Did Christ die for all men?

[dodge]

He spoke of it yes, preached it, no. To what crowd and where?

Spoke -preach- are we now splitting hairs....I do not recall saying Jesus "preached" His DBR I said Paul preached NOTHING that Jesus had not already told them.

Jesus spoke of His DBR at several different places and at several different times....

 

[Bright Raven]

Spoke -preach- are we now splitting hairs....I do not recall saying Jesus "preached" His DBR I said Paul preached NOTHING that Jesus had not already told them.

Jesus spoke of His DBR at several different places and at several different times....

Jesus never preached his DBR for salvation.

 

[dodge]

Jesus never preached his DBR for salvation.

Sure He did ! Sorry you cannot SEE it.

Luk 22:20
Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

 

[journey]

Romans 16:25-27 KJV Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, 26. But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith: 27. To God only wise, be glory through Jesus Christ for ever. Amen. Written to the Romans from Corinthus, and sent by Phebe servant of the church at Cenchrea.

1 Corinthians 2:7-8 KJV 7. But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: 8. Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

1 Corinthians 15:50-53 KJV 50. Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52. In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

Ephesians 3:1-7 KJV For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles, 2. If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: 3. How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, 4. Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) 5. Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; 6. That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel: 7. Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

There's much more. These are just a few samples.

 

[Prizebeatz1]

Jo 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.


1Jo 1:10
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

The personality is overly identified with sinfulness and we take this identity to be all of who and what we are. It doesn't know that it's true identity is the soul which is infinite and eternal. Like Father like Son. The soul is the source of real unconditional self-worth and cannot be replaced. It does not depend on how well one can adhere to a belief, Jesus and/or the Bible nor does it depend on events, circumstances, conditions or situations. No one is saying we are not sinful because we are but taking the infinite and eternal part of us into account quickly and easily overshadows our sinfulness to the point where it doesn't matter anymore. The more we learn about it, the more we see how much the soul parallels Jesus. This is not a coincidence because Jesus is an allegory for the soul.

 

[Sonnet]

Paul preached the revelation given him by Jesus Christ;

Galatians 1:11-13 New International Version (NIV)

Paul Called by God
11 I want you to know, brothers and sisters, that the gospel I preached is not of human origin. 12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.

13 For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it.

As did the other apostles - 1 Cor 15:11. Galatians 1:8-9.

 

[Sonnet]

Sonnet, You do believe that Jesus was a Jew, don't you? If your reply is "yes", his Faith was Judaism and not Christianity. Do you agree? I am sure you do. If his Faith was Judaism, it is only obvious that his Bible was the Tanach. In that case, he could not have died for the sins of all people because the Prophets of the Most High teach that no one can die for the sins of another. If you don't believe what I am saying, you can read it from Jeremiah 31:30 and Ezekiel 18:20. So, the answer is "no". Jesus did not die for our sins. Do you understand what I mean?

Jewish - of the house of David, yes. Judaism, yes. Tanach, yes.

Since Jesus was not a mere man, then I do not see how those scriptures apply.

 

[Sonnet]

The disciples did not understand what he said. The twelve did not preach the cross. Supply scripture.

After his death they did.

 

[Sonnet]

The Gospel of the Kingdom is a Gospel of repentance not the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus. The following is the Gospel f the Kingdom.

Acts 2:38 New King James Version (NKJV)

38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

No death, burial and resurrection here.

22“Fellow Israelites, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know. 23This man was handed over to you by God’s deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross. 24 But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him.

 

[beloved57]

Wrong!

From compelling truth.org

How is salvation not about work when faith is required? Isn't faith a work?

The famous nineteenth century British pastor Charles Spurgeon once explained that when we are saved, we first think it was because we decided to follow Christ. Yet as we come to understand our sin and God's greatness, we realize we would never have chosen to follow Him unless He had first placed the desire within us. This illustration accurately describes what the Bible communicates regarding our human role in salvation. We are saved by God's grace upon us that leads us to place our faith in Him.

