God's ability according to Calvinism

[allsmiles]

Now why would God predestine that mistake from the foundation of
the earth?

Must have made him happy somehow.

 

[GuySmiley]

Must have made him happy somehow...

I think the proper Calvinist answer is: "For His glory of course!"

 

[allsmiles]

I think the proper Calvinist answer is: "For His glory of course!"

According to his good pleasure.

Isaiah 46:9 Remember the former things, those of long ago;
I am God, and there is no other;
I am God, and there is none like me.

10 I make known the end from the beginning,
from ancient times, what is still to come.
I say: My purpose will stand,
and I will do all that I please.

11 From the east I summon a bird of prey;
from a far-off land, a man to fulfill my purpose.
What I have said, that will I bring about;
what I have planned, that will I do.

 

[GuySmiley]

According to his good pleasure.

Isaiah 46:9 Remember the former things, those of long ago;
I am God, and there is no other;
I am God, and there is none like me.

10 I make known the end from the beginning,
from ancient times, what is still to come.
I say: My purpose will stand,
and I will do all that I please.

11 From the east I summon a bird of prey;
from a far-off land, a man to fulfill my purpose.
What I have said, that will I bring about;
what I have planned, that will I do.

Amen!

God makes plans and causes them to happen. He does what He says He will do (who could stop Him?), unless He changes His mind for righteous reasons. Now how would those verses fit in a a Calvinist view with the times that God did not carry out his plan? What about when God said He'd do something and then didn't?

 

[allsmiles]

Amen!

God makes plans and causes them to happen. He does what He says He will do (who could stop Him?), unless He changes His mind for righteous reasons. Now how would those verses fit in a a Calvinist view with the times that God did not carry out his plan? What about when God said He'd do something and then didn't?

Thanks!

Brings me back to my question to Shimei earlier (with some modifications):

Why would a sovereign God want or need to change his mind?

 

[drbrumley]

Thanks!

Brings me back to my question to Shimei earlier (with some modifications):

Why would a sovereign God want or need to change his mind?

Because He loves us? :think:

Because He would like us to be with Him? :think: In which case I would say this is true, and has given us ample opportunity but there are those that refuse His gracious offer.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

According to his good pleasure.

Yep, no doubt God makes plans and carries them out!

However.....
Just because we know that God makes plans certainly that doesn't justify jumping to the conclusion that everything that happens is exhaustively planned by God. Heck even you and I make plans and even you and I carry out those plans from time to time.

What if God planned..... that He not plan EVERYTHING? Do you suppose that's a possibility?

In other words... what if leaving the future mostly unsettled was.... "According to His good pleasure"?

 

[allsmiles]

Because He loves us? :think:

The bible teaches that he loves some of us.

Psalms 11:4 The LORD is in his holy temple;
the LORD is on his heavenly throne.
He observes the sons of men;
his eyes examine them.

5 The LORD examines the righteous,
but the wicked and those who love violence
his soul hates.

6 On the wicked he will rain
fiery coals and burning sulfur;
a scorching wind will be their lot.

 

[drbrumley]

The bible teaches that he loves some of us.

John 3:16 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
Copyright © 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003 by Holman Bible Publishers, Nashville Tennessee. All rights reserved.


16"For God loved (A) the world in this way: He gave His One and Only (B) Son, (C) so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish but have eternal life. (D)

Cross references:

John 3:16 : Jn 12:43; 1Co 13:1; Gl 2:20; Col 1:13; 3:12; 1Th 1:4; 2Th 2:13, 16; 1Jn 4:7-12; Jude 1;
John 3:16 : 1Jn 4:9;
John 3:16 : Jn 5:19; Heb 1:2;
John 3:16 : Jn 12:25; Rm 5:8; 1Jn 3:16; 4:9-10;

 

[allsmiles]

Yep, no doubt God makes plans and carries them out!

However.....
Just because we know that God makes plans certainly that doesn't justify jumping to the conclusion that everything that happens is exhaustively planned by God. Heck even you and I make plans and even you and I carry out those plans from time to time.

You forget Knight:

Proverbs 16:9 In his heart a man plans his course,
but the LORD determines his steps.

What if God planned..... that He not plan EVERYTHING? Do you suppose that's a possibility?

I don't have much use for "what if's" when the bible is clear in what it says is.

In other words... what if leaving the future mostly unsettled was.... "According to His good pleasure"?

That would be one thing if it was what the bible said and not simply a hypothetical that you propose.

 

[drbrumley]

Now thats an interesting transliteration. :think:

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Why would a sovereign God want or need to change his mind?

Because God is a personal God. He acts and reacts with His creation.

God is merciful, God is jealous, God is loving, God grieves, God is judgmental, God is righteous, and all of these things may require that God changes His mind based on the actions of His creation.

Jeremiah 18:7 “The instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, to pull down, and to destroy it, 8 “if that nation against whom I have spoken turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it. 9 “And the instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it, 10 “if it does evil in My sight so that it does not obey My voice, then I will relent concerning the good with which I said I would benefit it.

 

[allsmiles]

John 3:16 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
Copyright © 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003 by Holman Bible Publishers, Nashville Tennessee. All rights reserved.


16"For God loved (A) the world in this way: He gave His One and Only (B) Son, (C) so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish but have eternal life. (D)

Cross references:

John 3:16 : Jn 12:43; 1Co 13:1; Gl 2:20; Col 1:13; 3:12; 1Th 1:4; 2Th 2:13, 16; 1Jn 4:7-12; Jude 1;
John 3:16 : 1Jn 4:9;
John 3:16 : Jn 5:19; Heb 1:2;
John 3:16 : Jn 12:25; Rm 5:8; 1Jn 3:16; 4:9-10;

Sorry Doc, John 3:16 doesn't preclude predestined salvation.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

You forget Knight:

Proverbs 16:9 is predicated on the prior teaching....

Proverbs 3:5 Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; 6 In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths. 7 Do not be wise in your own eyes; Fear the LORD and depart from evil.

Do you see?

If we... lean on Him and LET Him guide us..... He will!

But if we DO NOT lean on Him (and are wise in our own eyes) He WILL NOT guide us.

 

[allsmiles]

Because God is a personal God. He acts and reacts with His creation.

God is merciful, God is jealous, God is loving, God grieves, God is judgmental, God is righteous, and all of these things may require that God changes His mind based on the actions of His creation.

Jeremiah 18:7 “The instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to pluck up, to pull down, and to destroy it, 8 “if that nation against whom I have spoken turns from its evil, I will relent of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it. 9 “And the instant I speak concerning a nation and concerning a kingdom, to build and to plant it, 10 “if it does evil in My sight so that it does not obey My voice, then I will relent concerning the good with which I said I would benefit it.

Proverbs 21:1 The king's heart is in the hand of the LORD;
he directs it like a watercourse wherever he pleases.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

If we don't look at the context of Proverbs 16 (i.e., Proverbs 3) all the thousands of times in the Bible that God is mad at man for doing something against His will we would have to assuming God was guiding the steps of the men that did the thing that He abhorred!!! :kookoo:

 

[kmoney]

Now why would God predestine that mistake from the foundation of the earth?

He loves making me look like a fool! :noid:

 

[allsmiles]

Proverbs 16:9 is predicated on the prior teaching....

Proverbs 3:5 Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; 6 In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths. 7 Do not be wise in your own eyes; Fear the LORD and depart from evil.

Do you see?

If we... lean on Him and LET Him guide us..... He will!

But if we DO NOT lean on Him (and are wise in our own eyes) He WILL NOT guide us.

16:9 doesn't say anything about guidance Knight.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Proverbs 21:1 The king's heart is in the hand of the LORD;
he directs it like a watercourse wherever he pleases.

But only if the king does what?

.....hint, hint Proverbs 3

 

[allsmiles]

If we don't look at the context of Proverbs 16 (i.e., Proverbs 3) all the thousands of times in the Bible that God is mad at man for doing something against His will we would have to assuming God was guiding the steps of the men that did the thing that He abhorred!!! :kookoo:

It's almost as if it makes no sense at all...:think: