It is one thing to point out that what somebody is doing is wrong. It is an entirely different thing to say they should be put to death for it.
And?
I don't agree with your explanation.
No one cares.
Make an argument.
Sorry, after listening to a lot of Bob's teaching, I do not accept him as my teacher.
No one said you had to.
What you should accept is what the Bible teaches. Bob taught that.
He is an old testament Christian.
Whatever that's supposed to mean...
Yes, he said things deserved death but he never once called for anybody to be put to death.
Saying someone deserves death for their actions is by definition calling for them to be put to death for their actions.
Otherwise, he wouldn't have said they deserve death.
Instead, he taught them about the forgiveness to be found in Christ.
Paul said, quote:
Let every soul
be subject to the governing authorities. For
there is no authority except from God, and
the authorities that exist are appointed by God.
Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and
those who resist will bring judgment on themselves. For
rulers are not
a terror to good
works, but
to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. For
he is God’s minister to you for good. But
if you do evil, be afraid; for
he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God’s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.
Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience’ sake.
Submit to Government - Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God.
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Everyone should be subject to the authorities.
There is no authority except from God.
The authorities that exist are appointed by God. (That is to say, the governments themselves, not the people in the governments.)
THEREFORE:
Whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God.
Those who resist bring judgement upon themselves.
Rulers are a terror to those who work evil.
The authorities are God's ministers to you for good.
If you do evil, be afraid.
FOR:
He does not bear
THE SWORD in vain.
FOR:
He is God's minister to execute wrath on him who practices evil.
THEREFORE:
We must be subject, not only because of wrath, but also for conscience' sake.
Did you catch that?
The authorities, aka governments, do not bear the sword in vain.
Again, they do not bear
THE SWORD in vain.
A sword is not used for beating people, Cab.
It's used for killing.
Paul is endorsing a government's use of the death penalty.
None the less, the verse does mean that we will be judged by the same measure we use to judge others.
Only if you're a hypocrite!
If you're not a hypocrite, then that measure cannot be used against you!
That's what it means to not be a hypocrite, Cabinet!
Are you so sure of your measure that you are willing to be judged by it?
Yes.
See: {definition of hypocrite}
And this is the crux of the matter and it has nothing to do with our sins. Read that verse again. Those that believe in Jesus as their Lord and Savior are not condemned. But those who do not believe in Jesus are already condemned. Nothing abut sin. When you believe, your sins are washed clean by Jesus. That is the Good News of the gospel: Jesus forgives your sins.
They're condemned for their sin of not repenting of their rebellion against God.
Repenting of their rebellion against God is tantamount to, if not synonymous with believing that God will save them from their sins if they put their trust in Him, generally speaking.
I would strongly disagree with this.
No one cares.
Make an argument.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
Matthew 28:19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
That seems pretty clear direction to me!
It's very clear direction indeed..... To His disciples, not to you.
And
Jesus came and spoke to them, saying,
“All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” Amen.
And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.
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Jesus just spent 40 days teaching them the things pertaining to the coming KINGDOM of God.
So it makes sense that He would tell THEM (not you) to go and spread what He taught them.
Jesus said no one comes to the Father except through Him.
To His disciples.
Israel no longer plays a part in redemption.
Redemption from what?
I also note that Jesus taught men to love their wives as Christ loves his church.
Nope. That was Paul, not Jesus.
What is Christ's church if it is not those that have accepted His gift of salvation?
Which church?
There are two of them.
No one cares. Make an argument.
The New Covenant is between God and those who call His Son their savior.
Saying it doesn't make it so, and you have been given scripture that says otherwise. Your disagreement is with Scripture.
Here it is again, in case you've forgotten:
“Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the Lord. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”
A New Covenant - “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—
www.biblegateway.com
Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— . . .
Because finding fault with them, He says: “Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—
www.biblegateway.com
I am saying that command became mute
*moot
when Christ completed the Old Covenant and ushered in the New Covenant with His death on the cross.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
And Paul says otherwise:
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse, because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man—and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things. Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due. And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful; who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.
God’s Wrath on Unrighteousness - For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. For since the creation of the world His...
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The Law of Moses, and its proscribed punishments, do not bind those of us under the New Covenant.
A Covenant is a kind of law.
No one today is under the New Covenant. That includes you.
And yes, those under the New Covenant were indeed bound by the law.
As Paul points out:
For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”
The Law Brings a Curse - For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”
www.biblegateway.com
I do not condone sin, but it is not my charge to punish it,
No one said it was.
That responsibility belongs solely to the government, and by extension, those who act under it's authority.
only point it out and show people there is a better way.
You should be condemning evil, and be calling for justice.
It was just under the Old Covenant, under Mosaic Law. But the New Covenant sets a somewhat different standard.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
The problem with legislating morality is that it does not work.
Yes, it does.
All a law can do, any law including God's laws, is point out unacceptable behavior and proscribe a punishment.
There are 5 commands within the Ten Commandments that are the basis for ANY righteous justice system. Four of them are for crimes, and the fifth is for determining motive, but isn't a law against a crime in and of itself.
Take a law against homosexuality. In many Muslim countries have the death penalty for homosexuality. They put a lot of people to death for this. DO they have fewer homosexuals that us? No.
Yes, they do, despite what the mainstream media tells you.
They just have many homosexuals that are successfully hiding their homosexuality.
Thanks for directly contradicting what you just said.
Has the law changed their morality? Not even a little bit.
The point is not to "change their morality."
The point of a law is to deter criminals from acting out their criminal desires.
And used properly, it is a tutor to bring men to Christ, to make them recognize that they are in need of a new heart.
Does this matter? Consider that Jesus said that, under the law, a man who looks at a woman with lust in their heart is guilty of adultery.
Supra, re: half of the Ten Commandments
Laws do not change peoples hearts
Paul disagrees with you.
Therefore
the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
www.biblegateway.com
So does Solomon, the wisest man to have ever lived, even in his fallen state:
Because
the sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore
the heart of the sons of men
is fully set in them to do evil.
Because the sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.
www.biblegateway.com
and Jesus is concerned about what is in our hearts.
Jesus cares about what is good and just.