Faith is not a work because it is something God must do within us. On our own, we are sinful and would never choose Christ apart from His leading us to Himself. In fact, when we realize the extent to which God has worked to freely offer us salvation, we realize we can take no credit for our salvation. It is only because of Him.

First, God's love is the initiator: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life" (John 3:16).

Second, Jesus is the author of our faith: "looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God" (Hebrews 12:2). Christ provides the opportunity for salvation and then offers it to us personally. Without Him, we would not have an option for salvation (Acts 4:12).

Third, we are saved for good works, not by good works: "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" (Ephesians 2:10).

Believing is not a work, but a response to what God is doing in our lives. No one is righteous (Romans 3:10). We are not saved by works we have done (Titus 3:5). Only Christ can save.

We may not completely understand the full distinction between our faith response and God's salvation in our lives. However, it is clear in Scripture that salvation is not something we earn by any work yet we must trust in Him by faith. Perhaps the analogy of a gift found in Ephesians 2:8-9 best expresses this idea: "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." Work is contrasted with a gift.

When we receive a gift, we do not consider it "work" to open the gift. What we have received is free. We simply need to open it to enjoy it. The same is true of salvation. It is a gift God freely offers. We need not work to earn it. Rather, we only need to receive it. When we do, we experience joy and desire to share this joy with others.

Faith is a work of the law that ought to have been done Matt 23:23

Sent from my 5054N using TheologyOnline mobile app

 

[TulipBee]

Wrong!

From compelling truth.org

How is salvation not about work when faith is required? Isn't faith a work?

The famous nineteenth century British pastor Charles Spurgeon once explained that when we are saved, we first think it was because we decided to follow Christ. Yet as we come to understand our sin and God's greatness, we realize we would never have chosen to follow Him unless He had first placed the desire within us. This illustration accurately describes what the Bible communicates regarding our human role in salvation. We are saved by God's grace upon us that leads us to place our faith in Him.

Faith is not a work because it is something God must do within us. On our own, we are sinful and would never choose Christ apart from His leading us to Himself. In fact, when we realize the extent to which God has worked to freely offer us salvation, we realize we can take no credit for our salvation. It is only because of Him.

First, God's love is the initiator: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life" (John 3:16).

Second, Jesus is the author of our faith: "looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God" (Hebrews 12:2). Christ provides the opportunity for salvation and then offers it to us personally. Without Him, we would not have an option for salvation (Acts 4:12).

Third, we are saved for good works, not by good works: "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" (Ephesians 2:10).

Believing is not a work, but a response to what God is doing in our lives. No one is righteous (Romans 3:10). We are not saved by works we have done (Titus 3:5). Only Christ can save.

We may not completely understand the full distinction between our faith response and God's salvation in our lives. However, it is clear in Scripture that salvation is not something we earn by any work yet we must trust in Him by faith. Perhaps the analogy of a gift found in Ephesians 2:8-9 best expresses this idea: "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." Work is contrasted with a gift.

When we receive a gift, we do not consider it "work" to open the gift. What we have received is free. We simply need to open it to enjoy it. The same is true of salvation. It is a gift God freely offers. We need not work to earn it. Rather, we only need to receive it. When we do, we experience joy and desire to share this joy with others.

" I got down on my knees and received Jesus Christ as my Savior" -. Michael Houdmann. This is salvation by works. You get your answers from this guy

 

[Sonnet]

" I got down on my knees and received Jesus Christ as my Savior" -. Michael Houdmann. This is salvation by works. You get your answers from this guy

Not if Houdmann was admitting that there nothing he could do to be righteous; nothing in his own strength.

 

[TulipBee]

Not if Houdmann was admitting that there nothing he could do to be righteous; nothing in his own strength.

