Are you born again (John 3)? Take this test.

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marke

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
John was one of the TWELVE apostles that will sit on TWELVE thrones judging the TWELVE tribes of ISRAEL. John was not writing to the church which is His body... the body of Christ.

I'm not sure what Diotrephes has to do with anything, but he was an unbeliever that opposed John and the twelve.

3John 1:9-10 (AKJV/PCE)​
(1:9) I wrote unto the church: but Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them, receiveth us not. (1:10) Wherefore, if I come, I will remember his deeds which he doeth, prating against us with malicious words: and not content therewith, neither doth he himself receive the brethren, and forbiddeth them that would, and casteth [them] out of the church.​

John spoke to the elect NATION, the nation of Israel.

The term "Christians" is a bit vague and does not accurately describe the divisions that God put in His plans. The "Christian church" for today is the BODY OF CHRIST and not the nation of Israel.

Yours is the confusion that comes when you do not rightly divide the word of truth.

Gal 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)​
(2:9) And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we [should go] unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision. ​

That is a division that God created.
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I just do not see the idea that there is a separate church of born-again Jews that is distinct from the group of non-born-again Christians.
 
Idolater

Idolater

"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
marke said:
I don't totally follow you. I believe Christians are born of the Spirit, but not from birth.

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
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Idolater said:
Is being born again, and being born by the Word, and being born of the Spirit, all the same thing?
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Is being born of God the same as being born again, and being born by the Word, and being born of the Spirit?
 
M

marke

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
Yes... but there are still MANY differences between ISRAEL and the BODY OF CHRIST.

It's too bad that you never read (or at least pay any attention) to anything that I post.
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I'm sorry that I don't have the time to delve into the many sources given to me in my debates, but that is what I have to deal with on my end.
 
Nick M

Nick M

Plymouth Colonist
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Idolater said:
Is being born again, and being born by the Word, and being born of the Spirit, all the same thing?
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Why is word capitalized? And yes, born of the Spirit, resurrected, he will put his life in them. New bodies. Resurrected. The answer is in the text from scripture I posted.
 
Nick M

Nick M

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marke said:
I believe the Lord saved me in 1971. I cannot prove to you that I am saved.
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If you call upon his name, you are saved. My evidence is what comes out of you. Your confession. And the exact verbiage that he saved you. It isn't something you did.
 
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Nick M

Nick M

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marke said:
God instructs born again believers to give diligence to make their calling and election sure so as not to be deceived into dying in their sins while falsely believing they are saved.
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You would have provided scripture. On the contrary, he says they will do his commandments. They will have a glorified body not under Adam's curse of sin and death.
 
Idolater

Idolater

"Matthew 16:18-19" Dispensationalist (Catholic) χρ
Nick M said:
That is kind of an idiot question. Can God make a rock so big he can't lift it?
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You had already answered the question in saying being born of water was just natural birth, so I left it alone.
 
Nick M

Nick M

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Right Divider said:
The term "Christians" is a bit vague
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The Jews were not called Christians. As you know because you read and study, Luke says the disciples were called Christian at Antioch. I think that is Paul and Barnabas.
 
Nick M

Nick M

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marke said:
He never said anything about a third division
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We never said anything about a third division. In the Body of Christ, there is no Jew or gentile. If Paul brought them in, they were no longer a Jew to God. Those are his words, not ours.

Here is the thing. You don't understand the "New Testament" because you didn't first study what happened in the Old Testament. Israel was God's people on earth. He separated them from every one else. Like the rest of humanity, they rebelled and fell. It was so bad they were split into two kingdoms. God through the prophets said Israel will be restored. After 490 years. The prophets (Ezekiel) also said they will be raised up and reunited. They will be one nation again, resurrected, with David ruling over them. And they will not defile themselves with idols any more. Gentiles are not part of this. It is Israel, his people on earth. Nowhere in prophecy does it say my pagan ancestors of western Europe, who had no hope in the world are part of it . Until Israel fell, and God raised up Paul to take grace to the heathens. To drive Israel to jealousy.

What in that very short version of very long story do you reject? It is all from scripture. Except the part about my ancestors.
 
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M

marke

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
If you are unable to have a discussion or debate in this DISCUSSION and DEBATE forum, perhaps you're in the wrong place.
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I hope I can contribute to the debate without having to commit to hours of studying followup materials posted by those who disagree with me.
 
M

marke

Well-known member
Nick M said:
Why is word capitalized? And yes, born of the Spirit, resurrected, he will put his life in them. New bodies. Resurrected. The answer is in the text from scripture I posted.
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I capitalize the "Word" because the Bible said the Word (Jesus) was made flesh and dwelt among us.
 
M

marke

Well-known member
Nick M said:
We never said anything about a third division. In the Body of Christ, there is no Jew or gentile. If Paul brought them in, they were no longer a Jew to God. Those are his words, not ours.

Here is the thing. You don't understand the "New Testament" because you didn't first study what happened in the Old Testament. Israel was God's people on earth. He separated them from every one else. Like the rest of humanity, they rebelled and fell. It was so bad they were split into two kingdoms. God through the prophets said Israel will be restored. After 490 years. The prophets (Ezekiel) also said they will be raised up and reunited. They will be one nation again, resurrected, with David ruling over them. And they will not defile themselves with idols any more. Gentiles are not part of this. It is Israel, his people on earth. Nowhere in prophecy does it say my pagan ancestors of western Europe had no hope in the world. Until Israel fell, and God raised up Paul to take grace to the heathens. To drive Israel to jealousy.

What in that very short version of very long story do you reject? It is all from scripture. Except the part about my ancestors.
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I still see no reason to think the Bible teaches that believing Jews formed a church in the days of the Apostles and that Jewish believers could be born-again of the Spirit in some way not applicable to Gentile converts to Christ.
 
Lon

Lon

Well-known member
marke said:
I still see no reason to think the Bible teaches that believing Jews formed a church in the days of the Apostles and that Jewish believers could be born-again of the Spirit in some way not applicable to Gentile converts to Christ.
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It was mysterious to me at one time as well. It comes from the 'way' one reads the scriptures and with certain filters in mind, involved. "Born again" was something akin to 'born of the Spirit' today in scope, but they are saying that the passage has a narrower scope: Nicodemus and Israel's need to become spiritual in understand and being (correction requested if need be, or further explanation and thanks Mid Acts).
 
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