Christian Man Asks Thirteen Gay Bakeries To Bake Him Pro-Traditional Marriage Cake

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
Yes it does. Not sure where you live, but here in the US court rulings do matter, especially to those who are involved in the case.

I notice all you can address is the court ruling on a morality issue that is God's determination only.

And since you've violated the law, you're a hypocrite to ever stand for it as the standard for character and conduct.

Nice try, though. Hate-monger.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
Yes it does. Not sure where you live, but here in the US court rulings do matter, especially to those who are involved in the case.

So... You don't think US citizens should be able to exercise their religious freedoms and/or challenge laws that specifically target tenets of their faith?

Noted.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
The best way for Christian bakeries to weather this onslaught of haranguing by liberals and hate-mongers would simply be to estsblish outrageous prices and then discount to professing (hetero)sexual Believers.
 

Jose Fly

New member
So... You don't think US citizens should be able to exercise their religious freedoms

Sure they can, up to a point (like when they butt up against someone else's rights).

and/or challenge laws that specifically target tenets of their faith?

Of course they are free to challenge the laws. But they also have to be prepared to accept the results if they don't go their way.

Branding someone a fundamentalist because of moral conviction is very pejorative toward liberals; implying they're immoral.

So you're not a fundamentalist Christian?

The best way for Christian bakeries to weather this onslaught of haranguing by liberals and hate-mongers would simply be to estsblish outrageous prices and then discount to professing (hetero)sexual Believers.

Sorta like Sharia Law.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
Sure, up to a point (like when they butt up against someone else's rights).

Ah, yes. The ever-moving and changing issue of "rights" and what they are for whom.

But rights are God-given. You're actually speaking of privileges granted by man's government. Privileges may be rescinded. Rights cannot. (Though the agenda has been to conflate the two, and they're succeeding because of willful ignorance like yours and your peers.)

Few Christians would argue that homosexuals don't have the legal right of sexual preference. Again, that has nothing to do with the institution of marriage. Or at least until man's government plays God as they've been doing.

Of course they are free to challenge the laws. But they also have to be prepared to accept the results if they don't go their way.

And that has nothing to do with morality. Legality does not intrinsically correlate to morality.

So you're not a fundamentalist Christian?

I doubt there's much I'd define as you do; so likely not, according to your perverted semantics.

Sorta like Sharia Law.

No. Not in the least.

Nice try again, though.

You provocational hate-mongering liberals are your own form of fundamentalist. And that's not a complimentary statement.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
The best way for Christian bakeries to weather this onslaught of haranguing by liberals and hate-mongers would simply be to estsblish outrageous prices and then discount to professing (hetero)sexual Believers.

Sorta like Sharia Law.

I live in a large state university city. Local property management companies routinely establish very high rates and then discount by 50% to college students to prevent having non-student tenants.

Those damn Sharia Law property companies.

Cry about that, Fly man.
 

Jose Fly

New member
Ah, yes. The ever-moving and changing issue of "rights" and what they are for whom.

But rights are God-given. You're actually speaking of privileges granted by man's government. Privileges may be rescinded. Rights cannot. (Though the agenda has been to conflate the two, and they're succeeding because of willful ignorance like yours and your peers.)

Few Christians would argue that homosexuals don't have the legal right of sexual preference. Again, that has nothing to do with the institution of marriage. Or at least until man's government plays God as they've been doing.

Look, I realize some folks like you would prefer to live in a Christian theocracy, but the fact is we don't. We live in a deliberately crafted secular democratic republic.

I live in a large state university city. Local property management companies routinely establish very high rates and then discount by 50% to college students to prevent having non-student tenants.

Those damn Sharia Law property companies.

If you truly and honestly think that's the same thing, I'll just let that speak for itself.
 

Interplanner

Well-known member
"This document will not work unless there is a degree of godliness and virtue in its people; otherwise, it may actually damage the country." --a few signators of the US Constitution
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
Look, I realize some folks like you would prefer to live in a Christian theocracy, but the fact is we don't. We live in a deliberately crafted secular democratic republic.

And I realize you and many other reprobates want to excise God and His standards from humanity and pretend that any form of replacement human standards have any authority or validity.

Then you should abandon all Judeo-Christian ethics, including the title and institution of marriage. A legal civil union would be fine in its stread.

Amazing how it has taken well over 2 centuries to get around to redefining marriage from the Biblical standard. It took two hundred years of anti-christ culture-sculpting to produce hearts and minds like you and your self-righteous hate-mongering peers.

With your relativism, there is no absolute standard for anything. Nothing can be validly prohibited. Murder can be any form of control, just as abortion is now predominantly belated irresponsible birth control. Euthanasia is and will be next, as will many other forms.

Sexual immorality will also follow suit. Pedophilia and other aberrances will be on the slate next for marriage and its imminent constant redefining by secularists destroying the very fabric of humanity.