Can't mix the gospel like that. You have to be truthful and give God 100% credit. Not 99%

 

[Sonnet]

Can't mix the gospel like that. You have to be truthful and give God 100% credit. Not 99%

There can be not a vestige of works righteousness contained in faith, else faith is faith. For Paul says:

Brothers and sisters, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved. For I can testify about them that they are zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge. Since they did not know the righteousness of God and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.

Moses writes this about the righteousness that is by the law: “The person who does these things will live by them.” But the righteousness that is by faith says: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down) “or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”d that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

If faith were not possible without God's predetermined election then Paul is lying.

 

[TulipBee]

There can be not a vestige of works righteousness contained in faith, else faith is faith. For Paul says:

Brothers and sisters, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved. For I can testify about them that they are zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge. Since they did not know the righteousness of God and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. Christ is the culmination of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.

Moses writes this about the righteousness that is by the law: “The person who does these things will live by them.” But the righteousness that is by faith says: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down) “or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”d that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

If faith were not possible without God's predetermined election then Paul is lying.

You frequently suggest Paul could be liar through new age auto suggestions like we're stupid enough to believe in your private interpretations. You're unconsciously believing Paul is a liar when you hear Calvinist's text proofs with truths that cuts to the core of your bones. Impossible to think Calvinism hold lies in the bible cause they believe in inerrancy. You may have to make another look at "may be" to check you might be missing something. Are you really going to ramble on forever that carelessly?

God is at two places at two different times at once and you say it isn't possible and help God through cooperation and works like God is waiting for you to believe on your own without God's envolvment. You're not on auto run. It is God that runs the universe. Your not separate from God. Your free will are imaginations.

 

[Ben Masada]

Jewish - of the house of David, yes. Judaism, yes. Tanach, yes.

Since Jesus was not a mere man, then I do not see how those scriptures apply.

You insist that Jesus was not a mere man; but then you go one step further to say that he was from the House of David. I understand what you mean because you don't think with a Jewish mind as Jesus was. To be from the House of David, Jesus had to be from the Tribe of Judah and, for such, he had to be a biological son of Joseph who was the one from that Tribe. Why? Because genealogy descent goes down into the next generation only through the father. If Joseph was not his biological father, Jesus could not have been from the Tribe of Judah. Since the Messiah must be from the Tribe of Judah, Jesus could not have been the Messiah. So, in what sense was he not a mere Jewish man?

The bottom line is that you are living a contradiction.

 

[Sonnet]

You insist that Jesus was not a mere man; but then you go one step further to say that he was from the House of David. I understand what you mean because you don't think with a Jewish mind as Jesus was. To be from the House of David, Jesus had to be from the Tribe of Judah and, for such, he had to be a biological son of Joseph who was the one from that Tribe. Why? Because genealogy descent goes down into the next generation only through the father. If Joseph was not his biological father, Jesus could not have been from the Tribe of Judah. Since the Messiah must be from the Tribe of Judah, Jesus could not have been the Messiah. So, in what sense was he not a mere Jewish man?

The bottom line is that you are living a contradiction.

The Jewish Apostles disagree with you - so it cannot be as clear cut as you say.

 

[Sonnet]

You frequently suggest Paul could be liar through new age auto suggestions like we're stupid enough to believe in your private interpretations. You're unconsciously believing Paul is a liar when you hear Calvinist's text proofs with truths that cuts to the core of your bones. Impossible to think Calvinism hold lies in the bible cause they believe in inerrancy. You may have to make another look at "may be" to check you might be missing something. Are you really going to ramble on forever that carelessly?

God is at two places at two different times at once and you say it isn't possible and help God through cooperation and works like God is waiting for you to believe on your own without God's envolvment. You're not on auto run. It is God that runs the universe. Your not separate from God. Your free will are imaginations.

You didn't actually deal with what I wrote.

 

[TulipBee]

You didn't actually deal with what I wrote.

You theology is wrong. Thats why you don't know what you're writing.

 

[Bright Raven]

Hebrews 2:9 New King James Version (NKJV)

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone.