California lawmakers seek to end 'personal belief' vaccine exemptions

[zoo22]

Interesting chart of vaccination impact on measles in the US:

(Cases per 100,000 people).

More info and charts here:

Battling Infectious Diseases in the 20th Century: The Impact of Vaccines

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

Though it is clear to see that your opposition to the MMR isn't predicated on the particulars of the vaccine, but that you reject vaccination in whole, regardless of the statistical, clinical, or historical data even when the benefit is palpable. Unreasoned objection defined.

Why should I get a measles vaccination?

Why should my child get a measles vaccination?

Thank you for proving my point.

Measles is a relatively harmless virus with a low incidence of infection

It has low incidence of infection BECAUSE of high vaccination coverage. I have presented ample evidence of exactly this. Whenever there is a reduction in coverage rates this is a subsequent increase in outbreaks, shown in two different countries on two different continents.

and very low death rate (before the vaccine was licensed). There is evidence to suggest that measles in childhood can be beneficial.

Like pneumonia, lifelong brain damage, and deafness.

 

[elohiym]

You mean the single-jab measles vaccine that he applied for patent? Funny that.

I'm fine with you exposing the ambitions of pro-vax scientists.

 

[elohiym]

Thank you for proving my point.

You can't answer the questions at this point, can you? :chuckle:

It has low incidence of infection BECAUSE of high vaccination coverage.

There was a low incidence of infection BEFORE the vaccine was licensed.

Like pneumonia, lifelong brain damage, and deafness.

Present the odds. They're not scary, so quit being a fear-monger.

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

I'm fine with you exposing the ambitions of pro-vax scientists.

Red herring.

Your argument for why Andrew Wakefield didn't presented fraudulent findings claiming that the MMR vaccine caused autism, as the Nova article states, was that he was advocating a measles vaccine -- neglecting the fact that it wasn't the MMR vaccine he was promoting, but rather a single-jab measles vaccine he patented. Ergo the Nova article was not in error.

So much for the accuracy of PBS and NOVA. He was obviously promoting measles vaccination.

Your presumption of error on the part of the NOVA article I supplied is therefore unwarranted and contrary to the facts.

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

You can't answer the questions at this point, can you? :chuckle:

Your question has already been answered copiously.

There was a low incidence of infection BEFORE the vaccine was licensed.

Present the odds. They're not scary, so quit being a fear-monger.

Would it change your mind?

 

[elohiym]

Interesting chart of vaccination impact on measles in the US:

Kennedy and Johnson also took major steps to fight poverty in the years following the vaccine introduction. Wouldn't that reduce the incidence of the disease? We saw resurgences in measles after introduction of the vaccination that appear to have occurred coincidental with economic turmoil and high unemployment. The latest outbreak years are following in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis.

From the CDC:

From 1985 through 1988, 42% of cases occurred in persons who were vaccinated on or after their first birthday. During these years, 68% of cases in school-aged children (5–19 years) occurred among those who had been appropriately vaccinated. The occurrence of measles among previously vaccinated children (i.e., vaccine failure) led to the recommendation for a second dose in this age group.​

Is that the same vaccine that allegedly reduced the incidence of measles before 1985?

 

[elohiym]

Your question has already been answered copiously.

No, it hasn't. Where did you tell me why I should get the measles vaccine? You did say something about adults not needing to get the vaccine because measles is a childhood disease. The reasons you claim my child should get the vaccine are based on your irrational fears and pseudo-science.

Proves nothing. Here is a quote from the CDC:

Before 1963, approximately 500,000 cases and 500 deaths were reported annually, with epidemic cycles every 2–3 years. However, the actual number of cases was estimated at 3–4 million annually.​

That is a very low incidence relative to the population, and a very low death rate. You are helping to spread fear in order to sell vaccines.

Would it change your mind?

I'm not the only one reading this.

No scary odds, no scary disease.

 

[elohiym]

YWe're not talking about a marginal reduction in polio cases due to a slight change in definition.

You consider that a "slight change in definition?" Bizarre.

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

Why should my child get a measles vaccination?

why should children be protected from deadly diseases? :freak:

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

Would it change your mind?

I'm not the only one reading this.

So in other words "No"?

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

Proves nothing.

Of course not, because as we have already seen you are unpersuaded by facts.

 

[elohiym]

Okay. Forced vaccination violates the golden rule. It is also idolatry, coveting and murder.

Giving children booster shots is murder? Really??
Is that your argument?
Idolatry? Is the vaccine being worshiped?

You're grasping at straws here.

You seem to have a problem reading.

Seat-belt laws violate the golden rule. It is also idolatry, coveting and murder.

You are comparing a fine for not wearing a seat belt to forced vaccinations? Bizarre.

I'm not suggesting a nationwide mandate. I think current laws are sufficient.

If they are sufficient, why are you arguing for elimination of exemptions? Why are you willing to let children be exposed to non-vaccinated adults?

 

[elohiym]

Why should my child get a measles vaccination?

why should children be protected from deadly diseases?

You are claiming a disease with a very low death rate (before the vaccination was introduced) is a deadly disease. A dumb question based on irrational fears isn't a persuasive answer.

 

[elohiym]

Of course not, because as we have already seen you are unpersuaded by facts.

Cheap shot and a lame way of dodging the point. The problem for you is that when one considers the size of the U.S. population at the time, those numbers indicate a low risk of getting measles before the vaccine was licensed.

 

[elohiym]

So in other words "No"?

You going to keep tap dancing or present odds of developing those rare complications of measles?

 

[Granite]

Opposition to vaccinations seems to stem from the very same willful lethal stupidity that leads people to deny climate change.

Some folks, I'm convinced, have a death wish...and want to take everybody else with them.

 

[resodko]

Measles is rare in adults, and are therefore generally not vaccinated against it.

health care workers are - can you guess why?

... that leads people to deny climate change.

i don't know of anybody who denies that the climate changes :idunno:

 

[shagster01]

How about if you are too scared of God's world and the diseases in it you keep YOUR children at home.

 

[Daedalean's_Sun]

You are claiming a disease with a very low death rate (before the vaccination was introduced)

Again, those pesky facts.