Nope, that absolutely cannot be what you believe because that is almost the same as what I believe; and you have seen it in my testimony which you have been continually mocking. I do not believe you: your testimony is a joke because either way you are lying. How can you believe the same thing I do and yet continually lie the way you have been lying? You have posted links to my testimony, (when I never asked for any such thing and never sent you there in the first place), so anyone can now go and see that you are lying one way or the other. I suppose that is what you get for blaspheming the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of my heavenly Father.
Establishment of the Identity of Christ and The Destruction of the Temple
- Thread starter northwye
- Start date
Nope, that absolutely cannot be what you believe because that is almost the same as what I believe; and you have seen it in my testimony which you have been continually mocking. I do not believe you: your testimony is a joke because either way you are lying. How can you believe the same thing I do and yet continually lie the way you have been lying? You have posted links to my testimony, (when I never asked for any such thing and never sent you there in the first place), so anyone can now go and see that you are lying one way or the other. I suppose that is what you get for blaspheming the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of my heavenly Father.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
It may be well to discuss these subjects on the threads dedicated to them, since it seems we have many preconceptions and presuppositions going on regarding these matters. As far as 'seeking' anything, I don't know,....I'm always asking, seeking and knocking as Jesus encourages, since only those who do so...LEARN anything. Research in life is on-going, since conditional existence itself is subject to change, evolution, eternal progression, transformation.
As far as life on other planets goes, I gather there are beings of varying degrees of evolution and advancement, both spiritually and with technology. I don't see any logic or reason to conclude otherwise, or evidence that suggests otherwise.
Epoisses
New member
You're so annoying.
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Thanks, my pesky true believer friend!
:thumb:
Amen, and the nourishment is ultimately The Word, which is The Testimony of Messiah, which according to the allegories and teachings of his apostles is tantamount and equivalent to his blood because he paid for his Testimony with his own life, (which has been explained to LA both in that closed thread and in several other places). That is why the passages I quoted do not say, "Shall be poured out", or, "Is about to be poured out", no, but rather, "Is being poured out", because it concerns his holy Testimony which is SPIRIT and LIFE. Those who do not wish to DO and WALK his Testimony apparently find it easier to pretend they are drinking human blood or "God-Man" blood, (aka Catholicism and transubstantiation).
The penal substitutionary death model of 'blood-atonement' is especially backwards and illogical to true spiritual intelligence, since divine LOVE does not demand bloodshed, but only requires a re-turning to truth, love, integrity, ....a true 'repentance'. This has always been the calling of the prophets, and always will be, since 'repentance' is key to soul-transformation (changing one's mind, thoughts, directives, motives, intentions). Love does no harm, neither does it DEMAND the death of another to 'atone' for sins, since the soul must atone for its own sins by repentance, reparation, and all it can do to make amends thru restitution, while all is ultimately absolved by 'forgiveness'.
Epoisses
New member
Another truth that has been twisted to the extreme is that Adam and Eve and the angels were giants compared to people today. It is estimated that Adam and Eve were upwards of 16 to 18 feet tall which is three times larger than people today. I have been studying creation science for 20 years and the earth prior to the flood had a canopy that enabled people, animals and plant life to grow like nothing we see today. So at the beginning of time man was perfect and since then our ages have shortened and our height and stature has shrunken as well. Basically the exact opposite of evolutionary teaching.
Very true, and those things are found in the Torah and even all of the Tanach, and therefore I hope you do not go down that dualism trail with Marcion, (I saw those comments), for he was a true Gnostic dualist; not that he did not believe in the "Old Testament God", he did, but instead taught that the "Old Testament God" was evil, (the "Demiurge"). I fear for you friend, that direction will remove any foundation you have left for anything you believe. The Torah is spiritual even as Paul says; it has to do with cutting off sin and evil, (not literal physical human beings or people).
Epoisses
New member
Very true, and those things are found in the Torah and even all of the Tanach, and therefore I hope you do not go down that dualism trail with Marcion, (I saw those comments), for he was a true Gnostic dualist; not that he did not believe in the "Old Testament God", he did, but instead taught that the "Old Testament God" was evil, (the "Demiurge"). I fear for you friend, that direction will remove any foundation you have left for anything you believe. The Torah is spiritual even as Paul says; it has to do with cutting off sin and evil, (not literal physical human beings or people).
The Torah is abolished for believers who live by faith.
Your mistake is in thinking that because I have visions and dreams in my testimony that my doctrine is based on those things: it is not, and that is why I have no need to use any of that here. All of my arguments are based in the scripture which I post; which you have foolishly called the doctrines of devils.
Interplanner
Well-known member
Thanks for the note on giantism (too bad it is not in an evolution thread) but...if I'm not mistaken, your first line says the opposite of the rest of the paragraph. Twisted? You mean denied, I think.
Epoisses
New member
One of my favorite creation scientists is Dr. Carl Baugh who has since retired but still runs the Creation Evidence museum in Glen Rose, Texas.
http://www.creationevidence.org/
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Very true, and those things are found in the Torah and even all of the Tanach, and therefore I hope you do not go down that dualism trail with Marcion, (I saw those comments), for he was a true Gnostic dualist; not that he did not believe in the "Old Testament God", he did, but instead taught that the "Old Testament God" was evil, (the "Demiurge"). I fear for you friend, that direction will remove any foundation you have left for anything you believe. The Torah is spiritual even as Paul says; it has to do with cutting off sin and evil, (not literal physical human beings or people).
Marcion is a wonderful character,...just researching his view as a vital part of early Christian theological developments,...and you might know....I'm very eclectic and a 'gnostic' at heart, meaning I value 'gnosis' as being the key to any religious experience, because it is only that which you come to 'know' by personal experience that has any meaning or value! - my former studies in Gnosticism in general are known to veterans here, in former threads such as 'Gnostic Cosmology', and lets not forget our extant thread 'The Gospel of Thomas', which we are still doing commentary on
While in the Marcion vein of things, and being philosophically quite LIBERAL,...you should come to know freelight sails on his own wings,...but its the spirit behind the wind that counts
- YES, I do have reservations for some of the portrayals of 'yhwh' in the OT, some quite cruel and merciless, so that many may have been justified to assume the God and Father of Jesus was NOT the 'yhwh' of the OT, so just exploring this POSSIBILITY. My Unitarian musings previously have of course been more in line with your view that YHWH is the 'Heavenly Father' of all,...but putting that on the shelf for a while, while never of course denying that absolute REALITY itself, being what is, since no matter what I believe about IT, it will always BE anyways - I'm on a new evolutionary tier,...so enjoying a 'new view' from there.Interplanner
Well-known member
There is a setting aside of the ritual or ceremonial law now that Christ and the Spirit have come but not core standards and morals. This has nothing to do with gnosticism.
At the center of Messianic teaching is that 'by His (Messiah's) experience, he will justify many.'--Is. 53. So what we really need to know and being talking about is his event, and what justification from sins is. Again, in this sense, the historic Christian faith is not a matter of private, secret knowledge among some adepts.
At the center of Messianic teaching is that 'by His (Messiah's) experience, he will justify many.'--Is. 53. So what we really need to know and being talking about is his event, and what justification from sins is. Again, in this sense, the historic Christian faith is not a matter of private, secret knowledge among some adepts.
Romans 7:25 The Scriptures (2009)
25 Thanks to Elohim, through יהושע Messiah our Master! So then, with the mind I myself truly serve the Torah of Elohim, [which is Horeb and of above] but with the flesh the torah of sin [which is Sinai and of below].
Lol, you cannot even cut off sin from within your members because you abolished the "tools" necessary to do the will of Elohim. And if you do not do the will of Elohim you cannot be sanctified, and you cannot receive the Promise according to the scripture, (Heb 10:36 KJV, 1Thes 4:3).
1 Thessalonians 4:1-8 KJV
1 Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more.
2 For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus.
3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:
4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:
6 That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.
7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.
Hebrews 10:35-39 KJV
35 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward.
36 For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.
39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
You are not so "saved" as you imagine in the machinations of your vain imagination; for you have not yet been tested so as to see whether or not you are worthy of becoming a son of the kingdom. You are just a babe, a suckling, still milking on the Word from Jerusalem of above, the mother covenant of us all, Oh, wait, you have abolished your own mother! LOL, you curse your own covenant-mother! Do you not believe in allegories even when Paul explicitly tells you that he speaks of an allegory? Yes, Jerusalem of above is our mother-COVENANT, and yet you say the "old covenant" is abolished. You do not even have the milk to suckle on: the only option left for you is the sickle of the Reaper. No wonder you are walking dead and about to be pruned from the Vine. And if you want any ideas as to how it all might go down for you, well, I already told you in my testimony! LOL, and yet you scoffed! But who will laugh last? All the holy ones will know whether or not you overcame in your day and hour, O mighty one, or whether you end up the twice dead rotting carcass of a reprobate-castaway fish, (for the kingdom of the heavens is like a net). In the "afterglow days" perhaps you will consider it perfectly; but it will not be a fire to be warmed by. :chuckle:
Thanks, my pesky true believer friend!
