Biden: To hell with God and the Church. I'm taking communion.

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass

In trying to pressure Biden, the Catholic bishops forget the lessons of JFK


In September 1960, Democratic presidential candidate John F. Kennedy, against the advice of his political consultants, confronted anti-Catholic bigotry head-on in an extraordinary speech before a hostile audience of several hundred Protestant ministers in Houston.

This was days after another group of Protestant clergy, representing 37 denominations and presided over by Norman Vincent Peale, had declared that a Roman Catholic president would be “under extreme pressure by the hierarchy of his church.”

Kennedy vowed that, if elected, the oath that he would follow was the one he took upon his inauguration to defend the U.S. Constitution.

At a time when some equated Catholic teachings to socialism, the Massachusetts senator said: “I believe in an America that is officially neither Catholic, Protestant nor Jewish; where no public official either requests or accepts instructions on public policy from the Pope, the National Council of Churches or any other ecclesiastical source; where no religious body seeks to impose its will directly or indirectly upon the general populace or the public acts of its officials.”

Kennedy’s strong stance on the separation of church and state helped secure the narrow victory that made him the first Catholic president in U.S. history.

A little more than 60 years later, a second Catholic president sits in the White House, and the church’s American bishops appear to have forgotten what it took for one of their own to get there. On Friday, the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops — defying a warning from the Vatican — voted to create guidelines for receiving the sacrament of Holy Communion.
 

Right Divider

Body part
Biden, ABORTION and communion. The abortion part is at issue, and I'm only telling you what Bob Enyart said--that abortion in this country could not have been made legal without overwhelming Republican support! But I realize that you just want to use the subject of abortion as a political football against Democrats, while ignoring it when Republicans do the same thing. You are more pro-Republican than you are anti-abortion!
I'm not pro-Republican at all. But I can see how someone with your myopia could "see it" that way.
 

Lon

Well-known member
WRONG. The key issue of this thread is abortion, and abortion could not have been made legal and kept legal in this country without overwhelming Republican support, as Pastor Enyart has documented!
Well, sort of. It is about Catholic Communion and Joe Biden as well as the reason he is not supposed to (abortion).

I am not very political except to say that this is why. Politicians aren't the answer to this nation's ills. While we have a necessary evil in participating, I think most of us realize there is no republican nor democrat that is going to be able to do much. Our national values and laws move but slowly. I don't believe anybody thought Trump was going to end abortion and I don't believe anybody thinks Biden is going to usher in a new peaceful world. We need to stay disillusioned, the media and political machine has been thriving off of partisan efforts that keep them in power. As long as we buy in, it will always be democrat or republican and neither representing most of us, well.
 

Lon

Well-known member
That's only because no republican nor democrat is willing to do much.
I'd say too many checks and balances. It was ever the voting populace's endeavor to get conservative, and prayerfully Christian Judges in the Supreme Court. From my few years on the planet, American (and Christian) values have been dismantled. If you'd told a kid today that we used to have prayer books, Bible-themed alphabets, as well as prayer and miracles given in our history books, they'd be incredulous, specifically because they are told they cannot bring God to school with them (wrongly so, but many educators don't really know the law, just what philosophy they believe and teach).

I believe (could be wrong, but don't believe I am) that this nation will have to have an evangelism burst with a revival of good wholesome Christian and family values to ever get to a place where the sins legislated, will or can be removed.

Something that has never set right with me regarding the abortion discussion: There is nearly always a mention of 'you don't care for them when they are older.' It is unfounded. Most Christian charity give toward children and many ministries are catered just for them. Almost all rescue missions are sponsored (paid for) by Christians and run by Christians. It is always a smoke-screen to continue to kill the unborn with some feigned justification. We've managed to burn and gas more babies than Germany ever has as a world. "Nazi" is no longer quite as ugly as 'us' today.
 

Lon

Well-known member
If that were true, nothing would happen.
We'd want to define 'nothing.' Small steps that guide/guard the ebb and flow of abortion? Agree, but for me it isn't what I want. I want it ended, not controlled.

I've told this story before: My aunt was told she would die if she carried her unborn baby to term and strongly encouraged to abort because 'neither of them would live.'

My aunt responded that it was in God's hands, both of their lives, not her's. She believed life is sacred alone and that we don't have rights (which is why assisted suicide has always been an issue). My cousin is alive, beautiful, and has two kids of her own.
 

Right Divider

Body part
We'd want to define 'nothing.' Small steps that guide/guard the ebb and flow of abortion? Agree, but for me it isn't what I want. I want it ended, not controlled.
The vast majority of Republicans and Democrats (those in office) are unbelievers. So they live by the "worlds ways" and that includes the kind of self-centeredness that is common in abortion advocates.
 

Lon

Well-known member
The vast majority of Republicans and Democrats (those in office) are unbelievers. So they live by the "worlds ways" and that includes the kind of self-centeredness that is common in abortion advocates.
🆙 1 Corinthians 6:6-11 When one of you has a grievance against another, does he dare go to law before the unrighteous instead of the saints? 2 Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you incompetent to try trivial cases? 3 Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life! 4 So if you have such cases, why do you lay them before those who have no standing in the church? 5 I say this to your shame. Can it be that there is no one among you wise enough to settle a dispute between the brothers, 6 but brother goes to law against brother, and that before unbelievers? 7 To have lawsuits at all with one another is already a defeat for you. Why not rather suffer wrong? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 But you yourselves wrong and defraud—even your own brothers![a]

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
 

Lon

Well-known member
Deuteronomy 5
Spoiler

Deuteronomy 5:5 Moses summoned all Israel and said:

Hear, Israel, the decrees and laws I declare in your hearing today. Learn them and be sure to follow them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. 3 It was not with our ancestors[a] that the Lord made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today. 4 The Lord spoke to you face to face out of the fire on the mountain. 5 (At that time I stood between the Lord and you to declare to you the word of the Lord, because you were afraid of the fire and did not go up the mountain.) And he said:

6 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
7 “You shall have no other gods before[b] me.
8 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 9 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 10 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.
11 “You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.
12 “Observe the Sabbath day by keeping it holy, as the Lord your God has commanded you. 13 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 14 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your ox, your donkey or any of your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns, so that your male and female servants may rest, as you do. 15 Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day.
16 “Honor your father and your mother, as the Lord your God has commanded you, so that you may live long and that it may go well with you in the land the Lord your God is giving you.
17 “You shall not murder.
18 “You shall not commit adultery.
19 “You shall not steal.
20 “You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor.
21 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife. You shall not set your desire on your neighbor’s house or land, his male or female servant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.”
22 These are the commandments the Lord proclaimed in a loud voice to your whole assembly there on the mountain from out of the fire, the cloud and the deep darkness; and he added nothing more. Then he wrote them on two stone tablets and gave them to me.

23 When you heard the voice out of the darkness, while the mountain was ablaze with fire, all the leaders of your tribes and your elders came to me. 24 And you said, “The Lord our God has shown us his glory and his majesty, and we have heard his voice from the fire. Today we have seen that a person can live even if God speaks with them. 25 But now, why should we die? This great fire will consume us, and we will die if we hear the voice of the Lord our God any longer. 26 For what mortal has ever heard the voice of the living God speaking out of fire, as we have, and survived? 27 Go near and listen to all that the Lord our God says. Then tell us whatever the Lord our God tells you. We will listen and obey.”

28 The Lord heard you when you spoke to me, and the Lord said to me, “I have heard what this people said to you. Everything they said was good. 29 Oh, that their hearts would be inclined to fear me and keep all my commands always, so that it might go well with them and their children forever!
 
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