8 are lies. Good to know.

Again, I do not do my works I do God's works. Jesus warns EVERYONE.

When you say you can and must help keep yourself saved during this dispensation of grace, you are doing the work of Satan. You are one of his ministers or [false] righteousness that Paul warned of.

I am trying to help you know God better, not condemn you.

You don't even know what the saving Gospel of grace is. Do not presume you can "help" anyone.

 

[God's Truth]

Jesus was speaking to the House of Israel only. Your problem is,
you don't know how to, "Rightly Divide" the word of God. (Bible)

Jesus was speaking to the lost sheep of Israel, and what he said was the way for the New Covenant. When Jesus died on the cross, then all could come into that same New Covenant.

You want me to believe the New Covenant rules changed without becoming yet another New Covenant and without it's own blood.

Jesus' words are forever, and there is not other Covenant.