If you truly and honestly think that's the same thing, I'll just let that speak for itself.

You're actually right. They're not the same thing. The property management discrimination is much worse.

But it's still a double standard to say virtually everything that comes out of your mouth.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
...should abandon all Judeo-Christian ethics, including the title and institution of marriage. A legal civil union would be fine in its stread.
But really, if you're understanding that, then making noise about the noise we wrap it in seems superfluous...and whenever we cobble legal synonyms it typically doesn't work out (see: separate but equal).

So why not let people who value marriage in the traditional sense keep getting married in churches, with God's blessing and valuing it as they are instructed to do and bear witness for those who do not?

Sexual immorality will also follow suit.
Follow suit? Did you miss the 60s? About as sexually out of bounds a time as you could cobble.

Pedophilia and other aberrances will be on the slate next for marriage
Well, no. Pedophilia violates so much of the larger cannon of law even without a fairly universal loathing that transcends religious creed, that it can't reasonably be advanced as something society will embrace. I've given the reasons for that prior, but if you're interested will set them out again, beginning with biological evidence in support of the historically experiential understanding, running through how laws protecting children have actually gotten better, even since the so-called sexual revolution and ending with the foundation of consent and capacity in contract.

You'll likely get arguments for polygamy that could have teeth, depending on how a court looks at it in foundation, whether the case can be made that it's by nature exploitative and unstable, the enemy of what society expects from marriage. Outside of that, I suppose yahoos of various stripes will do what they always have and attempt a legitimacy they'll never arrive at, but that's access for you, not victory.
 

TracerBullet

New member
Oh... And if I owned a bakery, I would provide wedding cakes to any and all homosexuals who came in. I'd use the opportunity to demonstrate God's unconditional love in every way I could every time I spoke with them.

But others shouldn't be forced to provide retail services to anyone they choose not to serve.

If you hate-mongers can censor a historical flag and other things because of a racist murderer, then Christians should be able to stand for the sanctity of marriage as being between man and woman.

What if those others who provide retail services choose to not serve black people?
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
But really, if you're understanding that, then making noise about the noise we wrap it in seems superfluous...and whenever we cobble legal synonyms it typically doesn't work out (see: separate but equal).

If you're an actual Christian by true and unfeigned faith, it shouldn't be difficult to understand the points the secular relativistic culture-induced propaganda and agenda is intentionally skewing and dismissing.

So why not let people who value marriage in the traditional sense keep getting married in churches, with God's blessing and valuing it as they are instructed to do and bear witness for those who do not?

Call it civil union with parallel privileges to the institution of marriage; prevent discrimination against Christians for standing for traditional marriage; and it's all good on all fronts.

No punitive action against churches or Christians for discretionary exclusion which is not discrimination.

Follow suit? Did you miss the 60s? About as sexually out of bounds a time as you could cobble.

Yep, and those fruit loops are the ones through whom the spirit of antichrist is perpetrating so much in all the culture-sculpting since that era and those leading up to it.

Well, no. Pedophilia violates so much of the larger cannon of law even without a fairly universal loathing that transcends religious creed, that it can't reasonably be advanced as something society will embrace.

Hebephilia and ephebophilia have been societally acceptable standards in most cultures for millennia; only finding exclusion in the very modern "first world". And yes, there's already a huge push in those directions, even if it never reaches to the youngest pre-pubescent ages. Children are being unprecedentedly sexualized, and that isn't going to abate.

I've given the reasons for that prior, but if you're interested will set them out again, beginning with biological evidence in support of the historically experiential understanding, running through how laws protecting children have actually gotten better, even since the so-called sexual revolution and ending with the foundation of consent and capacity in contract.

All valid... and somewhat of a smoke screen for the sexually deviant who are running the country and the world at large.

You'll likely get arguments for polygamy that could have teeth, depending on how a court looks at it in foundation, whether the case can be made that it's by nature exploitative and unstable, the enemy of what society expects from marriage.

Just another facet to numb everyone to on the way to inclusion while perverting the Christian marriage institution further with each passing generation.

Outside of that, I suppose yahoos of various stripes will do what they always have and attempt a legitimacy they'll never arrive at, but that's access for you, not victory.

The plummet from any remaining form of sense and reason is well underway. It is unrecoverable from a Christian standpoint.

Your anti-Christian "reasoning" is very saddening.
 

PneumaPsucheSoma

TOL Subscriber
What if those others who provide retail services choose to not serve black people?

Typical. Make an immensely minority argument and attempt to establish it as majority practice; then make all discretionary business decisions into bias and prejudice.

How 'bout convicted felons, especially registered sex offenders and violent offenders? Tell me how unbiased you are toward them, hypocrite.

Toss in the Christians you discriminate against, and you're exposed as the script-flipping hate-monger you are.
 
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