:thumb:
Amen, and the nourishment is ultimately The Word, which is The Testimony of Messiah, which according to the allegories and teachings of his apostles is tantamount and equivalent to his blood because he paid for his Testimony with his own life, (which has been explained to LA both in that closed thread and in several other places). That is why the passages I quoted do not say, "Shall be poured out", or, "Is about to be poured out", no, but rather, "Is being poured out", because it concerns his holy Testimony which is SPIRIT and LIFE. Those who do not wish to DO and WALK his Testimony apparently find it easier to pretend they are drinking human blood or "God-Man" blood, (aka Catholicism and transubstantiation).
Stupidity.
Christ's blood was shed to atone for the sins of men.
Jesus paid the price which no man could.
We who are saved, acknowledge the sacrifice of Christ on our behalf.
LA
Daqq does not believe Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of the Torah.
He wants it that the old covenant of law is still in effect and not abolished.
Daqq thinks He can eat and drink of the torah while denying the atoning work of the blood of Christ.
We can tell that he is well practiced in defending his heresy after years of denying Christ in Christian forums.
LA
How can you still not understand that calling people stupid, and piling on more accusations, doesn't prove anything except that you think kicking dust into the air will hide your lack of ability to answer? Get back to me when you have incorporated the following statements into your doctrine and you can adequately explain how and why they are true:
John 1:18a ASV
18a No man hath seen God at any time;
1 John 4:12a ASV
12a No man hath beheld God at any time:
You cannot handle being forced to confess to what the scripture actually says because you too are word-sorcerer who subverts the scripture to your own means and ends. For the same reason you closed your own call out thread about atonement when you saw that you have no answers for the scripture passages which refute you to your face.
Exactly as I said, LA the coward and hypocrite, for she opened the thread back up for less than twenty four hours, and having returned, and having seen all of the argument that was posted from the scripture, what does she do? Instead of even attempting any answers whatsoever she closes the thread again.
http://theologyonline.com/showthread.php?123355-Atonement-without-blood-according-to-Freelight/page8
And now, LA, since it is perfectly obvious that you have not even a shred of evidence to support any of your carnal understanding, and since you are incapable of putting up, please do shut up, and desist from all of your false witnessing and lying about myself and the position which I hold from within the confines of the scripture. You do not have any clue what the scripture teaches and therefore it is you who does not have Messiah as he is perfectly portrayed in the Gospel accounts, in all of his TESTIMONY, which you yourself reject.
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freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Leaning towards a more 'Restorative' Atonement view......
Leaning towards a more 'Restorative' Atonement view......
There are other more rational and sane atonement-models, which I'm also continuing to share in your thread on my 'beliefs' thereon,....and will continue to share more video presentations. There are also non-canonical texts, spirit messages and channeled teachings which also share a rejection of the 'penal substitutionary atonement model' (made popular by Anslem in 11th century). However, the most common atonement-concept in the first millennium of church history was more along the lines of the classic 'Christus Victor' understanding within the 'ransom-theory' paradigm, where Jesus death, burial and resurrection liberate man from the influence and power of sin, death, hell and satan, to which man became entangled by his own tendency towards sin. Many are returning back to these original views and having issues with 'penal substitution view' as being immoral, unjust, illogical, etc.
It would help anyone to study the entire field of 'atonement' within church history, its doctrinal developments. - just as there is variety and different views and insights into the definition and function of 'atonement', we each will choose that model that best fits our understanding at any time, continuing to research and learn, and if a genuine truth-seeker...remain open to progressive revelation.
Penal Substition
Leaning towards a more 'Restorative' Atonement view......
There are other more rational and sane atonement-models, which I'm also continuing to share in your thread on my 'beliefs' thereon,....and will continue to share more video presentations. There are also non-canonical texts, spirit messages and channeled teachings which also share a rejection of the 'penal substitutionary atonement model' (made popular by Anslem in 11th century). However, the most common atonement-concept in the first millennium of church history was more along the lines of the classic 'Christus Victor' understanding within the 'ransom-theory' paradigm, where Jesus death, burial and resurrection liberate man from the influence and power of sin, death, hell and satan, to which man became entangled by his own tendency towards sin. Many are returning back to these original views and having issues with 'penal substitution view' as being immoral, unjust, illogical, etc.
It would help anyone to study the entire field of 'atonement' within church history, its doctrinal developments. - just as there is variety and different views and insights into the definition and function of 'atonement', we each will choose that model that best fits our understanding at any time, continuing to research and learn, and if a genuine truth-seeker...remain open to progressive revelation.
Penal Substition
LA closed that thread again, (see my previous post above herein).